Quote from: mythusmageOr, a hero who happens to be black, and a villain who happens to be black. Pulp morality was rather (no irony intended) black and white. And yes, Robert's white villains tended to be rather caricatured. Pulp has never been a good place to find rounded characterizations.

The point is that the villainous caricature includes racial stereotypes, but yes, pulp is broad brush stuff.

To be honest, I thought the linked article made solid points, I also don't think this is relevant to the question of whether he was a good writer or not.  However you cut it he wasn't as racist as HPL and HPL is still well worth reading.

Hell, I love Sax Rohmer's Fu Manchu stories, and cut those how you like there is just a tad of stereotyping in them of the Chinese.

Quote from: John MorrowI disagree.  I don't toss around the label "racist" lightly and I'm willing to grant some leniency for the prevailing views of "his time", but I think you should consider this essay:

http://www.rehupa.com/romeo_southern.htm

I have nothing to add but this: if you suckas don't step up and use "Romeo Southern" as a character name in your next pulp game, I sure as hell will.

Quote from: John MorrowI disagree.  I don't toss around the label "racist" lightly and I'm willing to grant some leniency for the prevailing views of "his time", but I think you should consider this essay:

http://www.rehupa.com/romeo_southern.htm

I have nothing to add but this: if you suckas don't step up and use "Romeo Southern" as a character name in your next pulp game, you are blind and stupid.

Quote from: BalbinusMy HEX post reads a bit harsher than I intended, I do think the psychic stuff should have been there, but it is a good game and the decision to focus on one flavour of pulp - the lost world stuff - IMO makes it far more playable than most pulp games.

No worries, Balbinus. It's a valid complaint and I didn't take offense at all. I'm sure a lot of people are waiting to pick up HEX until the rules are published in the Secrets of the Surface World sourcebook.

I couldn't put everything in the game right away (due to book length, printing costs, and development time) but I wanted people to know that psychic abilities and weird science were part of the setting. To that end, I included teasers in the core rulebook as a placeholder and hopefully tide players over until the we published the complete rules. Unfortunately, I didn't quite meet expectations on that one.

I can't change all that now, but I can tell you that I'm hard at work on the sorcery, psychic powers, and weird science rules. People have had to wait for them and I am determined to make it worth the wait. I'm sure there is someone out there just dying to run "The Shadow at the Earth's Core!" and I want to give them the tools to make that happen.

Jeff Combos
President
Exile Game Studio
//www.exilegames.com

Quote from: BalbinusThe point is that the villainous caricature includes racial stereotypes, but yes, pulp is broad brush stuff.

To be honest, I thought the linked article made solid points, I also don't think this is relevant to the question of whether he was a good writer or not.  However you cut it he wasn't as racist as HPL and HPL is still well worth reading.

Hell, I love Sax Rohmer's Fu Manchu stories, and cut those how you like there is just a tad of stereotyping in them of the Chinese.

Here's something to keep in mind, back in those days thugs and brutes were often described in animalistic terms. Hulking apes and the like. The purpose was to contrast the animalistic villain with the heroic exemplar of humanity.

As to Robert's and Howard's racism. A good part of it in both their cases can be laid to their social anxiety. Robert Ervin Howard and Howard Philips Lovecraft were shy. They could be gracious and cultured in company, but both much preferred to avoid going out and mingling with the crowds if they really didn't have to. Lovecraft had a small circle of friends, and it was only late in life that he took up traveling to see the sights. Had he not developed pancreatic cancer it would've been interesting to see how he opened up further.

BTW, H. P. Lovecraft's only literary agent was a Jew. Matter of fact, he died just a few years ago. I remember how the chap talked Howard into taking him on...

Howard: I can't afford these rates.

Agent: With me you will.

Wow, that Conan article on the first page is just really... overblown.  I think I'll save my hyperboles and just say that I didn't really appreciate it and I disagree in many ways.

The fundamental problem, to my mind, is that RPGs, as a medium, tend to be emulative rather than innovative.  Gamers, in many instances, base their stories on the stories they enjoy, so the sessions end up emulating various television shows and movies and books.  Game designers, being gamers themselves, draw from the same context when writing their ideas.  

If you wonder why pulp (or sci fi, or any other genre) of game isn't selling well, ask yourself, "what's really different about this game?"