Quote from: Ratman_tf on January 04, 2023, 03:13:43 AM


(I don't mind the topic. People need to know that there is a dissenting opinion, and they aren't the only ones who see the Emperor Has No Clothes...)

I feel this every time I go to about any fora or video group or whatever. It crops up fucking everywhere now and festers in everything it seems.

Eventually, if we have not had one already, there will be some sociopath declaring that flashlights are sexist tools of the patriarchy because of the shape. You know, like they aimed at swords during the 90s iteration.

Quote from: Warlock on January 04, 2023, 05:18:55 AM

Now I don't remember which game that was, but I think Paizo came up with the concept that demons can be good in Pathfinder 2 ed. No comment here.

Good demons and even good Satan have been a thing long before RPGs. Pops up quite a bit.

Its also a part of some religions and mythologies. In a rare few cases I saw the line between demon and angel were none really. They were horrible monsters sent to torment the wicked. But were not evil. Just very good at their job.

Also OD&D and AD&D allowed for playing monsters. Just had to handle it on a case by case basis. Article in Dragon for BX allowed you to pretty much play anything with a build your own class/race system.

Nothing new really. But you have one faction treating it like its the coming of Christ amd something new. And the other treating it like the spawn of Satan and ignoring that its old hat thats been there from the start.

Quote from: Grognard GM on January 04, 2023, 11:20:06 AMWhen they lost the license for Judge Dredd, not only was the book discontinued, but you can not buy a PDF copy anywhere, and it's even scrubbed from the high seas! If I hadn't once held the book in my hands, I'd swear it was just a fever dream!

I mean, literally my first search for it on the high seas turned it up. It wasn't scrubbed that well.

Quote from: Omega on January 04, 2023, 01:46:12 PM

Quote from: Warlock on January 04, 2023, 05:18:55 AM

Now I don't remember which game that was, but I think Paizo came up with the concept that demons can be good in Pathfinder 2 ed. No comment here.

Good demons and even good Satan have been a thing long before RPGs. Pops up quite a bit.

Its also a part of some religions and mythologies. In a rare few cases I saw the line between demon and angel were none really. They were horrible monsters sent to torment the wicked. But were not evil. Just very good at their job.

Also OD&D and AD&D allowed for playing monsters. Just had to handle it on a case by case basis. Article in Dragon for BX allowed you to pretty much play anything with a build your own class/race system.

Nothing new really. But you have one faction treating it like its the coming of Christ amd something new. And the other treating it like the spawn of Satan and ignoring that its old hat thats been there from the start.

And frankly, between that problem and the "paladin slaughtering orc babies" problem, which are kind of the opposite ends of the alignment flexibility spectrum, I'll take the possibility of good demons every day.

Quote from: Bruwulf on January 04, 2023, 01:49:58 PM

Quote from: Grognard GM on January 04, 2023, 11:20:06 AMWhen they lost the license for Judge Dredd, not only was the book discontinued, but you can not buy a PDF copy anywhere, and it's even scrubbed from the high seas! If I hadn't once held the book in my hands, I'd swear it was just a fever dream!

I mean, literally my first search for it on the high seas turned it up. It wasn't scrubbed that well.

If it was on a site, what might it rhyme with?

Quote from: Bruwulf on January 04, 2023, 01:52:20 PM
And frankly, between that problem and the "paladin slaughtering orc babies" problem, which are kind of the opposite ends of the alignment flexibility spectrum, I'll take the possibility of good demons every day.

  If they're going to do that kind of thing, then could they please stop appropriating my religion and making effigies of a demonic figure? https://www.amazon.com/Funko-Pop-Games-Dungeons-Asmodeus/dp/B07TS8NWT1/

Quote from: honeydipperdavid on January 04, 2023, 11:09:50 AMYou can't get most Dragon Magazines now without pirating, they aren't available for sale on DMs Guild because the fucks don't give a shit about past content, whereas a lot of us do.  The scans on DMs guild have been bad.  I've had to pirate PDF's because the PDF's from the DMsguild weren't usable compared to pirate content, I'd probably be in break because I paid for version 1.3 from DMsguild that sucks but the pirate scan of 1.0 is perfect but its not the same version welcome to US copyright laws. 

The whole thing is beyond frustrating and then they tell you not to buy the old content because its racist, sexist and just wrong man.  Instead comrade, buy our woke communist shit where Orcs are gay and you are dating them to get to level 3, now roll 20 to see whose the top. No thanks.

I remember when they pulled PDFs I "owned" from DTRPG for whatever reason...glad I make multiple backups of everything. Also, I bought the Dragon Magazine Archive in 2000 off a fledgling online book retailer named Amazon. Who knew this was of vital importance?

Quote from: Grognard GM on January 04, 2023, 11:20:06 AM

Quote from: honeydipperdavid on January 04, 2023, 11:09:50 AMYou can't get most Dragon Magazines now without pirating, they aren't available for sale on DMs Guild because the fucks don't give a shit about past content, whereas a lot of us do.  The scans on DMs guild have been bad.  I've had to pirate PDF's because the PDF's from the DMsguild weren't usable compared to pirate content, I'd probably be in break because I paid for version 1.3 from DMsguild that sucks but the pirate scan of 1.0 is perfect but its not the same version welcome to US copyright laws.

This is a slight tangent, because it involves copyright BS rather than Marxist censorship, but I'm reminded of the Judge Dredd And The Worlds Of 2000AD rpg.

When they lost the license for Judge Dredd, not only was the book discontinued, but you can not buy a PDF copy anywhere, and it's even scrubbed from the high seas! If I hadn't once held the book in my hands, I'd swear it was just a fever dream!

It may be a somewhat naïve stance in a world of corporate overlords and copyright bear traps, but I'm of a mind that anything written should be available in some digital format in 2023.

I didn't even think the game was particularly good, but DAMN!

Its WotC calling their old content, of which OSR is derived from in their own leftarded words:

QuoteWe (Wizards) recognize that some of the legacy content available on this website does not reflect the values of the Dungeons & Dragons franchise today. Some older content may reflect ethnic, racial, and gender prejudice that were commonplace in American society at that time. These depictions were wrong then and are wrong today. This content is presented as it was originally created, because to do otherwise would be the same as claiming these prejudices never existed. Dungeons & Dragons teaches that diversity is a strength, and we strive to make our D&D products as welcoming and inclusive as possible. This part of our work will never end.

The more WotC goes insulting towards fans, writers and content, the more they should lose income.  That PBS author has no clue what she's writing and its obvious from her writing.  The same mindset she displayed in her writing is the same mindset WotC used to write that disclaimer on all pre-5E content.

If I had the ability to buy WotC, the first thing I'd do would be to remove that warning and put out a new warning for 5E warning about racism, leftist politics, poor writing and that the new WotC will do better to fix this mess.  And sorry about Spelljammer 5E.

Quote from: honeydipperdavid on January 04, 2023, 03:13:40 PM

Quote from: Grognard GM on January 04, 2023, 11:20:06 AM

Quote from: honeydipperdavid on January 04, 2023, 11:09:50 AMYou can't get most Dragon Magazines now without pirating, they aren't available for sale on DMs Guild because the fucks don't give a shit about past content, whereas a lot of us do.  The scans on DMs guild have been bad.  I've had to pirate PDF's because the PDF's from the DMsguild weren't usable compared to pirate content, I'd probably be in break because I paid for version 1.3 from DMsguild that sucks but the pirate scan of 1.0 is perfect but its not the same version welcome to US copyright laws.

This is a slight tangent, because it involves copyright BS rather than Marxist censorship, but I'm reminded of the Judge Dredd And The Worlds Of 2000AD rpg.

When they lost the license for Judge Dredd, not only was the book discontinued, but you can not buy a PDF copy anywhere, and it's even scrubbed from the high seas! If I hadn't once held the book in my hands, I'd swear it was just a fever dream!

It may be a somewhat naïve stance in a world of corporate overlords and copyright bear traps, but I'm of a mind that anything written should be available in some digital format in 2023.

I didn't even think the game was particularly good, but DAMN!

Its WotC calling their old content, of which OSR is derived from in their own leftarded words:

QuoteWe (Wizards) recognize that some of the legacy content available on this website does not reflect the values of the Dungeons & Dragons franchise today. Some older content may reflect ethnic, racial, and gender prejudice that were commonplace in American society at that time. These depictions were wrong then and are wrong today. This content is presented as it was originally created, because to do otherwise would be the same as claiming these prejudices never existed. Dungeons & Dragons teaches that diversity is a strength, and we strive to make our D&D products as welcoming and inclusive as possible. This part of our work will never end.

The more WotC goes insulting towards fans, writers and content, the more they should lose income.  That PBS author has no clue what she's writing and its obvious from her writing.  The same mindset she displayed in her writing is the same mindset WotC used to write that disclaimer on all pre-5E content.

If I had the ability to buy WotC, the first thing I'd do would be to remove that warning and put out a new warning for 5E warning about racism, leftist politics, poor writing and that the new WotC will do better to fix this mess.  And sorry about Spelljammer 5E.

So basically, they hate everything that made them successful?  Talk about self-loathing.....

Quote from: Warlock on January 04, 2023, 05:18:55 AM
Now I don't remember which game that was, but I think Paizo came up with the concept that demons can be good in Pathfinder 2 ed. No comment here.

I'm not doubting you, but why did they need to come up with a concept.

"Good" demons are called angels. Even if we want to limit to RPGs that's been a concept since at least the mid-90s in the SJG version of In Nomine where each type of angel has their demonic opposite and angels can fall and demons can repent.

Quote from: Grognard GM on January 04, 2023, 11:20:06 AM

Quote from: honeydipperdavid on January 04, 2023, 11:09:50 AMYou can't get most Dragon Magazines now without pirating, they aren't available for sale on DMs Guild because the fucks don't give a shit about past content, whereas a lot of us do.  The scans on DMs guild have been bad.  I've had to pirate PDF's because the PDF's from the DMsguild weren't usable compared to pirate content, I'd probably be in break because I paid for version 1.3 from DMsguild that sucks but the pirate scan of 1.0 is perfect but its not the same version welcome to US copyright laws.

This is a slight tangent, because it involves copyright BS rather than Marxist censorship, but I'm reminded of the Judge Dredd And The Worlds Of 2000AD rpg.

When they lost the license for Judge Dredd, not only was the book discontinued, but you can not buy a PDF copy anywhere, and it's even scrubbed from the high seas! If I hadn't once held the book in my hands, I'd swear it was just a fever dream!

Yet Eden still sells pdfs of the Buffy and Angel games. Others as well, but those are the ones where I know they lost the license over a decade ago. They had a fire sale on print products.

It's weird what gets followed up on and what doesn't.

Then again, the Dragon Archive stepped on the dick of an intellectual property attorney, which is probably why it got noticed. I suspect most of the others whose rights were violated (probably all the artists and most of the authors) wouldn't have realized they'd been screwed.

Quote from: PulpHerb on January 04, 2023, 05:06:38 PM

Quote from: Grognard GM on January 04, 2023, 11:20:06 AM

Quote from: honeydipperdavid on January 04, 2023, 11:09:50 AMYou can't get most Dragon Magazines now without pirating, they aren't available for sale on DMs Guild because the fucks don't give a shit about past content, whereas a lot of us do.  The scans on DMs guild have been bad.  I've had to pirate PDF's because the PDF's from the DMsguild weren't usable compared to pirate content, I'd probably be in break because I paid for version 1.3 from DMsguild that sucks but the pirate scan of 1.0 is perfect but its not the same version welcome to US copyright laws.

This is a slight tangent, because it involves copyright BS rather than Marxist censorship, but I'm reminded of the Judge Dredd And The Worlds Of 2000AD rpg.

When they lost the license for Judge Dredd, not only was the book discontinued, but you can not buy a PDF copy anywhere, and it's even scrubbed from the high seas! If I hadn't once held the book in my hands, I'd swear it was just a fever dream!

Yet Eden still sells pdfs of the Buffy and Angel games. Others as well, but those are the ones where I know they lost the license over a decade ago. They had a fire sale on print products.

It's weird what gets followed up on and what doesn't.

Then again, the Dragon Archive stepped on the dick of an intellectual property attorney, which is probably why it got noticed. I suspect most of the others whose rights were violated (probably all the artists and most of the authors) wouldn't have realized they'd been screwed.

Yeah it just got put on my to buy list now.  I'd rather pay for it than sail the high seas.  Its post TSR acquisition by WotC but still has TSR trade dress.

Frankly, I think this is the appropriate level of reply to the PBS author:

I suspect the real problem lies at the Hasbro level.  Like Disney, Hasbro probably sees itself as primarily selling to families with children and is terrified of bad publicity that might impact sales.

Similarly with D&D rising into the public eye, PBS probably wants to cover their own asses and comment on the transgressive material in earlier D&D systems to buy back some credit with their doner base.

Quote from: David Johansen on January 04, 2023, 08:22:54 PM
I suspect the real problem lies at the Hasbro level.  Like Disney, Hasbro probably sees itself as primarily selling to families with children and is terrified of bad publicity that might impact sales.

Which is ironic, because they push all kinds of ultra far left lunacy that parents HATE.