Palldiums system is very simple.

D20 for combat


% for skill checks


What's not to grasp?

Incoherent, contradictory, incomplete in necessary aspects, non-sensical bits that don't hold up to scrutiny and are not fixed once publicly exposed, etc. with the result that few play it as written because it's nigh-unplayable as-written, which defeats the point of publishing a game with a codified ruleset.

Come on, KrakaJak.  A central die mechanic, or even two dice mechanics, is not the entirety of a system.  Otherwise GURPS and HERO, which both resolve to-hits and skill checks on 3d6, would be the same damn system.

But really, there isn't that much that is complex about Palladiums system.

In general, many of the people complaining about it were just repeating the meme.

In Palladium you roll a d20 to hit. The target number is _4_.

If you roll over a 4, your number becomes the dodge check that the other guy has to roll.

He rolls and adds his dodge check.

Hits come off of SDC first and then hit points. It's just like vitality and wounds, really.

The skills are just percentile based. The main problem with those (pointed out I guess) is that they're irregular. You end with some skills that are +5% per level, and some that are +3% per level, or whatever, and so each level you have to check the book again.

I think the system, does show it's age, and I'm not super fond of percentiles. But one thing it wasn't, was complex.

Dude, the combat alone has about a zillion special cases and rules, all of it is horribly explained, in some cases actualyl scattered across multiple books.  

Any system that makes AD&D1 look like a unified modern design, definitely has some damn problems.  

And yes, I have played the game.  I played nothing but palladium for most of high school.

I've played Palladium products for a couple of decades now, and have been running my Rifts campaign for the past 2 years.

Yeah, the basic mechanic of rolling the dice is easy.  Then again, that's true for every game I've ever seen except Metascape (which feels the need to add a couple levels of multiplication into it for no good reason).

As others have said, the devil is in the details.  There are dozens if not hundreds of special case rules.  Many of these are in supplements.  Many of these are contradictory; even Kevin himself is not consistent on how certain rules are supposed to work.

The problem isn't that the rules are complex, though.  It's that they aren't consistent or well-organized, and clearly are each designed to handle a specific case without any regard for how that will interact with other rules or any thought to making them more generic to cover a broader set of circumstances.

They are very much designed in the same vein as using AD&D 1e with all of the UA, WSG, and DSG supplemental rules.  Only, imagine if 1e kept putting out a couple dozen more books like those supplements.

i dunno, i never had a problem with it.  ran a heroes unlimited (+others) campaign for about a year, and a few one-shots in rifts as well.

There's nothing wrong with Palladium's system unless you're a anal retentive rules lawyer.

It might not be your cup of tea, but there's nothing wrong with the system. You can argue the presentation the rules isn't that great but the rules themselves work just fine.

Quote from: Mcrowcut of tea

The best tea is picked.

I don't think Palladium rules are all that hard, but I like to play GURPS.

Though some Palladium games strike me as books of collected non-sequiturs.

Finally, I don't think I'd like KS on a personal level, but I have a hard time not smiling every time I hear his name or that of his company or any of it's games. If I could have pulled off just a fraction of what he has in gaming, I could die a happy man.

Tangent:  Someone refresh my memory.  Palladium fantasy spell system, spell points or spells per day like D&D?  I seem to be thinking it was spells per day but I can't remember for sure (too many systems, too many years).

Quote from: grubmanTangent:  Someone refresh my memory.  Palladium fantasy spell system, spell points or spells per day like D&D?  I seem to be thinking it was spells per day but I can't remember for sure (too many systems, too many years).

PPE, or spell points, with each spell having it's own cost of points. In RIFTs particularly most spell casters start with fairly substatial pools that grow at a decent rate.

I have never had a problem with the Palladium system.

I think it's actually a pretty simple game to houserule or addend to preferences because little of the systems are interdependant of one another.  It can be a pretty intuitive tool kit game.  With really just a little amount of work you can fine tune the system to your tastes.  I'm not saying you can't play it as is either but you may run across some WTF moments that you may want to address on your own or just run with.

I'll chime in to agree that it isn't that difficult in its most basic form. Like others have said though, it can start to get bogged down with contradictions and special case rules. Eventually it can feel like a big duct taped mess if you aren't careful. Especially with Rifts.

Palladium is totally playable though if you're cool with using a few house rules from time to time and carefully selecting what supplemental material you want to use. Just cherry pick the stuff you like and ignore the rest.

Quote from: KillingMachineI'll chime in to agree that it isn't that difficult in its most basic form. Like others have said though, it can start to get bogged down with contradictions and special case rules. Eventually it can feel like a big duct taped mess if you aren't careful. Especially with Rifts.

Palladium is totally playable though if you're cool with using a few house rules from time to time and carefully selecting what supplemental material you want to use. Just cherry pick the stuff you like and ignore the rest.

QFT