Quote from: Shrieking Banshee on November 05, 2021, 09:48:12 AM

Quote from: Habitual Gamer on November 05, 2021, 09:05:16 AMFurthermore, to be fully honest here, some of the complaints those SJWs have are based around a nugget of truth.

Nope. Its based around a lie, and the reason why SJWs keep getting ground is that people reject the consequences of said lie, but can't reject that lie itself.

Should D&D have more Africa and should 40K have more women? The question should be on the same intelectual calibur as 'Should D&D and 40K have more people in green pants?'.

As long as the lie of 'Diversity and representation are sacrosanct' has been thrust into peoples minds deep enough, then the SJWs will always take that lie to its logical conclusion.

Things canbe diverse or represent groups, for the same reason pants can be green. But in no way it should be seen as somekind of virtue.

I'm surprised the WH40K Tau/subject races hasn't been identified as colonialism and burned as such. Perhaps "Kroot are Africans (or some other group that fared poorly from European colonialism)" hasn't been thrown up...or maybe it has and I just haven't looked.

Quote from: rytrasmi on November 04, 2021, 11:20:00 AM
... "Soul Cage" is utilitarian and dull. "Phalactery" just sounds cool, and I'm sure many people have looked it up and learned something about history, which is a fucking great thing for a game to achieve. ...

And I don't disagree. This is a tempest in a teapot. I'm still confused regularly by why virtual signaling is somehow greater than actual activism (or simply modifying one's perspective and behavior). It's starting to make me giggle when I see it. Like one might when a desperate young pre-pubescent kid is pining for their first love. Heart's in the right place - execution is generally poor.

I also think Phalactery is way cooler than Soul Cage. I'm just pointing out that they likely were not prompted by anyone to change it. This is how the white-knight syndrome works. Guilt leads to anguish, anguish leads to reaching, reaching leads to suffering. I personally believe their heart is in the right place. They want to be more sensitive to peoples' culture. On the tin, that's not a bad thing. But the execution is poor. This is reaching in my opinion, and not really helping anyone.

Instead of renaming everything, why not invite some people of those ethnicities to write a supplement like they did with Mwangi Expanse? That to me is useful activism. Give a voice to people who are might otherwise not have one. Run a sale where a % goes to a good cause. Have the Paizo crew volunteer en-masse for supporting a demonstration (snacks, water, money...) or use their voice to organize funding one. Lots of stuff we can do to help fight for equality.

Changing the name of some magic item in your RPG is likely not one of them.

Quote from: trechriron on November 05, 2021, 02:00:45 PM

Quote from: rytrasmi on November 04, 2021, 11:20:00 AM
... "Soul Cage" is utilitarian and dull. "Phalactery" just sounds cool, and I'm sure many people have looked it up and learned something about history, which is a fucking great thing for a game to achieve. ...

And I don't disagree. This is a tempest in a teapot. I'm still confused regularly by why virtual signaling is somehow greater than actual activism (or simply modifying one's perspective and behavior). It's starting to make me giggle when I see it. Like one might when a desperate young pre-pubescent kid is pining for their first love. Heart's in the right place - execution is generally poor.

I also think Phalactery is way cooler than Soul Cage. I'm just pointing out that they likely were not prompted by anyone to change it. This is how the white-knight syndrome works. Guilt leads to anguish, anguish leads to reaching, reaching leads to suffering. I personally believe their heart is in the right place. They want to be more sensitive to peoples' culture. On the tin, that's not a bad thing. But the execution is poor. This is reaching in my opinion, and not really helping anyone.

Instead of renaming everything, why not invite some people of those ethnicities to write a supplement like they did with Mwangi Expanse? That to me is useful activism. Give a voice to people who are might otherwise not have one. Run a sale where a % goes to a good cause. Have the Paizo crew volunteer en-masse for supporting a demonstration (snacks, water, money...) or use their voice to organize funding one. Lots of stuff we can do to help fight for equality.

Changing the name of some magic item in your RPG is likely not one of them.

So, sensitivity readers and/or racial segregation on culture.
What's stoping those people that "might not have a voice" from doing their stuff? Is there any law or rule where they can't do their own stuff unless it's as wage slaves for Paizo/WotC/etc?
I agree on donating money to a good cause, but I don't think my definition of a good cause coincides with yours. For instance Burn Loot Murder isn't a good cause and never was.
Demonstrations... For or against what? Not all demonstrations/causes are created equal.
Equality... I think you really mean equity or equal outcomes...  "Human beings are born with different capacities. If they are free, they are not equal. And if they are equal, they are not free."

Edited to add:

I do agree that it's pure virtue signaling, I disagree they have their hearts in the right place, because they have drunk the CRT koolaid.

Quote from: trechriron on November 05, 2021, 02:00:45 PMThat to me is useful activism. Give a voice to people who are might otherwise not have one.

So 95% of the planet? I reject the notion that 'Pity Representation' is based in a sound or good ethics system.
You cannot represent all the unheard voices. You can decide that some of them are 'pure' and then grant them money and status based off of internal whims. Its a toxic and evil philosophy.

Quote from: Shrieking Banshee on November 05, 2021, 02:22:51 PM

Quote from: trechriron on November 05, 2021, 02:00:45 PMThat to me is useful activism. Give a voice to people who are might otherwise not have one.

So 95% of the planet? I reject the notion that 'Pity Representation' is based in a sound or good ethics system.
You cannot represent all the unheard voices. You can decide that some of them are 'pure' and then grant them money and status based off of internal whims. Its a toxic and evil philosophy.

"Activism is a way for useless people to feel important" Thomas Sowell

Greetings!

Hmmm..."Equality"? Equality in what? And Equality for whom?

What does "Equality" have to do with RPG's? Or RPG publishing? What does "Equality" have to do with a company using the term of Phylactery?

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: SHARK on November 05, 2021, 04:37:09 PM
Greetings!

Hmmm..."Equality"? Equality in what? And Equality for whom?

What does "Equality" have to do with RPG's? Or RPG publishing? What does "Equality" have to do with a company using the term of Phylactery?

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Obviously Liches of Colour can not afford to get a real Phylactery because of systemic Lich oppression so forcing everyone to use Soul Cages enables everyone who wants to be a Lich to fulfill their potential.

Finally Equality.

There's a Soul Train joke in here somewhere, I'm sure of it...

Quote from: Shrieking Banshee on November 04, 2021, 07:08:59 PM
Dictionary definitions for linguistic debates is a stupid thing to do.

Yep.

Quote from: Pat on November 05, 2021, 08:00:59 PM

Quote from: Shrieking Banshee on November 04, 2021, 07:08:59 PM
Dictionary definitions for linguistic debates is a stupid thing to do.

Yep.

Haha,


Wut? 

I have to admit, some voices here are making good sense. I do find the hand-wringing to be overly dramatic. I'm one of those bleeding-heart types that wants to see the good in people.

Equality or equity is a good clarification. I like that. I am seeking equity. Where everyone has an equal opportunity.

I didn't mean to suggest people should force others to adopt their language. I don't agree with that at all. And changing the term to "Soul Cage" was a poor choice IMHO. Everyone should just call it "Phylactery" and ignore the virtue signaling. Paizo can't MAKE you change what you call it.

The rest of the sabre rattling here about CRT, communism, and conspiracy theories about SJWs taking our RPGs I will leave for a discussion elsewhere in the forum. 

Quote from: trechriron on November 05, 2021, 10:17:32 PM
I have to admit, some voices here are making good sense. I do find the hand-wringing to be overly dramatic. I'm one of those bleeding-heart types that wants to see the good in people.

Equality or equity is a good clarification. I like that. I am seeking equity. Where everyone has an equal opportunity.

I didn't mean to suggest people should force others to adopt their language. I don't agree with that at all. And changing the term to "Soul Cage" was a poor choice IMHO. Everyone should just call it "Phylactery" and ignore the virtue signaling. Paizo can't MAKE you change what you call it.

The rest of the sabre rattling here about CRT, communism, and conspiracy theories about SJWs taking our RPGs I will leave for a discussion elsewhere in the forum. 

Bolding mine:

"Equal opportunity" to do what? to be what? I'm dead serious, how are you going to get that when humans are born with different capacities?

Is equity to put racial/sexual/etc quotas on hiring? How is that not open racial/sexual/etc discrimination?

How are you going to know when said equality of opportunity has been achieved?

Lets take TTRPGs as an example, do you agree there are too many white straight males developing/playing them?

Are you aware of the equality paradox? The experiment has been done, the more free/equal a society is the more the differences in interest are amplified.

Back to TTRPGs, besides improving the education for ALL there's exactly zero you can do to have more of X developing the games, besides running games for people for free on ( I dunno, your public library?) where you bring the dice for everyone and let them keep em plus giving them the books there's exactly zero you can do to have more of X playing the games.

What's the correct number of stronk independent wahmen that don't need no fish developing/playing TTRPGs?

What's the correct number of blacks, latinos, etc developing/playing TTRPGs?

Are you aware that in the black comunities in the USA certain activities are seen as "acting white"? There's a societal pressure from other blacks in the community not to engage in those activities. How are you going to change that?

As far as I'm aware there's not a single law (that's being enforced in current day) on the books in the USA (and all the west) that discriminates against women/blacks/latinos/etc. Quite the opposite, it's illegal to do so.

And yet we still have mostly straight white males (puagh!) developing/playing TTRPGs.

Could that be because of a difference in interests?

Or can you point to evidence of discrimination?

Quote from: GeekyBugle on November 05, 2021, 03:00:48 PM

Quote from: Shrieking Banshee on November 05, 2021, 02:22:51 PM

Quote from: trechriron on November 05, 2021, 02:00:45 PMThat to me is useful activism. Give a voice to people who are might otherwise not have one.

So 95% of the planet? I reject the notion that 'Pity Representation' is based in a sound or good ethics system.
You cannot represent all the unheard voices. You can decide that some of them are 'pure' and then grant them money and status based off of internal whims. Its a toxic and evil philosophy.

"Activism is a way for useless people to feel important" Thomas Sowell

He ain't wrong...  The good Dr. Sowell needs way more exposure in schools because he's *never* not been correct in his observations.

Quote from: trechriron on November 05, 2021, 10:17:32 PM
I have to admit, some voices here are making good sense. I do find the hand-wringing to be overly dramatic. I'm one of those bleeding-heart types that wants to see the good in people.

Equality or equity is a good clarification. I like that. I am seeking equity. Where everyone has an equal opportunity.

I didn't mean to suggest people should force others to adopt their language. I don't agree with that at all. And changing the term to "Soul Cage" was a poor choice IMHO. Everyone should just call it "Phylactery" and ignore the virtue signaling. Paizo can't MAKE you change what you call it.

The rest of the sabre rattling here about CRT, communism, and conspiracy theories about SJWs taking our RPGs I will leave for a discussion elsewhere in the forum. 

Except it's not about that.  It's about people who have nothing important to contribute shouting "look at me," like the attention whores that they are.

Instead of kowtowing to their ridiculous demands (which beget nothing more than even more ridiculous demands), people need to grow a backbone and bluntly and publicly tell them to mind their own fucking business. There are people out there who have real grievances - these aren't those people.  Most of these activist SJW types are nothing more than butt-hurt whiny cunts who deserve nothing but our derision.

Quote from: trechriron on November 05, 2021, 02:00:45 PM
Instead of renaming everything, why not invite some people of those ethnicities to write a supplement?

That's the most racist suggestion I've heard all week ... and I even read the news yesterday!

"Are you one of those ethnicities? We need more of you people to write games for us."

"Some of our best game designers are Jews!"