When do you guys do morale checks for monsters in OD&D style games?
The system I'm using is Labyrinth Lord, but I don't find the morale guidelines for when to make a check to be especially clear or compelling. What system do you find works best in play?
I don't normally use osr, but they way I handle morale is to check for w things: how many allies have gone down and are there any authority figures around. Those factors determine the difficulty. Either I roll or I have a player roll a d20. If lots are dead and so are the commanders, rolling anything below a 10 makes the enemies run. I kinda eyeball a lot of the target numbers, so it's probably not exactly what you're looking for.
B/X is the gold standard. Morale is checked in "critical combat situations", and two examples are provided:
1. After the side's first death
2. When 1/2 the monsters have been incapacitated
Dirt simple. You can break when your side's been bloodied, or when you're in dire straights. But if you make two checks, you'll fight to the death. The best way to handle "critical combat situations" is to let it be player driven -- let them come up with situations that could force an early morale check.
Other systems, like the one in 2e, are way too complex and hard to remember. Morale needs to be simple, with clear conditions but room for player creativity.
Simple is best?
LoFP tests at encounter (if the enemy group does not outnumber the PCs) and when they lose 50% of their numbers.
MORK BORG is at 50% losses and when the leader is killed, plus individually at 1/3 of HP.
Just reading Grim Jim's "Machinations of the Space Princess" now (having acquired it recently), and Morale is tested every time they drop to 50% (from the prior 50% loss condition, I assume).
I like 50% losses, in general. That is a nice, simple number. I like the concept of MORK BORG: when leader is killed (if there is a leader figure). Individually at 1/3 HP might be too much dice and calculations?
Thanks for the replies. I'll extend the question to ask whether you roll morale checks individually or for the entire opposing force at once.
It looks like the answers so far tend towards the latter.
There's options in individual Monster vs. Group, but I lean towards Group (instead of a bucket of dice).
Fewer dice rolls is better, IMO.
Dice are important, and should be important. Rolling too many times diminishes the importance.
I think individual morale is best represented by hit points. Hit points are an abstract measure, that includes the will to fight. Most people who are "down", or out of a real world combat, aren't dead, they're in shock. That's why most wargames have rules about the number of survivors after a figure is lost.
In my hybrid (some old school influence, but not entirely old school), I'm checking morale based on the same groupings used in initiative. Which means usually 1 to 3 monster groups, depending on the numbers and composition of the monsters, with most encounters being 1 to 2 monster groups. Each group checks independently according to the "lose a member in the fight" or half the group down. Then I have the added rule if a group breaks, the other groups check the next round. A notable leader monster could be in a group by itself, but otherwise follows what I listed.
As always, those are the rough parameters. I'm really checking when it makes sense for me to do so, based on what I know about the monsters and the situation, with some hanging on longer and others checking more frequently if they aren't very motivated. If that first individual goes out of the fight in a "non messy" way (knocked unconscious, sleep spell) then I might not check. If that first individual takes a really nasty critical that doesn't quite but almost takes him out of the fight, that might cause the "first individual goes down" check. I also take into account how aggressive/intimidating the PCs are acting.
The system can be rather brutal. So I've also got limited morale rules on the player side. There are PCs, companions, and associates (read the latter as any henchman not a companion and everyone else). All non PCs are associated with a PC. If the circumstances dictate a morale check on that side, the affected PCs roll. Associates that fail act more or less as the monsters do. PCs and companions that fail can still do anything they want. However, if they do anything but parlay, flee, surrender, hide, or some similar evasive action, they have disadvantage to all other actions until such time as they succeed in one or another PCs rallies the group. This is my way of leaving the decision in the hands of the players but accounting for the character being shook.
I tend to eyeball it, like Hzilong, but 50% casualties or leader going down are good guidelines for when to roll for group morale. Dropping an enemy below 50% or so heath from a single hit, or bringing them to around 80% or less health over the course of combat is a good guideline for individual morale.
EDIT: nevermind, I thought we were talking about the reaction table for a moment.
I usually eyeball it. Ordinary monsters fight until it becomes obvious they will lose, while demons, undead, the insane, etc., probably fight to the death.
Here are some excerpts from Teratogenicon:
---
Morale starts at 7 and may be raised for powerful
creatures, with no exact proportion to HD. Automatons,
oozes and undead are the only types of monster to often
have morale 11 or even 12 (which usually means a mindless
creature that will fight to the death). However, in Dark
Fantasy Basic monsters will only check morale when they
face difficult situations (losing a single hit point does not
make an ogre check for morale, but facing a dozen armored
knights might).
----
When to stop fighting
Even if the monsters do get into a fight, they are not
necessarily fighting to the death (unless their goals would
force them to do that). Most people and animals will
surrender or flee after taking enough wounds, unless their
side is obviously winning. This cuts both ways – most
monsters will accept surrender and will stop fighting
as soon as they get what they want. A strong, hungry
monster will pursue fleeing foes, but might give up if they
drop food, while a greedy monster might be attracted by
gold, and so on.
Once again, some monsters are more likely to fight to
the bitter end. Mindless undead, bloodthirsty demons and
guardian automatons are but a few examples.
---
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/317448/Teratogenicon
For OD&D, I use a system based on Chainmail.
Chainmail has checks at 25%, 33% or 50% based on troop type. Levies check at 25%, mounted knights at 50%. Heavy foot soldiers check at 33% (iirc). The number to stay using 2d6 improves (by decreasing) based on troop type. The levies mentioned above would need an 8+ to stay, the mounted knights 4+. If successful, they are 'resolved' to fight until they sustain subsequent losses that would trigger the original check.
Example: Eight bandits—Morale 8 (25%), attack the players. Two are killed in the first round, triggering a roll. They roll a 9 and are resolved to continue fighting. The next round, a third bandit falls. This is only 12% of the original number, so no roll is triggered. Two rounds later, a fourth falls and a new roll is required.
Adding morale is just part of the prep. But it is a necessary part of OD&D, otherwise you are placing your players into a blender.
- Animals and unintelligent beasts typically do not have morale, and flee when hit hard enough to kill an average person (4+ damage). However, they never flee if backed into a corner or defending their young. This includes mundane beasts such as bears and wolves, as well as the fantastic, such as the cockatrice and basilisk.
- Unintelligent undead, such as skeletons and zombies, never flee unless turned.
- Monsters generally do not check morale if defending their lair/treasure hoard. Highly intelligent and powerful monsters are possible exceptions.
- Highly intelligent and powerful monsters will have a higher check threshold, maybe 75%, but due to their age and power are more likely to choose survival. A dragon encountered randomly in the woods might have Morale 10 (75%). Once it loses 75% of its hit points, it needs a 10+ on 2d6 to stay. Why risk death in the woods when you have a hoard back home?
Those are the general highlights. It sounds like a lot, but it becomes second nature. Those numbers from CM are from memory and could be off, but they should be directionally accurate.
I also use the system from Chainmail, in both my original D&D and AD&D (1e) games. Once learned, it's fast and easy. 1e AD&D has its own morale system, but I prefer the older approach in actual play.
Quote from: Manzanaro on May 28, 2022, 12:00:25 AM
Thanks for the replies. I'll extend the question to ask whether you roll morale checks individually or for the entire opposing force at once.
I almost always do group roll. I also adjust their actions based on the roll. If they really blow the roll, they turn and flee, but if they just miss their morale by a point or two, I have them conduct a fighting withdrawal. Anything to add some variety to how a combat plays out.
I roll for the entire group when (1) they take their first loss (unless they have a leader in which case I check when he goes down) and (2) when the group has lost half their number. If the encounter is with a single powerful creature, I check when it is at half hp.
Morale systems should begin with the concept that living beings don't want to die.
Then the GM should judge the individual circumstances.
Also, failing morale doesn't automatically mean fleeing for intelligent foes. It could mean falling back to a defended zone, or stepping back to parlay in a defensive stance.