Quote from: trechriron on Today at 03:06:02 PM

Quote from: Eirikrautha on November 13, 2024, 10:11:08 PMSo, unless you have some evidence not readily available to the rest of us, you'll need to find something that can prove the "woke" customer is more numerous and spends more money than the traditional RPG consumer.  Otherwise, there is no justification (as in economic, not political) for the behavior of WotC.  And there is no justification at all for consumers to remain queit, regardless of their numbers.

I said no such thing. I don't need evidence for my argument; please pay attention to what I'm saying. I don't care about their numbers, and neither should you. Why do you fucking care about a company that doesn't care about you? Put your money where your mouth is!

If we were talking about the availability of air on a Mars colony, access to clean water or life-saving medicine, I agree 100%. I would stand right by you and protest. But RPGs?!?!

Who fucking cares. There are WAY too many awesome games out there that don't cater to a loud, woke minority to care how WOTC is churning out shit sauce.

Gaming should be for fun, not for political discourse. Allowing the culture war to dominate the conversation ultimately is a self-sabotaging, self-loathing road to ruin. It seems all too common now for a thread here to devolve into "Poor me, the libtard woke creators lit my face on fire." or worse, "A call to arms! Kill all the woke libtards!" Hah! I have no time to start a war, and I'm pretty sure you don't either.

This forum represented a generally level-headed group of enthusiasts who looked at the "woke" diaspora and laughed. It was like hanging out with a group of adult friends, giggling under their breath while the toddlers sitting in front of us argued about who gets to play with the legos. Sure, it was all nonsense while imagined slights were committed in the minds of the hand-wringers. What can you do? Have any of the arguments, coordinated trolling, or angry protests did anything to change it? Nope. TheRPGsite is floating in a pool of our piss with literally nothing to show for it except a bunch of angry old dudes drinking piss together. Hence the ask--stop taking a piss.

All this culture war stuff is exhausting. It's ruining our hobby. I want to read threads about the fucking cool shit you love. What are you playing? What are you creating? Link me! I buy a lot of stuff. I'll buy your stuff. Please show me what I could be playing besides WOTC D&D.

This forum exist because most of the members have been banned or shunned on other forums.

It's always going to default to culture war. Also Pundit uses outrage to keep this thing going. It's what gets clicks.

Quote from: trechriron on November 13, 2024, 02:53:32 PMYou are not the target audience. WOTC D&D will find its audience and sell plenty of books to people who want this approach.

Will they?

Movies, Tv, DC/MARVEL comics, and now video games have shown that 'this approach' will eventually cause the audience and fans to turn away.

In my opinion D&D has not reached that tipping point yet, but they are on their way to doing so.

Quote from: trechriron on Today at 03:06:02 PM

Quote from: Eirikrautha on November 13, 2024, 10:11:08 PMSo, unless you have some evidence not readily available to the rest of us, you'll need to find something that can prove the "woke" customer is more numerous and spends more money than the traditional RPG consumer.  Otherwise, there is no justification (as in economic, not political) for the behavior of WotC.  And there is no justification at all for consumers to remain queit, regardless of their numbers.

I said no such thing. I don't need evidence for my argument; please pay attention to what I'm saying. I don't care about their numbers, and neither should you. Why do you fucking care about a company that doesn't care about you? Put your money where your mouth is!

If we were talking about the availability of air on a Mars colony, access to clean water or life-saving medicine, I agree 100%. I would stand right by you and protest. But RPGs?!?!

Who fucking cares. There are WAY too many awesome games out there that don't cater to a loud, woke minority to care how WOTC is churning out shit sauce.

Gaming should be for fun, not for political discourse. Allowing the culture war to dominate the conversation ultimately is a self-sabotaging, self-loathing road to ruin. It seems all too common now for a thread here to devolve into "Poor me, the libtard woke creators lit my face on fire." or worse, "A call to arms! Kill all the woke libtards!" Hah! I have no time to start a war, and I'm pretty sure you don't either.

This forum represented a generally level-headed group of enthusiasts who looked at the "woke" diaspora and laughed. It was like hanging out with a group of adult friends, giggling under their breath while the toddlers sitting in front of us argued about who gets to play with the legos. Sure, it was all nonsense while imagined slights were committed in the minds of the hand-wringers. What can you do? Have any of the arguments, coordinated trolling, or angry protests did anything to change it? Nope. TheRPGsite is floating in a pool of our piss with literally nothing to show for it except a bunch of angry old dudes drinking piss together. Hence the ask--stop taking a piss.

All this culture war stuff is exhausting. It's ruining our hobby. I want to read threads about the fucking cool shit you love. What are you playing? What are you creating? Link me! I buy a lot of stuff. I'll buy your stuff. Please show me what I could be playing besides WOTC D&D.

First of all, if you care about the hobby, then you care about the fate of D&D, because, sadly, to most people it is the hobby.  We can stop this in two ways: speaking out about what is wrong and encouraging others to play what is good.  They both go hand-in-hand.  If we don't push back, new players to the hobby don't ever know there is something different, other ways to play.  You may be satisfied in playing in a ever-shrinking hobby for your remaining years, but that isn't enough for many of us.  I want my kids and grandkids (both of which I have) to experience the same kind of imagination, joy, and interaction that I had playing the game when it was young.  I don't want them to grow up where RPGs means BDSM safe-words and Mexican orcs.  So, I point out what is wrong and I promote and play what is good.  I'm running a high school-based RPG club with over 50 students in almost a dozen different student-lead campaigns (plus the one that I run there for new players and aspiring DMs).  What exactly are you doing to preserve and grow the hobby?  Or are your concerns just selfish and personal?

In fact, why haven't you posted any of the threads that you want to read?  Why is it someone else's job to post them here?  Be the change you want.  But it's easier to complain (about other people complaining, ironically) than it is to do something positive and productive, I guess...

Quote from: Eirikrautha on Today at 06:57:49 PM

Quote from: trechriron on Today at 03:06:02 PM

Quote from: Eirikrautha on November 13, 2024, 10:11:08 PMSo, unless you have some evidence not readily available to the rest of us, you'll need to find something that can prove the "woke" customer is more numerous and spends more money than the traditional RPG consumer.  Otherwise, there is no justification (as in economic, not political) for the behavior of WotC.  And there is no justification at all for consumers to remain queit, regardless of their numbers.

I said no such thing. I don't need evidence for my argument; please pay attention to what I'm saying. I don't care about their numbers, and neither should you. Why do you fucking care about a company that doesn't care about you? Put your money where your mouth is!

If we were talking about the availability of air on a Mars colony, access to clean water or life-saving medicine, I agree 100%. I would stand right by you and protest. But RPGs?!?!

Who fucking cares. There are WAY too many awesome games out there that don't cater to a loud, woke minority to care how WOTC is churning out shit sauce.

Gaming should be for fun, not for political discourse. Allowing the culture war to dominate the conversation ultimately is a self-sabotaging, self-loathing road to ruin. It seems all too common now for a thread here to devolve into "Poor me, the libtard woke creators lit my face on fire." or worse, "A call to arms! Kill all the woke libtards!" Hah! I have no time to start a war, and I'm pretty sure you don't either.

This forum represented a generally level-headed group of enthusiasts who looked at the "woke" diaspora and laughed. It was like hanging out with a group of adult friends, giggling under their breath while the toddlers sitting in front of us argued about who gets to play with the legos. Sure, it was all nonsense while imagined slights were committed in the minds of the hand-wringers. What can you do? Have any of the arguments, coordinated trolling, or angry protests did anything to change it? Nope. TheRPGsite is floating in a pool of our piss with literally nothing to show for it except a bunch of angry old dudes drinking piss together. Hence the ask--stop taking a piss.

All this culture war stuff is exhausting. It's ruining our hobby. I want to read threads about the fucking cool shit you love. What are you playing? What are you creating? Link me! I buy a lot of stuff. I'll buy your stuff. Please show me what I could be playing besides WOTC D&D.

First of all, if you care about the hobby, then you care about the fate of D&D, because, sadly, to most people it is the hobby.  We can stop this in two ways: speaking out about what is wrong and encouraging others to play what is good.  They both go hand-in-hand.  If we don't push back, new players to the hobby don't ever know there is something different, other ways to play.  You may be satisfied in playing in a ever-shrinking hobby for your remaining years, but that isn't enough for many of us.  I want my kids and grandkids (both of which I have) to experience the same kind of imagination, joy, and interaction that I had playing the game when it was young.  I don't want them to grow up where RPGs means BDSM safe-words and Mexican orcs.  So, I point out what is wrong and I promote and play what is good.  I'm running a high school-based RPG club with over 50 students in almost a dozen different student-lead campaigns (plus the one that I run there for new players and aspiring DMs).

You're doing Gods work!