Quote from: HappyDaze;967932I've never been in a game where a snake budget was required, but I think I might want to be.

Well for us its just that he was physically picking them up and we where paying back the cost its also worth pointing out we where literally playing for A 10ish hour stretch so you needed to eat some time in there.

Quote from: Willie the Duck;967934There's a certain... I don't even know what to call it... acceptable level of bending the norms during that whole college part of your life where those with $ occasionally supplement those without simply because they want their company. You'd worry about what it encourages, except you all know that it's not going to continue. My current gaming group has one 20 y.o. right now who works part time as a cable installer or something while the rest of us are all 40 y.o.+and at various levels of tech- and healthcare- industry professionals. It's an unstated norm that this guy doesn't contribute to the snacks and usually gets a ride, simply because otherwise he wouldn't be there. If this were the case in five years time, the same guy would be a mooch and the supplementing simply wouldn't happen.

I don't know exactly what I'm saying, except maybe that I don't think one can extrapolate too much from that scenario to a more broad pay-to-play scenario.

Where I come from its called extenuating circumstances and its understood  that it can happen at any time in your life.

Quote from: kosmos1214;968086Where I come from its called extenuating circumstances and its understood  that it can happen at any time in your life.

Fair enough. I still stand by the point that I wouldn't extrapolate it to paid-gamer-as-job.

Quote from: Willie the Duck;968180Fair enough. I still stand by the point that I wouldn't extrapolate it to paid-gamer-as-job.

Fair.

RPG.net apparently can't distinguish between an exposé and a hit piece.  Apparently criticizing OPP is now akin to sexual assault, or some other type of convoluted logic I can't follow.

https://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?805320-A-History-of-EX(posure)-3rd-Edition-thread

Quote from: Lord Darkview;968657RPG.net apparently can't distinguish between an exposé and a hit piece.  Apparently criticizing OPP is now akin to sexual assault, or some other type of convoluted logic I can't follow.

https://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?805320-A-History-of-EX(posure)-3rd-Edition-thread

"So, several brave staff members put the time in to listen to the entire podcast. This is a burden I can't overstate.

Like, what I'm saying is kind of funny, but it's not a joke. We're talking an hour and a half here."

Such martyrdom.

"Tell you what, though. One of these days I am going to snap and start infracting people for claiming that game writers/devs/et cetera are paid too much and are just cashing in at the expense of the fans. It's not my job to determine that it's factually wrong (although it is), but it is toxic to the hobby and I'd love to put an end to it. "

Huh. Last I looked, the claims were that OP wasn't paying devs and writers. That's some pretty strong spin to rewrite the claims as saying that devs and writers were being overpaid.

Quote from: Baulderstone;968662"So, several brave staff members put the time in to listen to the entire podcast. This is a burden I can't overstate.

Like, what I'm saying is kind of funny, but it's not a joke. We're talking an hour and a half here."

Such martyrdom.

Nailing themselves to crosses is the mods favorite hobby over there, particularly when he's not electronically cosplaying Cartman.

Quote from: Baulderstone;968662"So, several brave staff members put the time in to listen to the entire podcast. This is a burden I can't overstate.

Like, what I'm saying is kind of funny, but it's not a joke. We're talking an hour and a half here."

Such martyrdom.

"Tell you what, though. One of these days I am going to snap and start infracting people for claiming that game writers/devs/et cetera are paid too much and are just cashing in at the expense of the fans. It's not my job to determine that it's factually wrong (although it is), but it is toxic to the hobby and I'd love to put an end to it. "

Huh. Last I looked, the claims were that OP wasn't paying devs and writers. That's some pretty strong spin to rewrite the claims as saying that devs and writers were being overpaid.

You know damn well that the big purple now just shafted Holden, Hatewheel, and David A. Hill Jr.  Yeah just completely ignore their plight and hope that Rich Thomas doesn't fuck you in the ass like how Holden found out.  Which by the way he will.

Wow.

I wonder how much you can continue to bash on Palladium Books over there for doing the same stuff as OPP, because that's been allowed for years (over a decade now?).

Funny thing... if this thread is any evidence, people would've gotten bored and moved on in short order if they'd been allowed to talk it out.  "OPP is crooked... but I like/already hate their games, so... enh."  Again, look at Palladium Books.  

So, does this mean Zak S. hit threads are now verboten too?  I mean, it's just as much "he said/he said" cross forum hit piece drama as the OPP stuff.  I kid, I kid.  I know the threads won't be mod locked, because Zak S. doesn't ever hire any of the mod staff there.

And Jesus H. Christ you poor TBP mods... forget the fucking podcast.  I couldn't listen to one for over twenty seconds, let alone over an hour.  I can read all the screen grabs of the multiple people saying variations of the same thing though, and in a lot less time.

(and for the record: I -do- believe FVB when he said he was treated fairly and professionally by OPP.  That doesn't mean everyone else was though, or that Holden and the others didn't have valid grievances, but he felt the need to support OPP with a counter point and I do believe him.)

Ive never heard of Palladium not paying freelancers? Just that Kev is really mercurial to work with.

Quote from: Omega;968755Ive never heard of Palladium not paying freelancers? Just that Kev is really mercurial to work with.

Fair enough.

Palladium's main shtick was to say "we'll pay you 3-7 cents a word" to a freelancer.  Freelancer hears "I can make 7 cents a word!!!" and Kevin intends to pay only 3.  I get the impression that similar was happening with OPP, but I admit I could be wrong.

Still, it's a fair comparison regarding how TPB tolerates people bashing on other publishers and not OPP.

Quote from: san dee jota;968763Palladium's main shtick was to say "we'll pay you 3-7 cents a word" to a freelancer.  Freelancer hears "I can make 7 cents a word!!!" and Kevin intends to pay only 3.

Business 101/Contracts 101: GET IT IN WRITING...otherwise the agreement isn't worth the paper it's printed on.

Quote from: Lord Darkview;968657RPG.net apparently can't distinguish between an exposé and a hit piece.  Apparently criticizing OPP is now akin to sexual assault, or some other type of convoluted logic I can't follow.

https://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?805320-A-History-of-EX(posure)-3rd-Edition-thread

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My general opinion of TBP is pretty low at this point. But it doesn't surprise me that they keep shutting down conversations that they don't like. They have done it to me in the past.

I will say this flat out. I believe TBP is anti-consumer. They do not want consumers having a voice there. The speech has to be flowery and positive. Or it doesn't get to exist at all.

My last ban there was due to standing up to a troll. And telling that troll in no uncertain terms. That they don't have the right to dictate what sort of opinions I am to have. That they aren't my thought police. And that I wouldn't just sit back and take that sort of treatment.

As for the cWoD. Well to be honest. A lot of it I consider it to be complete pile of hot garbage. The developers seem to believe that the stories of their characters are the most important thing. Instead of giving the tools to a storyteller up front to actually take and make the game their own.

The tools to do that have always been set aside in a drawn out manner through tons of sourcebooks. Where you would get tons of prose. And very sparse helpful information for actually running new aspects of the games they introduced.

So no. I don't believe they made competent rulebooks at all in the first place.

That's my opinion. Take it as you will.

Quote from: Darrin Kelley;969098My general opinion of TBP is pretty low at this point. But it doesn't surprise me that they keep shutting down conversations that they don't like. They have done it to me in the past.

I will say this flat out. I believe TBP is anti-consumer. They do not want consumers having a voice there. The speech has to be flowery and positive. Or it doesn't get to exist at all.

My last ban there was due to standing up to a troll. And telling that troll in no uncertain terms. That they don't have the right to dictate what sort of opinions I am to have. That they aren't my thought police. And that I wouldn't just sit back and take that sort of treatment.

As for the cWoD. Well to be honest. A lot of it I consider it to be complete pile of hot garbage. The developers seem to believe that the stories of their characters are the most important thing. Instead of giving the tools to a storyteller up front to actually take and make the game their own.

The tools to do that have always been set aside in a drawn out manner through tons of sourcebooks. Where you would get tons of prose. And very sparse helpful information for actually running new aspects of the games they introduced.

So no. I don't believe they made competent rulebooks at all in the first place.

That's my opinion. Take it as you will.

You do realize this party over *here*, has been bumping for years because the party over *there* sucks for all the reasons you cited and much, much more? And thus we drink deeply and merrily (usually). /tink

Quote from: Darrin Kelley;969098My general opinion of TBP is pretty low at this point. But it doesn't surprise me that they keep shutting down conversations that they don't like. They have done it to me in the past.

I will say this flat out. I believe TBP is anti-consumer. They do not want consumers having a voice there. The speech has to be flowery and positive. Or it doesn't get to exist at all.

My last ban there was due to standing up to a troll. And telling that troll in no uncertain terms. That they don't have the right to dictate what sort of opinions I am to have. That they aren't my thought police. And that I wouldn't just sit back and take that sort of treatment.

As for the cWoD. Well to be honest. A lot of it I consider it to be complete pile of hot garbage. The developers seem to believe that the stories of their characters are the most important thing. Instead of giving the tools to a storyteller up front to actually take and make the game their own.

The tools to do that have always been set aside in a drawn out manner through tons of sourcebooks. Where you would get tons of prose. And very sparse helpful information for actually running new aspects of the games they introduced.

So no. I don't believe they made competent rulebooks at all in the first place.

That's my opinion. Take it as you will.

Meh, TBP is largely run by Goths and Communists, such as Black Hat Matt and Darren MacLerran (who goes by a different username now).

When it comes to WoD, I say fuck the themes, fuck the canon, and above all else, FUCK THE GOTH SUBCULTURE!

Personal Horror sucks ass. Bring on the trenchcoats and katanas!

Anime Rules, Marvel and DC suck.

Goths and Punks fuck off!