WoTC says they're abolishing "Race" from D&D, exactly what the Wokists demanded. In response, wokists (including Wizard employees) accuse them of being "oppressors".
#dnd #dnd5e #ttrpg #osr #OneDnD
I was so outraged by the Biological Essentialism, that I wrote WOTC a strongly worded complaint letter.
As I wanted it there fast, I had my friend from Jamaica run it to the post office. The Samoan mailman said they'd had a lot of similar letters, then he threw the massive sack over his shoulder and was on his way.
I have to wait for a reply, so I'm watching a cat catch a mouse. I don't know why the mouse didn't just fly away.
This is beautiful. Just beautiful. Bravo!!!
If you'll please excuse me; I am going to shed a tear now, for those poor woke bastards that hate D&D, and never did like it anyway.
All of this SJW rubbish bullshit; only serves to make OD&D, BX, and 1st Edition AD&D look like classic works of art.
It's glorious to watch them eat their own.
This is like watching the communists fight the fascists all over again.
It seems like an odd complaint for someone who maintains their biological characteristics make them more suited than others for their job.
Quote from: Almost_Useless on December 04, 2022, 12:12:59 AM
It seems like an odd complaint for someone who maintains their biological characteristics make them more suited than others for their job.
If you keep noticing things, I'm going to have to get the head-cage full of rats.
Next you'll ask insane, crazy things like why American Indians or Australian Aborigines have a mystical blood claim to ancestral land; but Europeans are just earlier immigrants to Europe, and anyone with a passport is equally at home there.
Quote from: Grognard GM on December 04, 2022, 12:18:49 AM
Next you'll ask insane, crazy things like why American Indians or Australian Aborigines have a mystical blood claim to ancestral land; but Europeans are just earlier immigrants to Europe, and anyone with a passport is equally at home there.
Not if us dumb Polaks have anything to say about it!
Quote from: Almost_Useless on December 04, 2022, 12:12:59 AM
It seems like an odd complaint for someone who maintains their biological characteristics make them more suited than others for their job.
What?
Quote from: thornad on December 04, 2022, 05:46:00 AM
Quote from: Almost_Useless on December 04, 2022, 12:12:59 AM
It seems like an odd complaint for someone who maintains their biological characteristics make them more suited than others for their job.
What?
They're talking about how a guy can rail against Bio-Essentialism, while also arguing that his relatives coming from China in the past, magically make him suitable for writing stories set in all of the Orient.
Can someone point me where the PHB references real-world races like French, English, Egyptian, Chinese, Aborigine, Bantu, Khoisan, or any other real-world race?
Quote from: Grognard GM on December 04, 2022, 12:18:49 AM
Next you'll ask insane, crazy things like why American Indians or Australian Aborigines have a mystical blood claim to ancestral land; but Europeans are just earlier immigrants to Europe, and anyone with a passport is equally at home there.
Oh gawds this!!! holy shite I'm sick of hearing they have some mystical claim to the land.....like.....ugh
Quote from: Grognard GM on December 04, 2022, 12:47:12 PM
They're talking about how a guy can rail against Bio-Essentialism, while also arguing that his relatives coming from China in the past, magically make him suitable for writing stories set in all of the Orient.
Yup, this.... Little Danny Kwan thinks just cause he's descended from Oriental roots that makes him more capable than say an trained historian of European ancestry
Honestly, after the Cultural Revolution and the historical revisionism of the CCP, I'm more inclined to trust Western historians over Chinese scholars on Chinese history. That Danny fellow is exactly the result to expect from history written from modern "critical" perspectives.
Quote from: Zelen on December 04, 2022, 01:23:56 PM
Can someone point me where the PHB references real-world races like French, English, Egyptian, Chinese, Aborigine, Bantu, Khoisan, or any other real-world race?
Only if you can tell us how the French and English became races. I always thought that they were cultures.
Quote from: Zelen on December 04, 2022, 01:23:56 PM
Can someone point me where the PHB references real-world races like French, English, Egyptian, Chinese, Aborigine, Bantu, Khoisan, or any other real-world race?
There's a part toward the back that references gods of real-world cultures -- Norse, Celtic, Egyptian. Might be others, but I don't have my copy handy.
Quote from: Zelen on December 04, 2022, 01:23:56 PM
Can someone point me where the PHB references real-world races like French, English, Egyptian, Chinese, Aborigine, Bantu, Khoisan, or any other real-world race?
Theres werewolves from France in Mystara and Gypsies from wherever in Greyhawk.
Theres been bithing about both before and the various non-white races populating Greyhawk. Because of course fantasy races are really real real world races!
Quote from: jeff37923 on December 04, 2022, 10:52:55 PM
Only if you can tell us how the French and English became races.
By intra-breeding more than inter-breeding. A 'race' is just a common lineage.
Quote from: Zelen on December 04, 2022, 01:23:56 PM
Can someone point me where the PHB references real-world races like French, English, Egyptian, Chinese, Aborigine, Bantu, Khoisan, or any other real-world race?
Well, it mentions Orcs. You know, black people. ;)
Ba-dum-tss.mp3
These claims of "biological essentialism" are complete nonsense. Every human being is different and some have advantages over others because they won the genetic lottery, in addition to just growing up in favorable circumstances. Acknowledging that is not racism or sexism or any other -ism. What is prejudiced is legislating that people be treated as subhuman for these differences. No credible study has shown measurable difference in average intelligence across the races and sexes that cannot be accounted for purely by upbringing. For example, Asian people aren't genetically predisposed towards being smarter than any other human population: they grow up in cultures that prize education.
Once we bring in Tolkienesque races then all our science goes out the window. The differences between them are much greater than those between humans, and our understanding of it is purely theoretical since we don't have aliens or non-human intelligences to study. Even the smartest animals on Earth have yet to master fire.
In Tolkien's work the elves, humans and orcs aren't even different species technically speaking. They can interbreed to produce fertile offspring (it's not known precisely how orcs reproduce after all of Morgoth's genetic modifications, but we do know they have children that are born defenseless and require time to mature), altho in the case of half-elves they have to choose between being immortal or being mortal.
Quote from: BoxCrayonTales on December 05, 2022, 09:14:49 AM
...altho in the case of half-elves they have to choose between being immortal or being mortal.
It's a bit more complicated than just that.
Of the handful of elf/human pairings we know about, only two have ever chosen mortality: Elros and Arwen. It seems that half-elves are immortal (and indistinguishable from elves) by default, but have the option to forsake their immortality and accept the Gift of Man. Most, by all accounts, choose not to.
In addition, the children of Elros, who we might also consider "half-elf", don't seem capable of reversing the decision and become immortal. That was the whole dispute with Ar-Pharazon and the King's Men: they wanted immortality.
little Danny Kwan saves the day... again.
I agree on the sentiment of the video, I do not agree with attacking the left because of this - well, I'm European, maybe being left means something different here. I consider myself to be politically left-leaning, so according to the video, I should agree with all this woke nonsense. I don't. It got me kicked off their facebook page and their twitter, and still I won't take a single word back from what I said. It's woke that is the problem - or, I should say, woke that's gotten out of control that is the problem. I'm all for equality for all regardless of skin colour, I'm against affirmative action or positive discrimination or whatever it is called these days. If I as a white heterosexual male were truly privileged, I wouldn't (quite literally) have been working the skin off my hands since I was nineteen, while coloured people (and rightfully so, bully for them) can attend college. Just my two cents on this.
TL;DR: not the left but woke is the problem
The fire warms my heart and makes for a fine Christmas cheer. Thank you, blue-hairs. Everyone got what they deserved.
Quote from: Kerstmanneke82 on December 08, 2022, 04:56:03 AM
I agree on the sentiment of the video, I do not agree with attacking the left because of this - well, I'm European, maybe being left means something different here. I consider myself to be politically left-leaning, so according to the video, I should agree with all this woke nonsense. I don't. It got me kicked off their facebook page and their twitter, and still I won't take a single word back from what I said. It's woke that is the problem - or, I should say, woke that's gotten out of control that is the problem. I'm all for equality for all regardless of skin colour, I'm against affirmative action or positive discrimination or whatever it is called these days. If I as a white heterosexual male were truly privileged, I wouldn't (quite literally) have been working the skin off my hands since I was nineteen, while coloured people (and rightfully so, bully for them) can attend college. Just my two cents on this.
TL;DR: not the left but woke is the problem
heads up, 'coloured people' isn't proper anymore. you can use people of color but that's a terrible term imo. i suggest you use non whites in the future. i know you're not racist but you slipped up there.
Quote from: MeganovaStella on December 08, 2022, 02:49:02 PM
heads up, 'coloured people' isn't proper anymore. you can use people of color but that's a terrible term imo. i suggest you use non whites in the future. i know you're not racist but you slipped up there.
I will, of course, take it to heart.
That I think illustrates the difference; most of my friends are left-leaning politically but they're still my friends and we can have a conversation, because they won't start shrieking that I'm a nazi bigot if I said 'coloured person' and start calling up my employer to get me fired. I think it was Christina Sommers who coined the phrase 'grievance feminists' to describe an activist who, in addition to holding their particular beliefs, also had a huge chip on their shoulders and went out of their way to screw over people whom they disagreed with. That's pretty much the woke right there, and why their existence irks me.
I'll talk to, disagree with, debate, have a drink with, and agree to disagree with a lefty, no prob. But anyone who doesn't extend the same courtesy to me in return is a douche.
It's all a bunch of fucking posturing and sanctimony. None of these people give a shit about bio essentialism or any of their other isms unless they can use it to make themselves feel important on the internet.
The lefties I know are much more grounded in reality. The idealistic idiots are either young and lack life experience or are posing for internet cred.
end rant.
Quote from: rytrasmi on December 10, 2022, 07:10:55 PM
It's all a bunch of fucking posturing and sanctimony. None of these people give a shit about bio essentialism or any of their other isms unless they can use it to make themselves feel important on the internet.
The lefties I know are much more grounded in reality. The idealistic idiots are either young and lack life experience or are posing for internet cred.
end rant.
Honestly, I don't think you can rule out that some of them are just stupid. What they call "biological essentialism" is what everyone else calls "science." I mean, what explanation is there for a giraffe's preference for vegetable matter, a tiger's predatory behavior, or a deer's timidity? Biology. No one with an iota of scientific credibility would argue that deer would be as aggressive as tigers, if only they had been raised differently. The problem is that the woke crowd, despite their assertions that the "races" in D&D are different species, cannot themselves conceive of D&D race as anything other than human ethnicities. And, of course, we must all be punished for their lack of imagination and intelligence...
Quote from: Eirikrautha on December 10, 2022, 10:39:43 PM
Honestly, I don't think you can rule out that some of them are just stupid. What they call "biological essentialism" is what everyone else calls "science."
Pretty much. The left invents their own lexicon that turns everything into victimhood, whichthey parade around as real terminology. This make you sucked in to the debate on their terms. You win the debate by mocking and ridiculing it.
Biological essentialism is reality, unless you think that creatures have some kind of hidden spiritual essence that gives them properties (in which case I guess you are a 'spiritual essentialist').
QuoteOf the handful of elf/human pairings we know about, only two have ever chosen mortality: Elros and Arwen. It seems that half-elves are immortal (and indistinguishable from elves) by default, but have the option to forsake their immortality and accept the Gift of Man. Most, by all accounts, choose not to.
For sake of being annoying nerd I'm gonna point out it's other way round - every descendant of Men is mortal (though lore like Athrabeth shows its not necessarily a Gift).
Dior son of Beren and Luthien was 27 when he died, adult, father of two - if he had elven lifespan he would be kid. Simmilarily Dol-Amroth princes were mortals despite elven blood in their veins.
It was ONLY descendant of Earendil that get choice to follow Elven fate after he travelled to Valars with Silmaril. And even descendants of Elrond who picked fate of Elves, could reverse to human nature.
So, what exactly would satisfy the demands of someone complaining about "Biological Essentialism" in their RPGs?
New character classes: You finally get to play the role of a Rock!!! You can now choose between Sandstone, Obsidian, Quartz, Limestone, or Marble. You have a Strength and Constitution of 18. Your Dexterity, Intelligence, and Wisdom are zero; because you're a Rock. Perhaps if you are an attractive Rock, your Charisma score could be above zero.
Quote from: Jam The MF on December 24, 2022, 05:51:20 PM
So, what exactly would satisfy the demands of someone complaining about "Biological Essentialism" in their RPGs?
New character classes: You finally get to play the role of a Rock!!! You can now choose between Sandstone, Obsidian, Quartz, Limestone, or Marble. You have a Strength and Constitution of 18. Your Dexterity, Intelligence, and Wisdom are zero; because you're a Rock. Perhaps if you are an attractive Rock, your Charisma score could be above zero.
Your disgusting show of Mineral Essentialism has been noted, Comrade.
Quote from: Jam The MF on December 24, 2022, 05:51:20 PM
So, what exactly would satisfy the demands of someone complaining about "Biological Essentialism" in their RPGs?
New character classes: You finally get to play the role of a Rock!!! You can now choose between Sandstone, Obsidian, Quartz, Limestone, or Marble. You have a Strength and Constitution of 18. Your Dexterity, Intelligence, and Wisdom are zero; because you're a Rock. Perhaps if you are an attractive Rock, your Charisma score could be above zero.
I see you're embracing the stereotype of rocks as stupid, ie "Dumb as a box of rocks."
Rocks need to be allowed an intelligence of 18 just like any other species (yes, rocks are a species, the science is settled).
You probably want to vary strength by rock subspecies based on Moe's Hardness Scale, you hater.
Quote from: PulpHerb on December 27, 2022, 11:34:23 AM
Quote from: Jam The MF on December 24, 2022, 05:51:20 PM
So, what exactly would satisfy the demands of someone complaining about "Biological Essentialism" in their RPGs?
New character classes: You finally get to play the role of a Rock!!! You can now choose between Sandstone, Obsidian, Quartz, Limestone, or Marble. You have a Strength and Constitution of 18. Your Dexterity, Intelligence, and Wisdom are zero; because you're a Rock. Perhaps if you are an attractive Rock, your Charisma score could be above zero.
I see you're embracing the stereotype of rocks as stupid, ie "Dumb as a box of rocks."
Rocks need to be allowed an intelligence of 18 just like any other species (yes, rocks are a species, the science is settled).
You probably want to vary strength by rock subspecies based on Moe's Hardness Scale, you hater.
Why not Larry or Curly's Scales, bigot?
Quote from: Grognard GM on December 27, 2022, 11:36:44 AM
Quote from: PulpHerb on December 27, 2022, 11:34:23 AM
Quote from: Jam The MF on December 24, 2022, 05:51:20 PM
So, what exactly would satisfy the demands of someone complaining about "Biological Essentialism" in their RPGs?
New character classes: You finally get to play the role of a Rock!!! You can now choose between Sandstone, Obsidian, Quartz, Limestone, or Marble. You have a Strength and Constitution of 18. Your Dexterity, Intelligence, and Wisdom are zero; because you're a Rock. Perhaps if you are an attractive Rock, your Charisma score could be above zero.
I see you're embracing the stereotype of rocks as stupid, ie "Dumb as a box of rocks."
Rocks need to be allowed an intelligence of 18 just like any other species (yes, rocks are a species, the science is settled).
You probably want to vary strength by rock subspecies based on Moe's Hardness Scale, you hater.
Why not Larry or Curly's Scales, bigot?
Doh...spelling error, but it might have made it funnier.
Quote from: PulpHerb on December 27, 2022, 11:34:23 AM
Quote from: Jam The MF on December 24, 2022, 05:51:20 PM
So, what exactly would satisfy the demands of someone complaining about "Biological Essentialism" in their RPGs?
New character classes: You finally get to play the role of a Rock!!! You can now choose between Sandstone, Obsidian, Quartz, Limestone, or Marble. You have a Strength and Constitution of 18. Your Dexterity, Intelligence, and Wisdom are zero; because you're a Rock. Perhaps if you are an attractive Rock, your Charisma score could be above zero.
I see you're embracing the stereotype of rocks as stupid, ie "Dumb as a box of rocks."
Rocks need to be allowed an intelligence of 18 just like any other species (yes, rocks are a species, the science is settled).
You probably want to vary strength by rock subspecies based on Moe's Hardness Scale, you hater.
I guess when you are a rock, you are always Rock Hard?
As I keep pointing out.
There is no limit to what these sociopaths will hallucinate as offensive. See all the above jokes about rocks.
Guess what? Given time thise will not be jokes. Those will be real (in the woke's diseased minds) offenses. "Rocks represent the oppreseded blacks and thats WACIST!"