One way I think of D&D is as a family tree of games,  treating the three books as the primary point (I know there are pedantic arguments as to why it isn't really the starting point, but for the sake of argument we'll assume as such) D&D has this odd natural split evolution between Basic D&D and Advanced D&D, and the sub boxsets for each and variant rules.

What I find interesting is finding out about versions of the game people were playing  in parallel to Gyax at roughly the same time that are not in the typical sense OD&D, B/X or AD&D.

The biggest example I can think of off the top of my head is Warlock / Dungeons & Beavers, and to my understanding the original Warlock game is sort of lost media at this point? given the only version of it I could find was the 1999 one which got scanned into a pdf.

But I doubt Warlock was the only example of a split branch of D&D for this time?

I don't know if games like Tunnels a& Trolls or Fantasy Trip really count as I don't believe their systems are based on any mainline version of D&D? Likewise I guess it'd be prudent to exclude retroclones from this discussion.

Empire of the Petal Throne is definitely an original D&D variant.

The Arduin Grimoire was frequently used as a modification/supplement for D&D.

Runequest was influenced by The Perrin Conventions, which were modifications to D&D (and authored by Steve Perrin).

Rolemaster started its life as a bolt-on system/replacement for D&D subsystems.

Many games that were not splits from some D&D version where nevertheless a reaction to it.  Or to be fair, a partial reaction to it.  Dragon Quest falls in this camp somewhat.  I'd say that Powers and Perils does too, though its been so long since I've read it, perhaps my memory is faulty.

One of the first games that absolutely owes nothing to D&D is Toon, at least not directly.  Toon is really designed as its own thing from the ground up, though no doubt given its origins, The Fantasy Trip had some influence.  How much influence D&D had on TFT, I have no idea.

The earliest and latest ttrpgs are all leaves on the D&D tree.

All of 'em.

If you lift the hood on any ttrpg, there's D&D technology there. Somewhere.

We can even see the influence D&D has had on video games. Computer RPGs, right?

D&D is the game that changed the game.

Quote from: Philotomy Jurament on February 10, 2025, 09:14:23 PMEmpire of the Petal Throne is definitely an original D&D variant.

The Arduin Grimoire was frequently used as a modification/supplement for D&D.

Runequest was influenced by The Perrin Conventions, which were modifications to D&D (and authored by Steve Perrin).

Rolemaster started its life as a bolt-on system/replacement for D&D subsystems.

These are some lines of inquiry I'll be checking out then.

unrelated but I like your signature, reminds me of a quote from God Emperor of Dune:

"All governments suffer a recurring problem: Power attracts pathological personalities. It is not that power corrupts but that it is magnetic to the corruptible."

Quote from: Theory of Games on February 10, 2025, 09:28:08 PMThe earliest and latest ttrpgs are all leaves on the D&D tree.

All of 'em.

If you lift the hood on any ttrpg, there's D&D technology there. Somewhere.

We can even see the influence D&D has had on video games. Computer RPGs, right?

D&D is the game that changed the game.

I'd agree that is true, though it's a definition that isn't useful for describing things.

Dangerous Journeys?

 Warlock (from the 70s) is not lost. At least not the Complete Warlock from '78. It's billed as a variant of D&D. World of Dungeons from 1979 is another one, really a micro-RPG but clearly based on D&D but in like 4 pages.

But most of the stuff was from the early 80s, I think, more based on AD&D than OD&D.1982 had Wizard's World which Goblinoid Games reprinted. Very D&Dish. The original Atlantis from Bard Games was very D&D-ish

Tom Moldvay put out what was probably the first retro clone, The Challenge System, which was D&D in 8 pages. I suspect it was meant to just put out modules.

edit: Judges Guild also put out the curiously named "Field Guide to Encounters" in 1982 which is clearly D&D inspired/based

Quote from: Socratic-DM on February 10, 2025, 09:31:24 PM"All governments suffer a recurring problem: Power attracts pathological personalities. It is not that power corrupts but that it is magnetic to the corruptible."

Bi-la Kaifa!

Off the top of my head there are things like High Fantasy, Wizard's Realm, Warrior / Mage (not sure if there was an overall system title), Thieve's World, Knights and Magick, Knight's Hand, and Heroes.  All of which might fall into your category.

Chivalry and Sorcery is certainly in the category.

I suspect Rolemaster and Palladium are the two biggest and most succesful offshoots from the early years.

There are, of course many 3e era OGL offshoots including The Wheel of Time, Sovergn Stone, World of Warcraft d20 and the Decipher (I think) Lord of the Rings game.

Dragon Quest, Sword Bearer, Fifth Cycle and Dangerous Journeys lean more towards RuneQuest / BRP with the percentiles and hit locations and skill lists.

TFT is somewhat inspired by Tunnels and Trolls and GURPS is the mad offspring of a drunken three way between HERO, BRP, and TFT though no one can remember who the mother was.