Quote from: san dee jota;947293Which is fine (really, I'm all for rolling dice and smacking orcs and telling crude jokes), but it shouldn't be confused with being more than it is.

Indeed. Attempts to be "edgy" usually come off to me as "desperate cry for attention". WFRP, back when they were edgy, managed to be weird/sexy with Slannesh, but were smart about where they drew the line.

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;947298Actually, having grown up in farm country I found that bulls and stallions are "growers," not "showers." When non aroused the penis is almost completely hidden up in the sheath.

I won't question any, umm, hands-on experience in that regard.

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;947298Actually, having grown up in farm country I found that bulls and stallions are "growers," not "showers." When non aroused the penis is almost completely hidden up in the sheath.

Having ridden horses and driven mules for many years, I agree - if it's going to show, it should be erect, and if it's not, you shouldn't see it at all. Either way, it shouldn't look like he's unhappy over his brit milah.

So, edgy, juvenile, shocking, sexy, or just accurate depictions?

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However, the succubus pic was obviously redone, as was the minotaur.  Throwing a bondage cock onto a succubus just to be "inclusive" is kinda lame.  Minotaurs could have human or bull cocks, but tossing a circumcised one on after is kinda lame too.  It should be like the nephilim.

BTW, if you're talking about "inclusivity" is showing cocks just supposed to give a shout-out to the chicks and gay guys?  Does the succubus have a cock for the hermaphrodites?  Will the centaur be rocking his cock for all the bronies?  Where's my vag shots?

Quote from: CRKrueger;947304So, edgy, juvenile, shocking, sexy, or just accurate depictions?

1. Is supposed to be edgy. not sure it hits.
2. I had never seen this one. I'm going to say "accurate" was the artist intent. Sad demon girl has fat rolls no less... and a big ass.
3. I have been informed this is cultural appropriation and refuse to look at it so I do not commit the ultimate SJW sin.
4a. and 4b. are just crappy art. So bad it doesn't deserve one of your suggested adjectives.
5.What? My eyes are too bad. Not sure if this is just a human noble sitting around with her breasts out. If so, I will go Juvenile on this one.
6. Sexy, to the point. In context. Maybe a little too sanitized for the evil act she is doing.

Quote from: ZWEIHÄNDER;947242What are your thoughts on nudity and inclusivity in RPGs?

Nudity: Eh. Depends on the tone the book is going for.

Inclusivity: This word has been ruined for me. I want to pour bleach on my eyes whenever I read it.

Quote from: MonsterSlayer;947281Spoken like someone that does not have kids... if you truly believe that a discussion about "emulated violence" and why your lust demon has a pee pee and boobies is the "same", you do not have kids.

+1

It also shows that you don't spend much time around kids either.  I don't have kids yet - but my 13 nieces & nephews are more than enough to tell me that it's NOT the same.

Quote from: CRKrueger;947306However, the succubus pic was obviously redone, as was the minotaur.  Throwing a bondage cock onto a succubus just to be "inclusive" is kinda lame.  Minotaurs could have human or bull cocks, but tossing a circumcised one on after is kinda lame too.  It should be like the nephilim.

BTW, if you're talking about "inclusivity" is showing cocks just supposed to give a shout-out to the chicks and gay guys?  Does the succubus have a cock for the hermaphrodites?  Will the centaur be rocking his cock for all the bronies?  Where's my vag shots?

To address your questions, you'll need to separate my two statements from one another:

ON RACE & GENDER INCLUSIVITY
Our personal values strongly guided the writing process and art direction. On the outset of the project, Dejan, Tanner and I made the joint decision to include representation of all real-world races and genders throughout the book. In addition, these races are expressed in the art using female and male genders. This includes instances of transgendered and intersex characters and creatures.

We portray characters from the perspective of real world races: Caucasian, Dravidian, Mongoloid and Negroid. In addition, you can roughly count up an equal number of males, females and transgendered characters in the book. We aimed for inclusivity, and to 'break' the mold for most Renaissance-inspired games by making doubly sure to illustrate a representative sample of gamers across the world.

ON NUDITY & SEXUALITY IN THE BESTIARY
We also use nudity and sexuality throughout the book. In most cases, nudity is represented as the natural state of creatures, and at other times, we use it in tandem with sexuality. We hope you won't be dissuaded from enjoying ZWEIHÄNDER because of this.

The artwork sometimes shows creatures 'in the wild', with their parts just hangin' out. Other times, the artwork is intended to be titillating. And yes, sometimes creatures are circumcised and others are not; it's intentional. Ultimately, it's up to the reader to interpret intent by reading the book and bestiary entry, so that they have the proper context.

Otherwise, a dick demon is just a dick demon for the sake of shock value:

[video=vimeo;121524871]https://vimeo.com/121524871[/youtube]

Quote from: CRKrueger;947304So, edgy, juvenile, shocking, sexy, or just accurate depictions?

It's cheesecake -- they're all attractive, where topless male creatures tend to be fat, have their chest obscured, or just lack detail (the 1e MM seems to shy away from drawing male nipples). But they fit the monsters, they're not in silly fetish gear, and their bodies are more natural, instead of inflated or anorexic. The exceptions are the type V (but that's probably just ineptness rather than intent), Loviatar, and the last one -- which I don't recognize and seems to be from a different era of TSR art.

I think that the cenobites from Hellraiser are the most perfect Slaanesh demons. Cock-rings not necessary.

Quote from: MonsterSlayer;9473072. I had never seen this one. I'm going to say "accurate" was the artist intent. Sad demon girl has fat rolls no less... and a big ass.

This is by Darlene, a female artist who also created the great map of Greyhawk and did a comic series in Dragon for a while. I think that she is a woman may have something to do with the portrayal of the body here. It appears in the back of the 1e DMG. Of my favorities from the era actually.

'Accurate' is an odd qualification for fantasy creatures, some created whole clothe.

Another example: we went full-on beefcake with a few males and suggestive titillation with a few females.

See the image below of the Prostitute career. If you can guess who the male character was modeled after - from a movie made its rounds in Hollywood not once but twice, promising a 'big' package -  I'll send you the illustrated PDF for free upon release:

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[ATTACH=CONFIG]707[/ATTACH]

Quote from: Voros;947313'Accurate' is an odd qualification for fantasy creatures, some created whole clothe.

Almost none are created from whole cloth. They're usually just human plus, animal plus, or some mix of humans and animals. If you don't know how to draw a horse, you can't draw a good centaur. And it's even more obvious when a monster has a humanlike form, because of familiarity.

Quote from: Spike;947270Well, since you asked, I might point out that the actual mythological minotaur was pretty much a rape monster, and the product of an interspecies rape at that.

In what version of the myth did you reads this? As I recall in Ovid Minos is supposed to sacrifice a bull sent by the Gods and because he doesn't they make his wife fall in love and sleep with the bull and give birth to the Minotaur. So it is bestiality but not rape. And I don't recall any suggestion that the Minotaur rapes his victims, he eats them. Certainly there are subtextual suggestions of rape in the material but nothing overt. And as you say it's not like Ovid or the Greeks were shy about including rape in their stories.