Hi. I know there is some kerfuffle about DnD right now.. I guess we choose the worst time to join the game... but my board game group is looking to play an RPG for a bit of a change.

I know there are a lot of non-dnd options, like Call of Cthulhu, but we have some players that have played DnD when young. Also, there is an active DnD, as in a large, active DnD group, who meet at a local game store that runs a bunch of tables each week. We think it would be a good place to run our game so we have support from "DnD Experts" and stuff.

Anyway, as board gamers we are very familiar with the "Lovecraft themes" as it is a super common theme in board games. We have played all the Arkham games from FFG for literal decades. Arkham Horror 2nd + 3rd. Eldritch Horror. Mansions of Madness, 1st and 2nd Editions. Elder Sign and The Arkham Horror (The LCG) have all hit the table many times. We not only know the "theme" very well, we also love it.

Now, again. We know about Call of Cthulhu as well as a lot of the various other games but we are pretty sold on DnD as we want to be part of the DnD Group that meets near us.

So.. to my question...

We found a Kickstater (link) for a game called "Steinhardt's Guide to the Eldritch Hunt: A 5e Supplement". It is a "5e Supplement", but themed to Lovecraft. Now my understanding is that a supplement is basically custom setting and some custom mechanisms, that run a game that is not traditional DnD, but uses the actual DnD mechanisms. As in the DnD rule set. Is that right? If I buy this and run this "hunt" game, we will be positioned to move into any DnD game we wish afterwards, as much of the rules are the same?

Also, as this is a Lovecraft Themed "supplement" and not exactly what DnD is designed for, like say Call of Cthulhu is, I was hoping people who are more into ttrpgs could give me some thoughts on this Eldritch Hunt game and if you think it is any good. Like I know that as a Lovecraft style game it needs to have madness and I am not sure if that is in normal DnD? Also, I suspect that it is pretty dark, which we like.

: TL;DR :

• What exactly is a DnD Supplement, and how does it relate to official DnD?
• I would be very interested in any comments you may have about Eldritch Hunt. I'd be happy to hear anything about what you think of it.

I'm considering "late pledging" to this game and wanted some guidance.

Thanks
(1st post on this board btw.. so Hi!)

So, a "supplement" can mean a lot of things, from a pamphlet sized document with a few new monsters, to an alternate spell system, or a setting, or a functionally new game. This one appears to be a setting book with some additional character options in the form of subclasses, spells, weapons, etc. (which is what a lot of 5e kickstarter supplements are). The pitch includes some kind of dice-roll world mechanic as well, so possibly some new campaign rules.  Not sure exactly how new to all this you are, so apologies if this is obvious, but you will almost certainly still need the 5e core rulebooks (at least the player's handbook) to use it.

As far as tone and stuff like that goes. From the kickstarter pitch, it is transparently clear to me that what they're trying to do is Bloodborne as a D&D setting (with a little influence from Steelrising as well I think). Not a terrible idea. If you haven't played Bloodborne, it is Lovecraftian in some of its themes and aesthetics, but it's roots are in the "Souls" games, which are fantasy dungeon crawlers that borrow quite a few ideas from D&D. Where Call of Cthulhu is an investigative game, with an emphasis on skills, social interactions and mystery (which is more directly true to the Lovecraft stories), Bloodborne is about using crazy steampunk weapons to defeat eldritch horrors in battle, and is therefore probably a much better fit for D&D.

If you haven't played the game, and you're wondering about the themes and tone this Kickstarter is likely going for, I would say go check out a Bloodborne playthrough or lore video. I'll link a couple below.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-wYtwCihr4&t=3161s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xiAVSgtIn8Q

Hope that's helpful.

P.S. I wouldn't worry too much about the drama surrounding D&D at the moment. The OneD&D thing is still probably about a year away from kicking in, and lots of people will just keep their 5e books and keep playing it. All that it probably means for you is there might be a time limit on buying new third party content like this Kickstarter.

Quote from: ForgottenF on January 21, 2023, 10:02:12 AM
Not sure exactly how new to all this you are, so apologies if this is obvious, but you will almost certainly still need the 5e core rulebooks (at least the player's handbook) to use it.

No I am super new.. as in I only really know about rpgs through a kind of culture osmosis and what I have read in the last few weeks via google searches and stuff looking for a game to play.

Quote from: ForgottenF on January 21, 2023, 10:02:12 AMit is transparently clear to me that what they're trying to do is Bloodborne as a D&D setting (with a little influence from Steelrising as well I think) <snip> Bloodborne is about using crazy steampunk weapons to defeat eldritch horrors in battle, and is therefore probably a much better fit for D&D

Isn't Bloodborn a computer game or something? I couldn't find any links to it. Google just found playstation links and stuff? Also ,I do not want to be offensive, but I personally and also our group kinda think "Steampunk" is sorta lame. It is just not an aesthetic sub-gener that clicks with us.

Quote from: ForgottenF on January 21, 2023, 10:02:12 AMI wouldn't worry too much about the drama surrounding D&D at the moment. <snip> there might be a time limit on buying new third party content like this Kickstarter

Yeah, that is what a mate told me, also the guys blog said it could be the only time this product is on sale due to all that stuff. So it might be a kind of collector thing if it gets popular.

Even so, it will take a while to turn up.

I have heard about Pulp Cthulhu and Delta Green ... have you played them? I know they are not DnD.. but if I am going for a non-DnD game... what would be a good Lovecraft Setting / Game I could play that is more "pew pew pew monster die!" than "go insane and reroll, get head bitten off, re-roll, get axe in the face, re-roll" which is what I understand CoC to be.

Quote from: Summon666 on January 21, 2023, 11:43:11 AM

Quote from: ForgottenF on January 21, 2023, 10:02:12 AM
Not sure exactly how new to all this you are, so apologies if this is obvious, but you will almost certainly still need the 5e core rulebooks (at least the player's handbook) to use it.

No I am super new.. as in I only really know about rpgs through a kind of culture osmosis and what I have read in the last few weeks via google searches and stuff looking for a game to play.

As a general rule, anything marketed as a supplement usually assumes that you either know or are extremely familiar with the core rules of the original game. Products which can be run as their own game separate from the core rules will usually go out of their way to say so somewhere in the marketing copy. The phrase "complete game" seems to be a common marker for that.

Quote from: Summon666 on January 21, 2023, 11:43:11 AM

Quote from: ForgottenF on January 21, 2023, 10:02:12 AMit is transparently clear to me that what they're trying to do is Bloodborne as a D&D setting (with a little influence from Steelrising as well I think) <snip> Bloodborne is about using crazy steampunk weapons to defeat eldritch horrors in battle, and is therefore probably a much better fit for D&D

Isn't Bloodborn a computer game or something? I couldn't find any links to it. Google just found playstation links and stuff? Also ,I do not want to be offensive, but I personally and also our group kinda think "Steampunk" is sorta lame. It is just not an aesthetic sub-gener that clicks with us.

Yeah, it was a Playstation 4 exclusive, so if you don't own a PS4 or PS5 it's pretty much inaccessible except via YouTube. The Kickstarter looks to me like it's very much an unofficial adaptation of the PS4 game.

It might be unfair to refer to Bloodborne strictly as "steampunk". The environmental and character aesthetics are probably better described as "fantasy gothic". It's really just a few of the weapons that have a steampunk vibe (though even those would be more accurately classed as "black-powder punk"). I'll post a couple images here to kind of give you an idea of the aesthetic: 





How that would translate into the Kickstarter project I don't know. That's different artists working on it.

Quote from: Summon666 on January 21, 2023, 11:43:11 AM
I have heard about Pulp Cthulhu and Delta Green ... have you played them? I know they are not DnD.. but if I am going for a non-DnD game... what would be a good Lovecraft Setting / Game I could play that is more "pew pew pew monster die!" than "go insane and reroll, get head bitten off, re-roll, get axe in the face, re-roll" which is what I understand CoC to be.

I have played neither. As I understand it, Pulp Cthulhu is an alternate ruleset for Call of Cthulhu 7th edition, which is designed to make player characters more resilient, and generally encourage a more action oriented game. I believe it also requires that you have the CoC core rulebook to use it. The YouTuber Seth Skorkowsky did a campaign diary series on his Pulp Cthulhu campaign, which could probably give you a better idea of how it plays than I could.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL25p5gPY6qKW5wOewLHWbZgfDDEMQfPuY

He also has a lot of videos about CoC in general on his channel, which you might find useful.

Delta Green I know almost nothing about. Others around here probably will, though.

As far as other recommendations:

Triple Ace Games has a product called Leagues of Cthulhu, which is a supplement for their Leagues of Adventure pulp adventure RPG, using the Ubiquity system. I don't have much experience with Ubiquity, but it got a lot of critical praise around the internet when it popped up a few years ago.

What I would more likely recommend is Savage Worlds: Adventure Edition (often abbreviated "SWADE"). This is a setting-neutral system, with settings and rules published for dozens of different settings and genres. Its Lovecraftian setting is called Realms of Cthulhu. There's two main advantages to SWADE in this context.
--1) It's a moderately simple and quite versatile system, which should be pretty easy for new players to learn. Once you have learned it, you can pick up the other setting books and easily switch to fantasy or sci fi or whatever takes your fancy.
--2) SWADE has been gaining a lot of traction in the mainstream RPG scene lately, and is one of the top contenders you see from people talking about leaving D&D. So if you are looking to be able to integrate into your local gaming scene, it's probably a better choice than something obscure like Ubiquity is.

In addition to Realms of Cthulhu, there's also the Achtung! Cthulhu setting, which is World War II spies against the Cthulhu mythos, heavily inspired by the Indiana Jones films. The setting was published by a company called Modiphius, originally for Savage Worlds, but more recently for their proprietary "2d20 System". If you want to look into this, I would definitely recommend you try and track down the Savage Worlds versions. I've played other games using the 2d20 system, and it is not beginner-friendly at all.

EDIT: I should have added that there was a version of Call of Cthulhu published by Wizards of the Coast under their D20 system, so that would still be in the same system infrastructure as Dungeons and Dragons. It's getting pretty long in the tooth now (published in 2002), but there are used copies available around the internet.

New to RPGs?  Welcome aboard!!!

I hope your group finds exactly what you are searching for.

As an addendum to my previous comment, If you're getting into Tabletop RPGs brand new, it's probably worth getting a crash course on what you might call the "family tree" of RPG systems. I'll do my best here.

--D20 system: There's some nuance here, but broadly speaking Dungeons & Dragons and all its derivatives fall into this category. Being perfectly accurate, "D20" only refers to games based on D&D 3.0 or later. Games based on the 2nd or earlier editions of D&D (often referred to as "OSR games") technically are not "D20 games" for historical reasons not worth getting into here, but the core structure and concepts are similar enough that being conversant in one is highly useful for understanding the others. D20 games are characterized by being class and level based, often with a multitude of playable races, using saving throws, and having rolling on a d20 with bonuses be the predominant mechanic.

--"Basic Roleplaying" or D100 systems: Basic Roleplaying (or BRP) is the genericized version of the system used by Chaosium Inc. for its Call of Cthulhu and Runequest lines. The BRP system is mostly only used by Chaosium, but there are a few other notable games that have licensed or copied it, and the Warhammer and Warhammer 40K RPGs use very similar systems. There are also a few more obscure (usually British) games such as Maelstrom that use substantially similar systems. These games usually don't use class or level, and the primary mechanic is rolling d100 and trying to get below a target number determined by skill or attribute scores.

--GURPS and Savage Worlds: Mechanically quite different, but I will lump them together on the grounds that both are generic roleplaying systems with lots of different settings and rules published for them. In both cases, their systems are not much used outside of products explicitly attached to the main system.

--Modiphius 2d20: As previously mentioned, the proprietary system of a single publisher, characterized by rolling multiple d20s and trying to get under a target number on each one. The 2d20 system tends to be poorly regarded by most in the hobby, but Modiphius is highly successful at licensing big properties such as Conan, Dune and Fallout, so their games still turn up a lot at game stores and in online spaces.

--D6 games: a loose family of games by lots of different publishers, using only 6-sided dice, often with a "dice-pool" core mechanic. Not hugely popular, but with a dedicated fanbase (especially around here). The godfather of this family of games seems to be West End Games' Star Wars.

--Powered by the Apocalypse: A large family of narrative-heavy games descending from D. Vincent Baker's Apocalypse World. There's also a subsidiary group referred to as "Forged in the Dark" games based on Evil Hat Games' Blades in the Dark. These games tend to be "love them or hate them" (and personally I'm in the latter category), but they're extremely easy to make, so there are tons of them out there. Chances are that if you walk into a game store and see a very short game book with a very quirky title, it's likely to be a PBTA game.

Of course there are a million-and-one cases that none of these apply to. There are several other systems with multiple games under them (such as Omni System, Ubiquity, Unisystem, Tri-Stat, Palladium, etc), but these are the ones with the largest footprints in the hobby at the moment. There are also plenty of games that use systems all their own (Traveler, World of Darkness and Cyberpunk being particularly important examples). Others can, and probably will, have corrections to make to this list, but it should be useful as a primer.

Quote from: ForgottenF on January 21, 2023, 01:53:50 PM
As an addendum to my previous comment, If you're getting into Tabletop RPGs brand new, it's probably worth getting a crash course on what you might call the "family tree" of RPG systems. I'll do my best here.

--D20 system: There's some nuance here, but broadly speaking Dungeons & Dragons and all it's derivatives fall into this category. Being perfectly accurate, "D20" only refers to games based on D&D 3.0 or later. Games based on the 2nd or earlier editions of D&D (often referred to as "OSR games") technically are not "D20 games" for historical reasons not worth getting into here, but the core structure and concepts are similar enough that being conversant in one is highly useful for understanding the others. D20 games are characterized by being class and level based, often with a multitude of playable races, using saving throws, and having rolling on a d20 with bonuses be the predominant mechanic.

--"Basic Roleplaying" or D100 systems: Basic Roleplaying (or BRP) is the genericized version of the system used by Chaosium Inc. for its Call of Cthulhu and Runequest lines. The BRP system is mostly only used by Chaosium, but there are a few other notable games that have licensed or copied it, and the Warhammer and Warhammer 40K RPGs use very similar systems. There are also a few more obscure (usually British) games such as Maelstrom that use substantially similar systems. These games usually don't use class or level, and the primary mechanic is rolling d100 and trying to get below a target number determined by skill or attribute scores.

--GURPS and Savage Worlds: Mechanically quite different, but I will lump them together on the grounds that both are generic roleplaying systems with lots of different settings and rules published for them. In both cases, their systems are not much used outside of products explicitly attached to the main system.

--Modiphius 2d20: As previously mentioned, the proprietary system of a single publisher, characterized by rolling multiple d20s and trying to get under a target number on each one. The 2d20 system tends to be poorly regarded by most in the hobby, but Modiphius is highly successful at licensing big properties such as Conan, Dune and Fallout, so their games still turn up a lot at game stores and in online spaces.

--D6 games: a loose family of games by lots of different publishers, using only 6-sided dice, often with a "dice-pool" core mechanic. Not hugely popular, but with a dedicated fanbase (especially around here). The godfather of this family of games seems to be West End Games' Star Wars.

--Powered by the Apocalypse: A large family of narrative-heavy games descending from D. Vincent Baker's Apocalypse World. There's also a subsidiary group referred to as "Forged in the Dark" games based on Evil Hat Games' Blades in the Dark. These games tend to be "love them or hate them" (and personally I'm in the latter category), but they're extremely easy to make, so there are tons of them out there. Chances are that if you walk into a game store and see a very short game book with a very quirky title, it's likely to be a PBTA game.

Of course there are a million-and-one cases that none of these apply to. There are several other systems with multiple games under them (such as Omni System, Ubiquity, Unisystem, Tri-Stat, Palladium, etc), but these are the ones with the largest footprints in the hobby at the moment. There are also plenty of games that use systems all their own (Traveler, World of Darkness and Cyberpunk being particularly important examples). Others can, and probably will, have corrections to make to this list, but it should be useful as a primer.

D6 games can be quick to learn, and simple to run.  They tend toward simplicity.  Many are not "dice pool" games.  Many use D6 Roll + Modifier, which is reminiscent of D20 Roll + Modifier.  Many D6 based games, are also a complete game in a single book; so they have a small, one time cost.

Quote from: Jam The MF on January 21, 2023, 02:02:33 PMD6 games can be quick to learn, and simple to run.  They tend toward simplicity.  Many are not "dice pool" games.  Many use D6 Roll + Modifier, which is reminiscent of D20 Roll + Modifier.  Many D6 based games, are also a complete game in a single book; so they have a small, one time cost.

One of the games we looked at was Forbidden Lands by Free League. It seems to use a D6 system... I think it is from another one of their games called "Mutant Zero" according to their website anyway.

What about Lamentations of the Flame Princess? I heard this is an "old DnD-like" and also ahs darker themes and weird fantasy aspects and stuff?

Just after chatting, I am thinking maybe I might bring up going with a game we can just buy strait away, instead of waiting for a kicker to be produced. Even if it is not DnD.

Quote from: Summon666 on January 21, 2023, 08:56:43 PM

Quote from: Jam The MF on January 21, 2023, 02:02:33 PMD6 games can be quick to learn, and simple to run.  They tend toward simplicity.  Many are not "dice pool" games.  Many use D6 Roll + Modifier, which is reminiscent of D20 Roll + Modifier.  Many D6 based games, are also a complete game in a single book; so they have a small, one time cost.

One of the games we looked at was Forbidden Lands by Free League. It seems to use a D6 system... I think it is from another one of their games called "Mutant Zero" according to their website anyway.

What about Lamentations of the Flame Princess? I heard this is an "old DnD-like" and also ahs darker themes and weird fantasy aspects and stuff?

Just after chatting, I am thinking maybe I might bring up going with a game we can just buy strait away, instead of waiting for a kicker to be produced. Even if it is not DnD.

Lamentations of the Flame Princess, is supposed to be based upon D&D BX; but it's also a different flavor of game.  I believe it uses all the dice, like BX does?

Quote from: Summon666 on January 21, 2023, 08:56:43 PM

Quote from: Jam The MF on January 21, 2023, 02:02:33 PMD6 games can be quick to learn, and simple to run.  They tend toward simplicity.  Many are not "dice pool" games.  Many use D6 Roll + Modifier, which is reminiscent of D20 Roll + Modifier.  Many D6 based games, are also a complete game in a single book; so they have a small, one time cost.

One of the games we looked at was Forbidden Lands by Free League. It seems to use a D6 system... I think it is from another one of their games called "Mutant Zero" according to their website anyway.

What about Lamentations of the Flame Princess? I heard this is an "old DnD-like" and also ahs darker themes and weird fantasy aspects and stuff?

Just after chatting, I am thinking maybe I might bring up going with a game we can just buy strait away, instead of waiting for a kicker to be produced. Even if it is not DnD.

Like Jam said, Lamentations is essentially a homebrewed version of Basic D&D. Very easy to learn, very easy to run, and the Rules & Magic book is available cheaply off of Amazon. A couple of qualifiers, though. One is that the game does not come with a bestiary or monster manual, so you'll have to homebrew all your own monsters, or buy a bestiary for one of the games its cross-compatible with. Also, Lamentations' unique selling point is its library of published adventures, (which do include monster stats within them). Lamentations adventures have a pretty specific tone to them, which I would describe as 17th-century historical horror, refracted through a prism of black metal aesthetics, so expect lots of witchcraft, satanism, gore, body horror and adult content. That may or may not be your group's cup of tea. Also, hard copies of the adventures are running a little pricey these days, and the publisher has had some distribution issues.

If you specifically want a dark fantasy game, Shadow of the Demon Lord is pretty popular these days. The writer formerly worked on a lot of Warhammer Fantasy RPG books and some of the setting and tone elements are carried over, but the system itself is more derived from D&D. I'd call it a medium complexity game. Character creation and leveling up is pretty involved, but the rules used in play are relatively simple. Symbaroum, also from Free League, is pretty much a dark fantasy game as well, and has a good-sized following.

For what it's worth, my own pick for a starter-RPG would be Index Card RPG (Master Edition). An incredibly easy game to learn and play, and I think it would be especially so for people coming from board games. Much like Arkham Horror, the abilities and stats of player characters are largely static, and their progression and specialization is largely done through items. There's a free quickstart kit available (https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/221038/INDEX-CARD-RPG-Free-Quickstart?term=index+card+rpg), but the Master Edition is pretty serious value-for-money (https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/366519/Index-Card-RPG-Master-Edition?src=hottest_filtered). For $17 plus shipping, you get rules, races, classes, loot tables, monsters and adventure ideas for four different settings (fantasy, sci fi, wild west and stone age), as well as a good advice section for new DMs. It might not be the best game for long campaigns, but people don't usually do very long campaigns when they're just starting out.

The author of ICRPG has done quite a few videos on how the game works, including recording several streamed games of it:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLlSmiQ728Xr0PrOUiJjt9sfmv2JkgoF8w

It's worth remembering that if you and your friends do get into RPGs you probably won't stick with just one. The beauty of the hobby is the insane breadth of different systems genres and settings you can play with.

Ok.. so we are now considering other rpgs and are in the rabbit hole of "what to play". Thing about DnD is that it is a simple choice. A known pop culture quantity with a lot of support. Youtube vids, books, forums, reddits... . game groups etc etc. You just go "DnD" and you know what it is.. all these other games are confusing as I do not really know what they are.

I couldn't find ICRPG in a physical book.. is it only avalible as a pdf on drivethrough.. I couldn't even find a homepage for it?

Quote from: Summon666 on January 21, 2023, 10:28:49 PM
Ok.. so we are now considering other rpgs and are in the rabbit hole of "what to play". Thing about DnD is that it is a simple choice. A known pop culture quantity with a lot of support. Youtube vids, books, forums, reddits... . game groups etc etc. You just go "DnD" and you know what it is.. all these other games are confusing as I do not really know what they are.

I couldn't find ICRPG in a physical book.. is it only avalible as a pdf on drivethrough.. I couldn't even find a homepage for it?

For ICRPG the quickstart is only available in PDF (since its free). The Master Edition is available as print-on-demand. That's DrivethruRPG's specialty, and is frequently the only way to get RPG books from smaller publishers. The way that works is you put your order in, and then Drivethru passes that order to a printing shop they have an agreement with, which makes the book and then ships it to you. The only serious downside is that it takes a bit longer for you to get your book than if the publisher has a stockpile of them lying around. Usually about 2-4 weeks in my experience.

For the record, there's nothing wrong with starting with Dungeons & Dragons. Most people do, and a lot of people keep playing it their whole lives. (There's a joke floating around RPG circles that D&D is everyone's second-favorite game). It's not the simplest game in the world, but if you start the characters at level 1, you can learn as you go. You won't get it recommended much on this particular forum, because this is both a niche interest forum and a bit of a refuge for RPG dissidents. But even here, a high percentage of people are either playing older editions of D&D or games based on them. You'll get a lot of arguments on forums about which edition is best, but you'll probably want to go with the current (5th) edition, just because it'll be the easiest to find people playing it. Everybody on this forum can give you a laundry list of their issues with 5th Edition (myself included), but those might not be noticeable to people new to the hobby.

If you're going to start up 5th edition D&D, you really only need the Player's Handbook (preferably a couple of them), and the Dungeon Master will probably want a Monster Manual. The Dungeon Master's Guide is largely optional. I would hold off on the official Wizards of the Coast expansion books (Tasha's Guide, Xanathar's Guide etc.). They just add additional complications without improving the game in any meaningful way. The third-party publishing market for 5th Edition is pretty insane though. A lot of settings for other games have had 5e versions published for them, and there are tons of adventures out there you can run. The official 5th Edition adventures get mixed reviews, but a number of classic adventures from older editions have been republished for 5th edition by Goodman Games (https://www.amazon.com/s?k=Goodman+Games). I haven't played it, but everybody talks up Keep on the Borderlands.

If you want to Lovecraft your game up a bit, this book might be useful: https://petersengames.com/the-games-shop/cthulhu-mythos-for-5e/

If you're leery of Wizards of the Coast, Pathfinder is pretty much the Pepsi to D&D's Coca Cola (as in, its basically the same game under different branding), and probably the second most played game out there right now. I haven't followed the 2nd edition of Pathfinder, but the first edition had the option of buying the books in smaller, cheaper paperback versions, which was nice.

EDIT: Thought about this a bit more, and you probably shouldn't be buying supplements at all at this point. They aren't cheap, and you don't need to outlay that kind of money until you and your group actually know you like a game.

First of all, this is a GREAT time to be getting into tabletop gaming. Not only are there already a ton of products and game systems to choose from, but the recent kerfuffle with WotC will only inject MORE creativity and "outside-the-box" thinking into the games once things settle down. At least, that's my assessment.

If you really must have 5e books, though, my suggestion is look for used copies. I haven't looked, but I imagine with the recent debacle, some people may be looking to sell off their 5e collections. You may be able to find a good amount of material for relatively cheap, AND you won't be giving your money to a company that has demonstrated they are untrustworthy, and who will probably turn it's back on the Tabletop industry within the year anyway.

My personal suggestion, however, is to look into Savage Worlds. It is a "medium crunch" system, meaning the rules are a fairly even blend of strict mechanics and freeform interpretation. It's a game that is easy to learn, but difficult to master, which isn't meant as a discouragement... what I mean is, as you continue to learn the intricacies of the system, you will learn more and more ways to fine-tune it to your playstyle. The pdf for Savage Worlds Adventure Edition (SWADE) is only $10, but you can try out their "Test Drive" rules for free (download HERE). Also, if you're a fan of horror, you're in luck, since Savage Worlds has just released their new updated rules on their Horror Companion. It provides new rules to use the Core mechanics to run anything from a slasher-film theme to Lovecraftian horror to dramatic suspense... including a blend of any of the above. Want to play in the Lovecraft mythos but without Sanity rules? No problem! The Horror Companion is a toolbox to aid you in creating a game, not something that shackles you with rules.

There is also Pathfinder For Savage Worlds setting (often simple called "Savage Pathfinder") if you want to try a DnD-esque experience with the Savage Worlds rules. The setting book is an "all-in-one" affair, meaning all the rules from the Core SWADE book are ALREADY in the Pathfinder for SW book, plus a bunch of new rules designed to capture the feel of Pathfinder 1e. If you wish to try to convert some DnD loyalists to Savage Worlds, this may be your safest bet. From what I hear, many are already making the switch.

Anyway, there's my shameless pitch. Take it for what it's worth.