It's been mentioned before - Talislanta: Epic Edition is coming. Originally it was going to be 5e, then the wisely moved to dual-stat-edition with classic rules. Now they've dropped the 5e version entirely and are going pure Talislanta.
Here is the new artwork of the races.
https://everythingepic.myportfolio.com/talislanta-archetypes
Landscapes
https://everythingepic.myportfolio.com/talislanta-landscapes
They had a lot of this project done before the whole OGL debacle... Steve Sechi, made the call to drop all the 5e development. That takes guts. But that means they're likely doing a lot of rework. Anyhow, I thought you guys might be interested.
Disclaimer: I'm attached to the project. Now that it's not 5e, I can get behind it, heh. I'm working on the Savage Worlds conversion for any of you Savage Lands players out there. If you ever wanted to take a crack at Talislanta (which has a great system in its own right) the Savage Lands rules will be SWADE so if you wanna port your stuff over, or bring some Talislanta into your game, now you can!
Artwork looks fantastic. What's the best place to follow the project?
What is the pitch versus the five earlier editions? Is there a discussion page anywhere?
Pitch (ignore anything about 5e now): https://gamefound.com/projects/cbatarlis/talislanta
Discussion: https://www.facebook.com/groups/2211928311
Cool, thanks
I do have some inside info... but not sure what I can say.
What I probably can say is that it moves up the timeline (but not too much). It sets the perfect time for people that never played Talislanta to get in on "the ground floor". It also doesn't change much of the big Talislanta sandbox for veteran fans of the setting. You'll be right at home.
There *are* some in-setting shifts... and I'll be honest, I think they're good and make a lot of sense. Functionally it's a redrawing of the political map between a lot of the cultures, but in a conservative way. They didn't suddenly make the Beastmen "good guys" or anything like that.
And you know.. in the sense of *real* diversity - you can't match Talislanta. The number of playable races, the cultures, the politics within the main cultures, give a GM and their players a ton of options to do some great campaigning. And the Talislanta system still stands as one of best designs ever. Magic is rich, powerful and contextually plentiful (and dangerous). The whole system is ridiculously easy to learn. So I'll throw this in there for anyone that has entertained the idea of playing Talislanta over all these years, or if you've never heard of Talislanta before, this is a good train to jump on.
ALSO - you don't have to wait to get a taste of what the system is like. All the Talislanta editions (with the exception of Talislanta: The Savage Lands) are *free* on www.Talislanta.com. The differences between the editions are pretty mild (but there *are* differences - mostly in the Magic system), they're all 99.9% compatible. Technically speaking you can use all the magic-systems from all the editions in the game simultaneously if you're perverted like me.
Ain't my thing, but danged if I'm not glad to see Talislanta still in the mix nowadays.
I'm intrigued by Savage Talislanta.
Tenbones, is the SW version just diferent mechanics or will the setting be somewhat different as well?
I never really played or got into Talislanta mainly because it was on the periphery and we were all playing WFRP at the time.
But I loved Savage Lands. So I'm definitely going to check this new version out.
Quote from: Spinachcat on January 28, 2023, 06:47:00 PM
I'm intrigued by Savage Talislanta.
Tenbones, is the SW version just diferent mechanics or will the setting be somewhat different as well?
Currently* I'm building races at +4 values like in SW Pathfinder, plus an Archetype (think Profession) and we're making some "lifepath" tables to roll on. Nothing wild like and actual lifepath from CP2020, more like the M.A.R.S. tables from Savage Rifts.
Magic will be a little different in the sense that that Arcane Backgrounds will reflect Talislantas schools, but the mechanics will be solidly SWADE. There will be new setting and cultural Edges... sweet jesus there are a lot of races.
Gear and vehicle translations. Ship combat. etc.etc.
*don't hold me to this, everything is subject to change.
Is Savage Talislanta going to be a formal product or is it a personal project?
What is the setting like for Talislanta? I really know nothing about it.
I'll be in on this. Nice to see the update coming. And a SWADE version will be cool to see. I'm glad they jumped off of the fucking 5E bandwagon. I was so disappointed at the first release's mention of it being a 5E product.
Quote from: Batjon on January 29, 2023, 08:44:36 AM
What is the setting like for Talislanta? I really know nothing about it.
"No elves," is the tagline, iirc, in old Dragon magazine ads for the game.
Sorry, but I can't recall much more than that, and the utterly bewildering amount of playable character races available. Had two editions (maybe three) pass through my hands at some point but nothing about the game called to me much - and that's on me, mind you, not the game itself.
Quote from: tenbones on January 28, 2023, 01:01:27 AM
It's been mentioned before - Talislanta: Epic Edition is coming. Originally it was going to be 5e, then the wisely moved to dual-stat-edition with classic rules. Now they've dropped the 5e version entirely and are going pure Talislanta.
That is good news. Dual stat books are terrible. Better to published different compatible versions as separate books.
Quote from: Batjon on January 29, 2023, 08:44:36 AM
What is the setting like for Talislanta? I really know nothing about it.
All the old editions are free downloads. 2e is quite good.
http://talislanta.com/talislanta-library (http://talislanta.com/talislanta-library)
Definitely a setting worth checking out. I'm very surprised it didn't catch on.
Perhaps the lack of elves? :)
The setting for Talislanta is like this...
A race of Sorcerer-kings with godlike powers, living in flying cities, bending reality with their spells ends up casting one spell too many. The they blow up their world and enter into an apocalyptic dark age that last centuries. Some of them survive... alongside many of the servitor races they created, but they all descend back down to near barbarism. Centuries go by, empires rise and fall. Until finally... the modern era, new kingdoms, city-states with a LOT of sentient races that have all developed their own distinct cultures, now vie for power.
It's high/low magic (depending on where you start your game), Sword-and-Sorcery vibe. Lots of barbarian and high-fantasy cultures smushed against one another. Ancient ruins galore. Tons of exotic locales. There are no Elves (no humans either!) There's a lot of history to the setting but the current era is like near-renaissance for the "core" starting region (Called the Seven Kingdoms in the older editions). It's very much a massive sandbox that any GM can pick a location and just go wild. You don't have to know a lot about it, just find a spot and jump in.
Quote from: Dropbear on January 29, 2023, 09:17:16 AM
I'll be in on this. Nice to see the update coming. And a SWADE version will be cool to see. I'm glad they jumped off of the fucking 5E bandwagon. I was so disappointed at the first release's mention of it being a 5E product.
On a side note, I was shocked to learn that FFG/Edge's Midnight release was a 5e release and not Genesys. I loved that setting, but noped out as soon as I found out.
The "no humans" has been the hardest part for me to wrap my head around. That said, a lot of the races feel like humans divided in a more 19th century view of race.
Quote from: PulpHerb on January 30, 2023, 11:30:59 AM
The "no humans" has been the hardest part for me to wrap my head around. That said, a lot of the races feel like humans divided in a more 19th century view of race.
There is *definitely* that.
The Sorcerer-kings were called the Archaens, and they are what the Cymrilians, Phantasians, Tanasians, and a few others are originally descended from. Many of the other races in Talislanta were the creations of the Archaens, who lived in their flying cities high above the surface world, which they ceded to ther "Beastmen".
So when they brought the 'Great Cataclysm' down upon their world, those flying cities inhabitants died out in spectacular fashion... but there were survivors, who would struggle through the post-apocalypse (Talislanta: The Savage Lands is the edition that details that era), would eventually rise up again to create their own kingdoms and empires thousands of years later.
The current era has many of those non-Archaen servitor races now leading their own nations, or tribes... and of course there are the Beastmen tribes... which have their own subdivisions as well.
So yeah, there's "No Elves" (and no Humans) as tongue-in-cheek poke at DnD... but there is plenty here most DnD players will find to their liking. And a lot of stuff that will be "new". The setting pretty awesome and expansive. I like to call it "exotically familiar".
Quote from: tenbones on January 30, 2023, 03:47:39 PM
The Sorcerer-kings were called the Archaens, and they are what the Cymrilians, Phantasians, Tanasians, and a few others are originally descended from. Many of the other races in Talislanta were the creations of the Archaens, who lived in their flying cities high above the surface world, which they ceded to ther "Beastmen".
Yeah. I found if I think of the Sorcerer-kings as "humans" and Cymrilians, Phantasians, etc as just their descendants broken into different ethnicities it makes it a lot easier to ground myself.
They're kinda like "good" Melniboneans. Tall, beautiful, deep arcane tradition that includes planar travel and crazy feats of sorcery that dwarfs the imaginations of mere mortals.
But the rest of the game has a shocking amount of wild elements that were way ahead of its time. Ironically all the wild weird shit in modern DnD that exists without ANY cultural context, can be found here in Talislanta, with *specific* context and history.
Cat People - The Jaka. Very cool and interesting take on an evolved "beastman".
Tieflings - Na-Ku, Rajans may qualify.
Goth Edgelords - Xambrians
Blue Snowflakes - Mirin
Dark Blue Good Drow - Ariane
Good Bird People - Gryph, Aeriad
Bad Bird People - Stryx
+30 or more other cultures and races that no D&D player has yet dreamed up, all contextual to the setting.
Quote from: tenbones on January 30, 2023, 05:20:20 PM
They're kinda like "good" Melniboneans. Tall, beautiful, deep arcane tradition that includes planar travel and crazy feats of sorcery that dwarfs the imaginations of mere mortals.
But the rest of the game has a shocking amount of wild elements that were way ahead of its time. Ironically all the wild weird shit in modern DnD that exists without ANY cultural context, can be found here in Talislanta, with *specific* context and history.
Cat People - The Jaka. Very cool and interesting take on an evolved "beastman".
Tieflings - Na-Ku, Rajans may qualify.
Goth Edgelords - Xambrians
Blue Snowflakes - Mirin
Dark Blue Good Drow - Ariane
Good Bird People - Gryph, Aeriad
Bad Bird People - Stryx
+30 or more other cultures and races that no D&D player has yet dreamed up, all contextual to the setting.
Thanks for the mapping. It'll help me cut down who players can be.
Well the *problem* in D&D is not that these things exist, per se. It's that they tend to exist with no context for them in the setting.
Just like D&D is a freakshow because the party consists of all these weird things, in any setting, just because the race stats exist. Players assume that they can just play them. Noob GM's don't actually curate them. So it's weird shit, often in established settings that didn't have those things.
In Talislanta - nothing exists without a historical reason. So it's not really a problem (mostly) to have weird shit. Talislanta is full of weird shit on purpose. There are cultural issues with a lot of the races, that might preclude them from mixing in a party without the GM being really specific on how it might work.
But for new players that really want to get a taste of playing "oddball" races - Talislanta has them covered on much of it. And does it in a way that usually won't clash with the assumed gameplay in most regions.
Tenbones
Do you know what year they are advancing the timeline to? I know 611NA was the fall of the Quan and looking at the map see Kang empire on there.
I might give it a look when the new edition hits.
Quote from: drakinfar on January 30, 2023, 07:49:48 PM
Tenbones
Do you know what year they are advancing the timeline to? I know 611NA was the fall of the Quan and looking at the map see Kang empire on there.
I have *my* extrapolation based on the post-Submen Uprising. But I don't know what the "exact" date is as things are getting tidied up behind the scenes. But it looks like about 10-years give or take.
And yes, the Quan empire falls as the Kang take over. That was true even as of 4e. The Submen uprising results in a bunch of major shifts in the political alliances and even the existence of some major players in Talislanta.
Kickstarter or traditional publishing? Either way I'm onboard to purchase upon release. I played 1st and 2nd edition Talislanta, and it definitely scratches the itch when you want something completely different that is still internally consistent.
Quote from: Brad on January 31, 2023, 10:47:40 AM
Kickstarter or traditional publishing? Either way I'm onboard to purchase upon release. I played 1st and 2nd edition Talislanta, and it definitely scratches the itch when you want something completely different that is still internally consistent.
2E seems to be the favorite germline of the editions. It hits the sweet spot between 4e and 3e. Talislanta: The Savage Lands was using mostly a 2e design. I would think this new edition will likely be pulling from there too. But that is my speculation, as I'm more concerned with doing the Savage Worlds translation.
Of course I'll be all-in on both.
10 year advance should be nice. The sweet spot for me when I ran games was always starting around Quantrigue and Submen uprising shows players that the world is dangerous.
What are the key differences between 1e & 2e?
And what's the new edition trying to achieve mechanically that's new?
Second Edition added more skill definitions, much more setting content (but it's still pretty lean until you get to the regional books). Same basic system - skill driven but effectively just a cleaned up version of 1e.
I don't know *anyone* that uses 1e. But it's completely compatible with 2e. (as all editions are at the basic level). The biggest mechanical differences are 3e vs. everything else.
As for what they're bringing mechanically to the new edition? I don't know, I'm being asked to do the Savage Worlds edition. But my opinion is this: they're likely going to keep it in the Talislanta family, and not make changes that don't need to be made. It'll probably riff off of 2e, since that was the edition is the one Steve likes best, which is perfectly fine with everyone. 3e and 4e did a good job of differentiation without actually breaking anything.
Talislanta: Savage Lands was made off of the 2e engine and frankly it works with all the editions pretty easily. You could use it on the fly without any real issues that you couldn't eyeball easily. I imagine it'll be very similar with the new edition, but I know know that for fact.
Quote from: tenbones on February 01, 2023, 11:18:21 AMI'm being asked to do the Savage Worlds edition.
How will that be implemented? A supplement with SWADE stats? How will people get access to it? I don't think I saw any information on that on the crowd funding page.
Quote from: dbm on February 02, 2023, 08:23:31 AM
Quote from: tenbones on February 01, 2023, 11:18:21 AMI'm being asked to do the Savage Worlds edition.
How will that be implemented? A supplement with SWADE stats? How will people get access to it? I don't think I saw any information on that on the crowd funding page.
To be determined. Things are in a big shuffle since they were mostly done with the 5e version, then after the OGL debacle, they dropped the 5e version entirely. I came in after. For now it's going to be a PDF version that will be an option in KS. Still working out all the details behind the scenes. It could become more? I'm currently working on all the core stuff - races, archetypes (think Professional Edges/Cultural Edges) and of course converting the magic-system and gear.
I may do a modified ship-combat system because... airships are a *thing*.
The decision to convert to other systems is a direct reaction to the OGL debacle, and I think it's a good idea as it will give the Talislanta some potential options for fans of other systems to get a taste for the setting. Savage Worlds fans seem to love anything running on the engine... and the system is a very good fit for the Talislanta sword-and-high sorcery, feel.
It would certainly flip me from 'interested' to 'backing'...
;D
Quote from: tenbones on February 02, 2023, 10:28:44 AM
Savage Worlds fans seem to love anything running on the engine... and the system is a very good fit for the Talislanta sword-and-high sorcery, feel.
This is pretty accurate. It's the point of the system, after all. For me, I wouldn't say I love everything running on the system, but I am positively inclined.
The artwork for the Talislanta campaign looks pretty good, but I'm not terribly motivated to read through all of the legacy material to run or play a game. It's a different game, sure, but how different is Talislanta that I want to expend that effort when I have two shelves full of various editions of D&D?
Put it in Savage Worlds and I probably back the project. I have a shiny new Fantasy Companion on the way and no particular plans for what to do with it.
I see the campaign has launched; no mention of Savage Worlds rules at the moment?
Talislanta has so many races and concepts that get ruined by political correctness, I just assumed any new version would get rid of ideas like "A race named Thrall that was bred to be warrior-slaves and have a penalty to Intelligence rating as a result".
Is the setting really not getting fucked up the ass by the current hellscape?
I tried getting into Talislanta a couple decades back with the blue book and it just felt... murky to me, for lack of a better word. The huge variety of races and places and groups was overloading and made it difficult for me to get a solid picture on who was doing what. It's been forever since I last took any kind of look at it, so I'm vague at best now on particulars, but the setting just bounced off of my brain from the density of the presentation. Which is weird, I can tell you all about the countries in Conan which also has plenty of vastly differing cultures and I'm all about cool detailed settings.
Quote from: Venka on March 14, 2023, 02:54:15 PM
Talislanta has so many races and concepts that get ruined by political correctness, I just assumed any new version would get rid of ideas like "A race named Thrall that was bred to be warrior-slaves and have a penalty to Intelligence rating as a result".
Is the setting really not getting fucked up the ass by the current hellscape?
I'm not familiar with the past editions, so I can't really say what's been changed. On the bright side, the game still uses "race" and has non-SJW art--females are allowed to be attractive and show skin. So that's a plus. Looking over the preview pages, the Thrall Warrior seems to have a low intelligence score if you pick the Talislanta archetype, though there's no intelligence penalty when you look at the D&D 5e conversion stats (they get +2 to Str and Con).
Quote from: Brand55 on March 14, 2023, 06:13:31 PM
I'm not familiar with the past editions, so I can't really say what's been changed. On the bright side, the game still uses "race" and has non-SJW art--females are allowed to be attractive and show skin. So that's a plus.
Those are both positive signs for sure. The "race or species/ancestry/bloodline" thing is about to become a serious shibboleth. Like many of these things, it's easy as pie for the movers in this field (anyone who says "race" is blood in the water for the twitter sharks), but not so easy for the side of reason, as there are valid reasons (especially in science fiction games) to say something else. The ability to show skin is definitely great, but I will point out that feminism is not the ascendant head on this hydra at the moment. Still, together, that's something.
QuoteLooking over the preview pages, the Thrall Warrior seems to have a low intelligence score if you pick the Talislanta archetype, though there's no intelligence penalty when you look at the D&D 5e conversion stats (they get +2 to Str and Con).
Well, 5e almost never offers stat penalties even when it very badly needs them. As long as the real game still gives a penalty or simply sticks the player with a low score though, I'd say it's legit. Remember that D&D 5e is so far gone that it's considered racist to even have racial stat bonuses, because having a +2 to Str and a +2 to Con means that you
can't have a racial bonus of +2 to Int, which is what the "optional" Tasha's rules allow. So even having that is a political statement.
Quote from: Spinachcat on January 30, 2023, 04:12:18 AM
Quote from: Batjon on January 29, 2023, 08:44:36 AM
What is the setting like for Talislanta? I really know nothing about it.
All the old editions are free downloads. 2e is quite good.
http://talislanta.com/talislanta-library (http://talislanta.com/talislanta-library)
Definitely a setting worth checking out. I'm very surprised it didn't catch on.
Perhaps the lack of elves? :)
That's a pretty incredible resource - thanks!
I pretty much always find it's best to start off with the 1st edition of an old game, before there's too much accumulation, then maybe look at 2nd edition if 1e's an unsatisfyingly rough draft.
Quote from: S'mon on March 15, 2023, 03:51:39 AM
I pretty much always find it's best to start off with the 1st edition of an old game, before there's too much accumulation, then maybe look at 2nd edition if 1e's an unsatisfyingly rough draft.
1e Tal is still my favorite version: concise, clear and complete. You could run just about any setting with the core system (it was "True20" before True20). Start with 1e, and if you like it DriveThru has a POD of it, in hardcover.
What is the magic system for the new (non-Savage) edition of Talislanta going to be like compared to other editions?
Magic has always been central to Talislanta for me and was the big reason I never got The Savage Land. I really liked a lot of what 4e was trying to do with magic, but I don't feel that it succeeded. The ideas were good but the numbers never quite worked on a mechanical level.
Other than that this sounds like something to look out for. Though hopefully it won't be coming too soon as my disposable income for this year has already been reserved for the DCC Dying Earth boxed set and the Dolmenwood kickstarter at physical reward levels when those come out. (Damn it, now I'm going to drag out Talislanta books and start brainstorming a DCC Talislanta game that I know I'll never get round to running.)
Seems interesting. I've got the "New Talislanta" maybe a few years ago? 2018 or something?
The PCs looks good, but there are some drows and orcs in there, no matter what they call them. I like the tattooed folks and four armed people, wish they could focus on them.
The landscapes seem a bit AI but cool.
I'll probably get that someday... regardless of system, since I'm playing exclusively OSR nowadays (although I do think talislanta has a decent system of its own).
Quote from: tenbones on January 28, 2023, 01:01:27 AM
It's been mentioned before - Talislanta: Epic Edition is coming. Originally it was going to be 5e, then the wisely moved to dual-stat-edition with classic rules. Now they've dropped the 5e version entirely and are going pure Talislanta.
Here is the new artwork of the races.
https://everythingepic.myportfolio.com/talislanta-archetypes
Landscapes
https://everythingepic.myportfolio.com/talislanta-landscapes
They had a lot of this project done before the whole OGL debacle... Steve Sechi, made the call to drop all the 5e development. That takes guts. But that means they're likely doing a lot of rework. Anyhow, I thought you guys might be interested.
Disclaimer: I'm attached to the project. Now that it's not 5e, I can get behind it, heh. I'm working on the Savage Worlds conversion for any of you Savage Lands players out there. If you ever wanted to take a crack at Talislanta (which has a great system in its own right) the Savage Lands rules will be SWADE so if you wanna port your stuff over, or bring some Talislanta into your game, now you can!
This might get me to reconsider Savage Worlds.
Quote from: Dropbear on January 29, 2023, 09:17:16 AM
I'll be in on this. Nice to see the update coming. And a SWADE version will be cool to see. I'm glad they jumped off of the fucking 5E bandwagon. I was so disappointed at the first release's mention of it being a 5E product.
To be honest using Savage Worlds is just another bandwagon that a lot of people have clutched to over the years.
If they really wanted to do something that would fit the Talislanta world better they'd use the D6 System. As a game system Savage Worlds doesn't fit Talislanta well. But I admit I think Savage Worlds kinda just sucks as a game engine. That's just my own personal opinion though.
Quote from: RebelSky on March 15, 2023, 12:30:54 PM
Quote from: Dropbear on January 29, 2023, 09:17:16 AM
I'll be in on this. Nice to see the update coming. And a SWADE version will be cool to see. I'm glad they jumped off of the fucking 5E bandwagon. I was so disappointed at the first release's mention of it being a 5E product.
To be honest using Savage Worlds is just another bandwagon that a lot of people have clutched to over the years.
If they really wanted to do something that would fit the Talislanta world better they'd use the D6 System. As a game system Savage Worlds doesn't fit Talislanta well. But I admit I think Savage Worlds kinda just sucks as a game engine. That's just my own personal opinion though.
They did D6 for the Talislanta Savage Lands which is the the earlier no magic version from a few years back. It was nice but I tend to prefer the normal Talislanta system which is light and plays well. You are wrong about Savage Worlds but hey ho, it doesn't really matter.
Well officially the Savage Worlds edition is off (which mean I'm off it). Nothing acrimonious - they might still fire it up again once this current crowdfunding round happens and I'll be their guy to lead it.
Sad, but I did a lot of work on it, so I'll just keep it tucked away.
That's a real shame. It would have gotten me to back, while as it stands I already have many editions that I could convert myself.
But they are making bank on this so clearly their game plan is as good one.
Yep. And I'm happy that people are backing it.
We'll see if the SW edition gets the green light in the future. If not - no biggy. If I get the sense that it isn't going to happen, I may just release all the stuff I already made (I'll complete it first) to the public.
Sorry they nuked that, that kinda sucks.