So, let's talk modrons-- the monsters that look like dice. As you can probably tell from that statment, I know absolutely nothing about them. When I first saw them (was in in the Fiend Folio? I can't recall, it's been so long) I thought they looked ridicuolus, and I refused to read any further.
Have I made a mistake, all of these years? Is there anything cool about the modrons? How have you used them in your games?
Quote from: Aglondir;1044925So, let's talk modrons-- the monsters that look like dice. As you can probably tell from that statment, I know absolutely nothing about them. When I first saw them (was in in the Fiend Folio? I can't recall, it's been so long) I thought they looked ridicuolus, and I refused to read any further.
Have I made a mistake, all of these years? Is there anything cool about the modrons? How have you used them in your games?
As far as I can remember, they're anal retentive little fuckers that try and make thinks as orderly as absolutely possible.
They're also completely pathetic, and easily and better replaced by the robot guys from the Mech Neutral dimension.
They are based on geometric shapes mostly. Not dice. so you had ones shaped like a 4-sider and a cube. but others were cylinders, spheres, and such. Their appearance changed to a steampunk look in 2e D&D.
Originally they were just kinda... there... another aligned alien race much like the Slaad.
But 2e Planescape turned them into these weird little neo-cyborg steampunky guys who were oft presented as comic relief. Least the smaller spheres and cube versions. They gained a bit more background. But are still mostly just kinda... there.
Which is good as it allows a DM to make of them what they will. Want them to be ineffectual goofs? Done. Want them to be an implacable alien hoard? Done.
They're actually from Monster Manual 2
I never thought they were that odd, but then I had read Flatland, which uses a similar idea, only 2d
Also read a lot of Rudy Rucker. So picturing different planes ruled by geometric objects was not particularly silly or outre to me.
Quote from: JeremyR;1044941They're actually from Monster Manual 2
My goof. I'll fix that. But for some reason they still feel very Fiend Folio-ish. :D
However, every 289 years, like clockwork, they rampage causing untold death and damage on any world the DM sees fit.
Man, from the thread title I thought this thread would be about TBP.
I always thought they were created because some GM was running a game with miniatures and one day used some dice as substitute figures for some monsters. I figured that since the players wouldn't shut up about the d4 monster or the d12 monster, the GM just made a whole race of monsters to match the dice.
I mean, there's a whole race of monsters based on piss (unofficial, but still published). So why not?
Quote from: Christopher Brady;1044945However, every 289 years, like clockwork, they rampage causing untold death and damage on any world the DM sees fit.
99% comic relief literal law goofy guys, 1% Implacable representations of unfeeling order. That's how I like my Modrons. :)
Blood & Treasure includes "polyhedroids" in its monster book (modrons with tentacles instead of limbs), as well as the evil version "metal monsters" in its second monster book. Pathfinder includes "axiomites," who are basically modrons except they look like humanoids but are really made of sentient dust.
I always thought they were just another weird result of the unnecessary addition of good/evil to the previously sensible Moorcockian alignment system. Law and chaos are basically evil at their extremes, with balance and its allies being effectively good, but its makes no sense for good and evil to be separate concepts.
Quote from: Gabriel2;1044992I always thought they were created because some GM was running a game with miniatures and one day used some dice as substitute figures for some monsters. I figured that since the players wouldn't shut up about the d4 monster or the d12 monster, the GM just made a whole race of monsters to match the dice.
I can totally see that.
1d4Chan has a pretty good summary. (https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Modron) It is fun to read and seems to cover all the bases.
I loved Modrons in Planescape. They were superfun and scary NPCs.
BTW, its not related to the dice monsters, but Judges Guild's first module was called Modron. It's a town on an estuary.
Quote from: Spinachcat;1045115I loved Modrons in Planescape. They were superfun and scary NPCs.
BTW, its not related to the dice monsters, but Judges Guild's first module was called Modron. It's a town on an estuary.
Modron
City of the River GoddessThis is the largest major deepwater port close to the
City-State of the Imperial Overlord. As such, the Overlord has it under his protection, and it is a part of the CSIO domain. It existed before the Modrons of TSR, and I'm fairly convinced now, that TSR deliberately used the name making a boring creature deliberately to insult Bob and Judges Guild. The facts about the original
Modron are as follows;
Modron is a small, walled city set along the banks of the
River Modron, where it meets the salty, open waters of the
Estuary of Roglaroon. It neighbors the undersea merfolk village of
Crespar.
Ancient tales tell of a band of
Tharbrians who discovered the
Goddess Modron imprisoned by the ancient
Orichalan Dragon Lords. They freed the Goddess, and in her honor built a village on the spot where she was once imprisoned and began worshipping her. She blessed the inhabitants and the city prospered. It drew the attention of Proteus, the Shephered of Neptune, who came to be worshipped in the city as well.
The city grew into a thriving port city, and tales tell of merchant ships arriving from
Tarantis and even far off
Karak. The men of the city traded with the Merfolk of the underwater city of
Crespar located near Modron and made great profit in selling the fabulous coral and pearls to the outside world. But the disasterous orc migrations from the
Dearthwood drove travelers and merchants away and cut the city off from trade. The ships from
Karak and
Tarantis no longer braved its ports. In less than 50 years the once flourishing city had lost most of its inhabitants. The remaining followers of the Goddess and God blamed each other's Deity for the loss.
Civil strive erupted and the floating
Temple of Proteus was submerged in the Holocaust and the god Proteus withdrew his protection of the city. The city was finally sacked and burned by orcs. Raiders in longships carried away most of the remaining men and women. The survivors fled when the orc scavengers moved into the ruins for a final pillage, hefting tons of marble into the river or carrying it away for their own purposes.
The Temple of Modron, being underground and underwater unlike the once-floating
Temple of Proteus , was left unscathed and the worship of the goddess Modron continued by the mermen and seafolk of the underwater city of Crespar, though Crespar itself came under the rule of the Triton Coral Kingdom.
Recently, with funds from the City-State, a new town was founded by the followers of
Mitra on the ruins of the old city to protect the Overlord's merchant ships from river pirates. Maelstrom, a giant sea monster, with an allegiance to the City-State, protects the builders and patrols the
Estuary of Roglaroon doing the will of the Overlord, though by what means his aid was achieved is a mystery. The original name of the city was retained because of its evocative history of magnificent warships and high wizards in the songs of the bards.
The past fifty years has seen the new port again filled with sailors, merchants, and buccaneers.
Anoethin is the current patriarch-king of
Modron. Few of the current inhabitants guess the secrets far beneath the deceptively placid waters surrounding their new home and have abandoned any worship of the Goddess for whom the city was originally named.
Modron (Large Town): Conventional; Alignment LN; Tech Lvl 9, wealth 461,250 Gp, Population 4,912, (1,230 able bodied men), Mixed, Human 79% (Mostly
Allyrian, Tharbrian, and Skandik), Halflings 9%, Elf 5%, Dwarf 3%, others 4%; Resources: Market. Authority figures
King Anoethin, male human, LN Cleric Lvl 10.
Shalot, female, human, LG Cleric Level 10 (High Priestess of the Temple of Mitra).
Somniboot, male human Fight L8 (noted local pirate lord, owner of the Sloop
Firestar with a crew of 31. Kills gnomes on sight.)
General Modronel male human Ftr 9 (Head of the Interior Guard),
Duke Kralanor, male human LG, Paladin 5 (King's cousin, and in charge of the King's Warehouses)>
I always found Leviathan and the cenobites from the Hellraiser mythos (more specifically the elaboration in the comics (https://www.scribd.com/document/89727788/Hell-Raiser-Comic-Series-Bible)) more interesting as representatives of Moorcockian order than the modrons. In one of the comics featuring the staple-faced cenobite "Face" (yep, that's its name), titled "The Crystal Precipice," a bunch of "crystalline souls" vaguely similar to modrons appear as creatures of perfect order which the cenobites admire and assist.
Modrons as written are dumb. I could imagine a version of modrons that wouldn't be, in theory.
I liked these wacky little bastards in Planescspe. They work very welI as simple comic relief but there is also something very sinister about them. Had a player who played one once. He made a great point that his character was always incapable of thinking outside the box ( bad pun intended ) . Also rote down any adventure notes as filing a report to his Faction high-ups. Essentially they are great as not-robots in a wacky fantasy setting if you don't want to go full sci-fantasy mash-up.
The Great Modron March is one of very few D&D campaign adventures I decided I HAVE to play some day.
They remind of an SNL skit tortured into a movie. Funny enough for five minutes when drinking, but falls flat under lengthier treatments.
I always thought that Modrons were a kind of poor-man's D&D version of Dwarves in Glorantha - sort of living machines there to keep the multiverse working as it should. But the Glorantha myth actually worked, whereas the Modrons were just kind of hanging there with no real backstory or reason to actually exist.
Something like modrons only work in a setting with Michael Moorcock's Law, Chaos and Balance. They don't work if you shoehorn good/evil as another axis.
Seriously, what exactly is the difference between D&D devils and Hellraiser cenobites? The latter are lawful to the point of being hostile to life (which is chaotic), whereas the latter subvert the intent of law to control others for their own selfish reasons. Therefore, D&D devils are not actually lawful but chaotic, agents for chaos to subvert order from within.
Evil does not make sense as a moral axis. Except for clinical psychopaths, every villainous regime thought they were the good guys. You can see no better example of this then in the Nazi America from The Man in the High Castle on Amazon Prime. From our perspective they are horrifically evil, but they see themselves as good to the point where they right books explaining and justifying their warped morality. For example, in reality we believe the best way to alleviate suffering due to congenital deformities is with painkillers. In Nazi land, they believe in enforced euthanasia on the disabled because their moral system claims that disabled lives are not worth living.
In the Stormbringer mythos, the lords of chaos are also called the dukes of hell and appear suitably grotesque, but they believe themselves to be champions of freedom and individuality (and considering what order does when it isn't countered by chaos they do have a point even if they go to insane extremes).
Quote from: Chainsaw;1046857They remind of an SNL skit tortured into a movie. Funny enough for five minutes when drinking, but falls flat under lengthier treatments.
That's an excellent comparison.