Quote from: 1989;542318This advantage/disadvantage two-die roll thing just ain't D&D, man.

It just came out of nowhere as a novel mechanic.

It's bound to create more harm than good.

Optional module, perhaps?

Am I the only one who doesn't like this?

I dont like it either. Doubling the amount of dice to roll to hit is too fiddly. 15 kobolds attack, they have advantage. Now I gotta roll 15 pairs of d20, work out which are hits one kobold at a time, no rolling 15 dice and quickly seeing which are hits.  It's going to be a lot of dice rolling in big battles...

Clearly explained mechanics are bad because we need to hide how the game works behind a screen of DM bullshit.  Mechanics should be as confusing as possible to ensure that players don't get uppity.

Quote from: Justin Alexander;542839Oh! Is it edition war time? Awesome.

1st edition is absolutely the worst edition of D&D ever published. It is a festering pile of poorly written, poorly edited, and poorly organized crap that was completely unplaytested and functionally unplayable as written.



Do I want the most basic, core mechanics of a game to actually be clearly and concisely explained?

Yes.

I knew you failed at AD&D Justin but for you to intimate that you'd take official rulings over DM adjudication like this (which, you know, actually was what RPG Pundit was talking about) ... are you failing at RPGs now too?

I welcome the fact the game wants you to make judgment calls and own the game for yourself. It is clearly placing the rules in a role of tool to be used by human beings playing a game as a social activity, not the other way around. Now this means the final game should be complemented by strong advice which help DMs grow and learn how to adjudicate properly, with the right set of priorities in mind, and that's where I'm concerned since Monte Cook, who authored the second best DMG (the 3.0 DMG) is out of the picture now, but I'll take a game system that wants me to be in charge over one that is designed to be the absolute, exclusive center piece of game play any day of the week, thank you very much.

Quote from: DestroyYouAlot;542843Honest question:  Does it literally say that you can't move less than 5' blocks?

Yup. It's on page 6.

Quote from: Benoist;542894I knew you failed at AD&D Justin but for you to intimate that you'd take official rulings over DM adjudication like this (which, you know, actually was what RPG Pundit was talking about) ... are you failing at RPGs now too?

Lionizing broken and unclear rules because they somehow give the DM "freedom" to make rulings is one of the most idiotic things I have ever heard.

If you believe that the only way DMs can be empowered is by writing shitty rules that can't be understood, then you aren't actually interested in the dynamics of DM adjudication. You're just an idiot.

Those of you who insist on advocating for this bizarre cargo culting of the Rule 0 Fallacy will be mocked and ridiculed accordingly.

Quote from: DestroyYouAlot;542843Honest question:  Does it literally say that you can't move less than 5' blocks?  
Not saying it doesn't, I just haven't stumbled across that.  Otherwise, I think we're just talking past each other.

At a stretch.

It says: 'When precision is important, such as during a battle, you spend your speed in segments of 5 feet, unless told otherwise.'

Quote from: Justin Alexander;542931Lionizing broken and unclear rules because they somehow give the DM "freedom" to make rulings is one of the most idiotic things I have ever heard.

Yes, I know you've never understood AD&D 1e. I get that.

Quote from: Justin Alexander;542931If you believe that the only way DMs can be empowered is by writing shitty rules that can't be understood, then you aren't actually interested in the dynamics of DM adjudication. You're just an idiot.

Those of you who insist on advocating for this bizarre cargo culting of the Rule 0 Fallacy will be mocked and ridiculed accordingly.

The Rule 0 Fallacy construed as such (a hardline logical fallacy) is a bullshit WotC era meme that only total idiots full of themselves and their supposedly analytical minds brandish to then bend the knee at the altar of the rules as written, talking about the rules on this or that message board in a complete vacuum divorced from the actual human interactions occurring at an actual game table, which is, you know, the actual point of role playing games. It's the first step towards bullshit armchair theory and piling up rules upon rules and caveats upon caveats to catter to the lowest common denominator, i.e. the eunuch DM who can't make a coherent ruling to save his life and can't deal with the other players in a responsible, human manner in the first place.

Quote from: jadrax;542933At a stretch.

It says: 'When precision is important, such as during a battle, you spend your speed in segments of 5 feet, unless told otherwise.'

At times like these, I wonder how some gamers can even make it out the door without a detailed instruction book on walking.

Quote from: danbuter;542938At times like these, I wonder how some gamers can even make it out the door without a detailed instruction book on walking.

You made my day sir.

Why is there so much vitriol in this thread?


Benoist, you seem far too pissed off.


I am choosing to believe Mike Mearls. He says they are early in the design and playtest results will be taken seriously. If so, the game could change remarkably between now and whenever it hits the shelves.

Or not.

Either way, we live in a glorious age of RPG variety. Whatever 5e may or may not be, there are shelves full of fantasy RPGs that can please whatever niche viewpoint any of us may have.

Quote from: Spinachcat;542967Why is there so much vitriol in this thread?


Benoist, you seem far too pissed off.


I am choosing to believe Mike Mearls. He says they are early in the design and playtest results will be taken seriously. If so, the game could change remarkably between now and whenever it hits the shelves.

Or not.

Either way, we live in a glorious age of RPG variety. Whatever 5e may or may not be, there are shelves full of fantasy RPGs that can please whatever niche viewpoint any of us may have.

Step one ignore Ben he went to Edition War crazyland 3 days ago anybody that believes Dnd stopped at 1e or eariler is irrelevant to me and went to Fairyland. Even I think 4e went to the "deep blue" but even it has ideas that are Dnd and good gaming beyond that.

Step two playtest the game and give your opinion. It's probably not mine so that's why I WILL give mine.

Step three rinse and repeat.

Me? I'm redownloading stuff and going to put a group together to see if they are willing to let a Magegirl wear the Viking Hat and move on.

Quote from: Marleycat;542974Me? I'm redownloading stuff and going to put a group together to see if they are willing to let a Magegirl wear the Viking Hat and move on.

SALUTE!!

Quote from: Spinachcat;542967I am choosing to believe Mike Mearls.

Then you, sir, are clearly a fanboy.

I KNEW I could count you to understand, humor nonwithstanding.

This is the first time in 4 years that I can go actually talk about rule interpretation without a 4venger ruining it. It's coming back to DM's and players and individual games instead of books.

Quote from: Fifth Element;542977Then you, sir, are clearly a fanboy.

So does this mean he can't change his mind?  Or that you think they are going the wrong direction?  Both? None? Some combination you dislike?  Which is it? Seriously?