I love all the new books that WoTC has been churning out lately. PHBII, new monster books, complete books etc. But, I also hate having to run a game with so much crap floating out there like some big giant buffet.

What I want to do is this for my next campaign:

Only the core 3, the psionics expanded and the Eberron CS (since it will be an Eberron campaign) are available for free (feats, skills, spells, etc). Beyond that any feat must have a trainer. Any spell outside of the core will need to have a mentor or sage for training. Sorcerers psions and divine spellcasters must find an outsider within at least 2 alignments of them for training of new spells. PRC's will have to find an expert willing to get them started and for any special abilities thereafter.

I'm thinking 50 gold a week for one or two weeks and depending on the power level perhaps a quest item as well.

Will this work?

Neat idea right off the bat.

Do you have the down time within the campaign to make this a viable option in between each level or within a few small levels?  Otherwise it heavily complicates the campaign by requiring certain characters to take time out constantly to train, and other characters get impatient with nothing for their characters to do.

Wizards who can learn from scrolls or pay for a scroll to be created to learn from also get a bit of an advantage with this route.

I think anyone who games for any period of time with any game system which has a lot of supplements will go through a period where they want to trim everything down to the core.  I've gone through it with AD&D1, AD&D2, Rifts, Robotech, Mekton II...

So, my advice is just scratch that itch and see where it takes you.

Quote from: GabrielSo, my advice is just scratch that itch and see where it takes you.

Oh, the itch is scratched! I am currently running a short with just core only. Me, I'm lovin it, my players not so much. They buy books just like me and want to use them...I don't want to deny them that pleasure but I want to try like hell to stay away from a hodgepodge of confusion. The last campaign I ran went to high levels and included everything, it just got to be too hectic.

Quote from: JanosNeat idea right off the bat.

Do you have the down time within the campaign to make this a viable option in between each level or within a few small levels?  Otherwise it heavily complicates the campaign by requiring certain characters to take time out constantly to train, and other characters get impatient with nothing for their characters to do.

Wizards who can learn from scrolls or pay for a scroll to be created to learn from also get a bit of an advantage with this route.

Downtime is an issue and I think if they arrange for it and I provide it any problems could get smoothed over (famous last words). Good idea on the scrolls, maybe they have to find them first....

I'm stuck with the mish-mash of "stuff I've approved" on a case-by-case basis. My players will bring in a hot new book and want something out of it, and I decide if it's too overpowered or if it fits my campaign.

So far I've allowed most of what they've brought me. Everybody is keeping track of the rules their character is using. I can't keep it all in my head.

However, out of stubbernness, I'm sticking with the ruleset I've been using from the beginning of the campaign, namely the core books + campaign book. That's how I envisioned the world, and I'm sticking with it. Can't expect my players to have fun doing that, though, especially since we're going on 2 years and they're itching for new stuff to try.

I'm running Arcana Evolved, so it's really easy to pare the sourcebooks down.

I've said on these forums before, monster books and modules notwithstanding, I want to reference three or fewer books during a game session, prefer two, and really love just having one.  This is why I'll never buy a spell treasury unless it already includes the game's core spells.

My players are great with this.  They aren't go-out-and-buy-new-books people, by and large.

When running actual D&D, I stick to Core + 1 Setting book.  I really, really wish the PHB and DMG were combined into one source, so I tend to just use my laptop pointed at the Sovelior-Sage SRD.

-O

In the group were I DM for my wife and her friends, very cool stuff is happening.

They aren´t gamers, but I made them fell in love with D&D. They went out and bought themselves PHBs. AS they are no gamers, I was very proud, when they started to buy the Complete... book matching their character. They are so proud and feel so smart when they can use stuff out of it.
One couple is making each other small D&D gifts at their anniversary,, birthday etc. When one of them uses stuff the other gave him as a present, both are very happy.
They are all grown ups, but have a very charming and naive trust in the written rules, and a sense of wonder which is contagious.

Thanks for that, Wizards.
Thanks for products that emanate authority and trust in the rules as well as a sense of wonder. For us new to D&D, it´s great fun.

We started our game, with core books, plus any one extra book a player wanted to use for their character.  Unearthed arcana, ok, your character can only use core plus UA.  Races of stone.  Same thing, core plus Races of stone.

I did this mostly to cut down on confusion, and to keep from bringing in too many broken feat/prc/ability combinations from the different books.  What I'm finding is that it isn't really mattering that much for anything beyond keeping confusion down.  I guess I'm ok with a little confusion, and I'm getting ready to open up the game to any combination.

Starting this campaign was something of an experiment, in a different game style, DMing for the first time again, since 2nd edition plus 7 years.  Seeing if I could live up to what I think it takes, and learning all the new rules.  We skipped right over 3.0 with 3.5 coming out right then.

We had a split in the gaming group, and the hardest thing I see right now, is finding players to jump into the game.



As a DM I can see your reasoning.  As a player, I want to try out all those new classes, feats, and races too.  So I'm gonna start bringing them in on the DM side.  I get to play more combinations of character's and feats than anyone else at the table.  Muahhahahaha.  ahem.

GW

Quote from: GraywolfAs a DM I can see your reasoning.  As a player, I want to try out all those new classes, feats, and races too.  So I'm gonna start bringing them in on the DM side.  I get to play more combinations of character's and feats than anyone else at the table.  Muahhahahaha.  ahem.

GW

My goal is to actually be able to incorporate the new books and existing books I and my players have, but in a way that makes sense. Say, everything from the core books, since that is what D&D is built around comes naturally to any player. After that, if you want to incorporate something from a Complete book or campaign supp it's actually just fine except it costs your character money, training or both, and/or perhaps a quest item. By quest item I mean the patron or trainer says "I will teach you this or I have access to this spell but you must first to this for me and in doing so will put you onto the path of enlightenment" or something to that effect. What I want to avoid is the chaos that ensues when any and every book is being thrown around, a ruling needs to be looked up and no one has the book at hand etc. It can get crushing over time especially at very high levels of that I can attest having lived through it once already.

I dunno about you guys, but I consider pretty much everything that was put out by WotC as core

I think that I would find the game quite boring if it only included stuff from the PHB.

Quote from: YigI dunno about you guys, but I consider pretty much everything that was put out by WotC as core

Core means PHB, DMG and MM1.

Quote from: YigI think that I would find the game quite boring if it only included stuff from the PHB.

That's great!  If your just pointing that fact out, fantasitic. Couldn't agree more. And it also has absolutely nothing to do with the subject at hand.

Quote from: YigI dunno about you guys, but I consider pretty much everything that was put out by WotC as core

That must make for a pretty damn *cough* interesting Modern Forgotten Ebberon games.

QuoteI think that I would find the game quite boring if it only included stuff from the PHB.

Basically the DMG + PHB + MM, or really the D20 document, provides a wide array. It has been mentioned before, but there really is little in the way of WotC fantasy classes outside that cannot be closely approximated by the core.

Feats, and to some extent Spells, are a bit different matter because there are several thousand of those now that do a very wide array of things. But still there is a lot of territory inside, and you are likely better off just flat out rolling it yourself if you have just one or a few specific ideas in mind rather than trying to find a book that has it and then trying to make sure it will work well in your game.

The problem I have with so many rules as it puts too much focus on the rules.  "Hey check out my cool new feat."   I've become increasingly rules lite in preference the last several years.  I want just the core books and a few things borrowed or written new to give the flavor of the current campaign.  With fewer rules to screw with, it gives more time to focus on plot and whatnot.