Hey all, I am keen on playing an older/osr ruleset after my current 5e game finishes. I read AD&D 1e, a bunch of retroclones as well as OSR changes to 5e and I have to say, the cleanest and most interesting rules I've found and liked is LotfP.  However, I have a strong nostalgic link to 1e as that's the edition I played all through the 80s and 90s.  Can I just take the classes and races out of 1e and just use them directly in LOFTP rules? Or will I need to modify them (thinking of the UA classes as well as paladins, rangers and the like).  Thanks in advance.

Importing AD&D classes directly into LotP would be a bit strange. Have you looked at the alternatives, like Sword & Wizardry Complete or Advanced Labyrinth Lord? They've already done of the lifting of converting Advanced stuff like classes to the classic D&D framework. S&W is based on OD&D, LL is based on B/X. They're both closer to LotFP than AD&D, so it would be easier to import from them.

Though they're more Players Handbook than Unearthed Arcana. If you want the cavalier and barbarian, you'll have to look elsewhere or do it yourself.

OSRIC is 95% the AD&D 1E Core 3 books - rules, in a single volume.  No UA content, though.  Just the Core rules, only.

You should have a look at Castles & Crusades.  It's got all the AD&D classes and races in streamlined rules.  The ability score modifiers coincide with Lamentations'.  What you would have to do to incorporate C&C is beef up the challenges in the Lamentations' (LOTFP) modules.  A simple thing to do. 

I have noticed that LOTFP is monster and magic lite.  Usually there's only one or two beasties and they tend to be pretty tough.  Also there isn't a plethora of magical gear in poorly-locked chests, waiting around for adventurers to pick up and use.  Magic items are weird and are likely to harm the user as much as the target. 

Anyway, I hope your game works out.  I love LOTFP.  Really creative stuff. 

LotFP's best features are the d6 skill system and exorcism of D&D's nuke spells.  What are you really wanting to bring from 1E here?

Just pick the one that delivers the experience you are looking to provide.

Quote from: Jam The MF on December 29, 2021, 09:09:56 PM
OSRIC is 95% the AD&D 1E Core 3 books - rules, in a single volume.  No UA content, though.  Just the Core rules, only.

Ohh OSRIC, not read this one, will try it.

Quote from: Palleon on December 29, 2021, 09:48:29 PM
LotFP's best features are the d6 skill system and exorcism of D&D's nuke spells.  What are you really wanting to bring from 1E here?

Ultimately I want to expose my mostly 5e players to the D&D I played as a kid/teenager/YA. Having said that, when I re-read the AD&D manuals I remembered there was a lot of stuff we house ruled even back then.  For example, we never used segments or weapon vs AC modifiers (except by exception) etc.  So want to play 1e but with some updated rules, but that kind of defeats the purpose of trying to expose my players to AD&D.  So yeah, should stick with AD&D for a couple of adventures (its also the edition I have all the books for so easier for my players to read them). If nothing else can just play AD&D and if it doesn't land well modify it.  I just like the changes LOFTP made with spells, skills and classes but would want the more 1e greyhawk settings.

I guess let me phrase my question a little differently, could I take a 1e module - like keep on the borderlands - and play it (mostly) as is with LOTFP ruleset? That maybe a good compromise if doable.

Quote from: solomani on December 29, 2021, 10:01:18 PM
I guess let me phrase my question a little differently, could I take a 1e module - like keep on the borderlands - and play it (mostly) as is with LOTFP ruleset? That maybe a good compromise if doable.

Keep on the Borderlands is a Basic D&D module. That's what the B in B2 stands for.

There is a difference between Basic and Advanced. Advanced characters of the same level tend to be tougher, and do more damage. LotFP is based on Basic D&D, specifically B/X.

But all post-Greyhawk versions of old school D&D are fairly compatible. You can easily swap modules back and forth. Just be careful about the level ranges, and tweak them as needed across the Basic/Advanced divide. Specifically for LotFP, you should be aware of the spell differences and things like how attack bonuses progress (or don't).

Another, albeit pricier, solution is to go with Old School Essentials Advanced.  It B/Xifies all the AD&D classes so they could be dropped seamlessly into LotFP.  You could then play most of the old AD&D or B/X modules without conversion.  Likewise, I think the Lamentations stuff would easily fit the OSE material.  But OSE books are a bit pricier, though they do offer some free downloads on the Necrotic Gnome website.

And, as someone else mentioned, I think Castles & Crusades is a great way to introduce 5e players to 1e style play.  But it may require more fiddling with Lamentations since C&C is closer to AD&D, even if streamlined in many ways. 

Thanks everyone, this is useful.

Actually another question for the retro clones like osric etc is there a reason to use these at all if I own the original 1e books?  Something like flame princess I get as it's not just a clone but has some pretty good innovations but others seem to just be cleaned up versions of 1e to one degree l or another. Thanks.

Quote from: solomani on December 29, 2021, 11:21:42 PM
Actually another question for the retro clones like osric etc is there a reason to use these at all if I own the original 1e books?  Something like flame princess I get as it's not just a clone but has some pretty good innovations but others seem to just be cleaned up versions of 1e to one degree l or another. Thanks.

Usually the reason is that the layout is cleaner and they're easier to refrence but YMMV

Availability, cost, organization, and ethos. Most of the clones have free PDFs, and some have print versions at cost (like OSRIC). Also, some of the clones are better organized or written. That's particularly the case with OSRIC. While it's much drier and less interesting to read than the 1e DMG, it explains the rules in a much clearer fashion. Note they were replicating a ruleset that's very unclear in places. So they had to make judgment calls and interpretations. But since they were 1e purists, they tried to resolve those ambiguities in the way most in keeping with the intent and preferences of Gygax. Look up initiative and surprise, for instance. Other clones are more muddled (for instance, I prefer the originals over Labyrinth Lord). Also, some clones have a very distinct voice that appeals to certain consumers -- LotFP and S&W being the most mainstream examples.

Thanks Slambo and Pat, this makes sense.  1e manuals are entertaining to read but yeah, organisation isn't the best.  Will continue reading through OSRIC.

There are a few 1E monsters missing from OSRIC, because they are considered to be proprietary intellectual property; but 95% of them are there.  Mind Flayers, Beholders, Displacer Beasts, etc. are missing from OSRIC.

My suggestions for the OP are as follows:

1) If you want to introduce your players to AD&D 1e, then run AD&D 1e and join the many thousands who still play and enjoy the system  (however much they may or may not homebrew the game). Accept the game for what it is and enjoy it on its own terms.

2) If you want a "cleaned up" version of AD&D, there are many retroclones that achieve that goal to various extents and you'll have to find the one that "feels" most like the AD&D you remember.

3) If I had a group who wanted to play AD&D, I would run Castles & Crusades as I feel its best achieved the goal of AD&D 3e and its incredibly easy to use if you want to run TSR settings or adventures.

4) If you want to go really old school, download a copy of Original D&D from 1974 and run it rules as written. Seriously. If that sounds too hardcore, check out Swords & Wizardry: White Box which is the best OD&D retro I've seen.