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Looks Like Over The Edge is Being Reinvented as a Storygame

Started by RPGPundit, July 11, 2018, 04:58:52 AM

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WillInNewHaven

#90
August 14, 2018, 10:59:33 AM
Quote from: Shawn Driscoll;1052845GURPS is a computer RPG that players play manually with paper and pencil. Players view disadvantages as simply points for buying things which are never referred to again during play.

Never worked that way when I played it. I can see how it would, if the GM didn't watch out..

nope

#91
August 14, 2018, 11:12:20 AM
Quote from: Shawn Driscoll;1052845GURPS is a computer RPG that players play manually with paper and pencil. Players view disadvantages as simply points for buying things which are never referred to again during play.

I emphatically disagree.

robiswrong

#92
August 14, 2018, 11:32:47 AM
Quote from: Shawn Driscoll;1052845Players view disadvantages as simply points for buying things which are never referred to again during play.

That's a common meta-optimization.  It's up to the GM to ensure that they do come up.

That was one of the things that drew me to Fate - the idea that your "disadvantages" only pay off when they actually disadvantage you.

Lurtch

#93
August 14, 2018, 12:12:42 PM
Quote from: Itachi;1051249Oh yeah, if you're all into GURPS I can see how these games may bother you.

About Pendragon, I bet it would be considered a storygame if released these days. :p

Only morons would call Pendragon a storygame.

nope

#94
August 14, 2018, 12:29:39 PM
Quote from: robiswrong;1052857That's a common meta-optimization.  It's up to the GM to ensure that they do come up.

That was one of the things that drew me to Fate - the idea that your "disadvantages" only pay off when they actually disadvantage you.

I think it's worth mentioning that GURPS does have options to encourage this sort of 'active' buy-in from the player side, should you see that as an issue and seek answers within GURPS as a framework; Ham Clause, Impulse Points, Stability Points, etc. all being good tools to address this, with some Disadvantage methods such as Foibles going so far as to excise the initial point awards for Disadvantages entirely.

robiswrong

#95
August 14, 2018, 01:45:29 PM
Quote from: Antiquation!;1052861I think it's worth mentioning that GURPS does have options to encourage this sort of 'active' buy-in from the player side, should you see that as an issue and seek answers within GURPS as a framework; Ham Clause, Impulse Points, Stability Points, etc. all being good tools to address this, with some Disadvantage methods such as Foibles going so far as to excise the initial point awards for Disadvantages entirely.

Nah, I think "don't be a dumbass" is sufficient.  Don't get me wrong, I love GURPS.

nope

#96
August 14, 2018, 03:18:09 PM
Quote from: robiswrong;1052873Nah, I think "don't be a dumbass" is sufficient.  Don't get me wrong, I love GURPS.

I would tend to agree with you. To be fair though, maintaining a general "don't be a dumbass" policy tends to be a pretty essential part of any game I run (and I would imagine probably in yours, too).

I just wanted to mention those tools/options for the benefit of those who might not be as intimately familiar with the GURPS framework (which to be fair is pretty extensive and fairly opaque from the exterior).

Anon Adderlan

#97
August 16, 2018, 05:23:27 AM
Shit dawg...

[video=youtube_share;1tRkA6PQiNY]https://youtu.be/1tRkA6PQiNY?t=24s[/youtube]

...looks like Grim Jim isn't helping the Pundito's case any.

Itachi

#98
August 16, 2018, 08:23:47 PM Last Edit: August 16, 2018, 08:28:32 PM by Itachi
Quote from: Shawn Driscoll[In GURPS] Players view disadvantages as simply points for buying things which are never referred to again during play.
That reflects my experience too. I think the zero-sum rule for dis/advantages may promote that kind of thing, as players may end up getting things they didn't originally envisioned for their characters just to close the math.

ThatChrisGuy

#99
August 16, 2018, 08:44:15 PM
Quote from: Shawn Driscoll;1052845Players view disadvantages as simply points for buying things which are never referred to again during play.

Never really had that problem, myself.  Most of the players I've had over the years take Disads which either define the personality they already wanted to play or flesh out their character's background a bit.
I made a blog: Southern Style GURPS

Manic Modron

#100
August 17, 2018, 12:19:55 AM
Quote from: ThatChrisGuy;1053184Never really had that problem, myself.  Most of the players I've had over the years take Disads which either define the personality they already wanted to play or flesh out their character's background a bit.

Another one on that side for me too.   Even the munchkiniest minmaxer I ever played with picked disads he actually wanted and role-played them through the campaign.

GeekEclectic

#101
August 17, 2018, 02:07:25 AM
Quote from: Manic Modron;1053194Another one on that side for me too.   Even the munchkiniest minmaxer I ever played with picked disads he actually wanted and role-played them through the campaign.
Yep, and the GM can always look at the character sheet and say no to things that don't fit. If the player's obviously gaming the disad system, shut it down! You have the power.
"I despise weak men in positions of power, and that's 95% of game industry leadership." - Jessica Price
"Isnt that why RPGs companies are so woke in the first place?" - Godsmonkey
*insert Disaster Girl meme here* - Me

Itachi

#102
August 17, 2018, 06:36:48 AM Last Edit: August 17, 2018, 06:41:56 AM by Itachi
I think my problem with GURPS disadvantages is that it lies entirely in the shoulders of the GM to use/invoke them once play begins, which makes them easy to be forgotten. I prefer games that make the concept more integral to play,  be it by rewarding players when invoked during the game, like Cortex+ traits that give you plot points, or by taking a more central role overall, like Pendragon virtue traits.

Tod13

#103
August 17, 2018, 09:37:46 AM
Quote from: Manic Modron;1053194Another one on that side for me too.   Even the munchkiniest minmaxer I ever played with picked disads he actually wanted and role-played them through the campaign.

In our home brew system, disadvantages are optional and convey no advantages. Like your comment though, my players consistently pick real disadvantages that come up multiple times an adventure or even apply all the time. One picked a disadvantage underground, knowing we were playing lots of modules where most of the adventure was underground. My wife picked disadvantage to stealth with the add-on that the character thinks she is stealthy. She even picked armor that made a lot of noise. That was real fun in the game.

Manic Modron

#104
August 17, 2018, 11:04:44 AM
Quote from: Itachi;1053215I think my problem with GURPS disadvantages is that it lies entirely in the shoulders of the GM to use/invoke them once play begins, which makes them easy to be forgotten.

I must have been with a really good group because that isn't my experience either.  The players I was with were very invested in their disads and we considered them the core of the characters.  The GM brought it up sometimes for sure, but mostly he didn't have to.
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