So much fun.  The characters don't start out as super heroes.  They scratch and claw their way up the ladder.  When they win, it means something.  They experience emotions on every die roll, that players in modern gaming systems don't really experience.  It's more edge of your seat.

I agree, I spent - no  I waisted years collecting newer or the next new shiny system and it's pretty much just folks trying to re-invent the wheel.  Some systems are like computer OS because of bloat. The old games you added in the fluff that you wanted in your game but I think most people either haven't the time or the patience to create in game content. I can remember being in middle school and we'd pour over our character sheets and the DM-GM would have a stack of 3 ring binders loaded with all sorts of cool stuff. I miss those days so very much. with my solitaire stuff - I've gone back to my roots with D&D and The Fantasy Trip.  ( D&D for long-haul games and campaigns) TFT for short off the cuff games and 4-5 room dungeons  or town buildings etc.

The newer rulesets and books have indeed provided me with great amounts of inspiration; but they have not increased the fun of actually playing the game.  Just sayin'.....

OD&D, and early AD&D captured lighting in a bottle.

I love running OD&D (or its retroclone Swords & Wizardry: White Box) for all the reasons. So much crazy fun.

I run humanocentric 0e, so its Fighters / Wizards / Clerics only and that "limited choice" has been so refreshing and exciting for my players and its been a constant hit at conventions where I've run demo events.

I've been wanting to run a local game of OD&D using S&W White Box, ascending AC, and letting the core PC classes (Cleric, Fighter, Magic User) try the standard Thief-type skills (or any other skills) by rolling under an ability score.

Honestly I like both old and new D&D. Both styles have their flaws and merits.

Played a lot of OD&D back when, and it was good mostly because we changed what we felt wasn't good. It wasn't an accident or interference from people who didn't play that the game developed as it did; actual players and even the original designers wanted changes. The new stuff still includes the power to change what isn't good; it's just not as often necessary.

One thing I like about OD&D is that the game runs a lot faster than 5E. In 5E you might get through one combat per hour of play, but in OD&D you can do most of a dungeon in an afternoon.

Simple Character Creation.
Simple Character Sheet.
Simple Role for Your Character.
Simple Mechanics.  Ex: Thief Skills.
Simple Monster Stat Blocks.
Lots of Room Left for Customization.
All Rules Will Fit Into One Small Book.

Older games in general just seem to get to the point much faster. Maybe not as clearly written, but decidedly less bloated.

Our group recently switched to 5e and I've been trying to really grok the rules... and it's just been a shlog, everything seems so overwritten. taking paragraphs to to say things that could be said in a brief sentence. I think part of it is that the authors are trying to create a mood, get the reader excited... but IMO that's the stuff that should happen in-game. I'm reading it to learn the game, not for the sake of reading. Leave the inspirational talk for the GM notes/suggestions.
Even Mythras, which I love, goes on a bit longer than it needs... muddies the text around the rules to where I'm more confused than if they'd just given me the basic info. Old Runequest was much cleaner.

Somehow looking at the LBBs of Classic Traveller gets me more fired up to play than the big glossy books full of paintings and graphics and bloated text.

Basic 5e has 125 or so spells versus [strike]just under a hundred[/strike] just over eighty for OD&D (3 books only; if you include thief skills, you're into Greyhawk which added 70 new spells.)

(Hmm, I just realized that I overcounted OD&D - some spells are listed as both magic-user and cleric and so I double counted them from the lists. But the different versions might have different ranges, duration, etc. So the numbers remain approximate. Since past experience shows that this will be ridden into the ground by people who want any excuse to dispute me, I checked; there are 8 cleric spells that are described as the same as a magic-user spell of the same name but most with changes in duration or range.)

And basic D&D 5e has 4 classes and 4 races; matching OD&D, pretty much (Greyhawk added 2 classes, Paladin and Thief). Mechanics are, I think, simpler in 5e because they're pretty much all d20 against a DC, versus d6 for this, 2d6 for that, 3d6 (loyalty only, I think), d20 for many.

5e is more verbose; they repeat a lot of boilerplate but it's mostly consistent (e.g., Conjure spells don't differ a lot) so it could be a lot shorter. By contrast, OD&D leaves out a lot; you can view this as room to customize or as a failure of the rules. The sales of AD&D 1e suggests that it was more viewed as the latter; people apparently wanted longer books, longer stat blocks and more spells.

Finally, why does everyone seem to have so much trouble running 5e combats quickly? There are more spell slots at low level, and characters probably have more choices available in a given round (with bonus action, reaction and more class or race features), but OD&D was quick at low levels mostly, and probably more because it was arbitrarily deadly. It got slow once characters had more spell slots, hit points, followers and magic items.

I liked OD&D back then, but I wouldn't go back to it ever. A cleaner OSR game, maybe, but not because it's simpler/shorter. But it's easier to just do 5e.

Quote from: Simlasa;1106680Older games in general just seem to get to the point much faster. Maybe not as clearly written, but decidedly less bloated.

Our group recently switched to 5e and I've been trying to really grok the rules... and it's just been a shlog, everything seems so overwritten. taking paragraphs to to say things that could be said in a brief sentence. I think part of it is that the authors are trying to create a mood, get the reader excited... but IMO that's the stuff that should happen in-game. I'm reading it to learn the game, not for the sake of reading. Leave the inspirational talk for the GM notes/suggestions.
Even Mythras, which I love, goes on a bit longer than it needs... muddies the text around the rules to where I'm more confused than if they'd just given me the basic info. Old Runequest was much cleaner.

Somehow looking at the LBBs of Classic Traveller gets me more fired up to play than the big glossy books full of paintings and graphics and bloated text.

I used to agree with you, but remember that new players aren't coming to the game with a familiarity with the history of its tropes and so forth. The flavor needs to be there to induct them into it.

I have had success with OD&D over the past decades. Although I did modify it to be better suited for my Majestic Wilderlands setting.
The Majestic Fantasy Basic Rules.

Wrote the Majestic Wilderlands supplement as an expansion and the Scourge of Demon Wolf adventure as well. I think Demon Wolf show that an OD&D adventure can be just as nuanced and character driven as more detailed RPGs like GURPS, Ars Magica, etc.

Quote from: mAcular Chaotic;1106699I used to agree with you, but remember that new players aren't coming to the game with a familiarity with the history of its tropes and so forth.

Except that I was a new gamer when I first encountered this stuff (not OD&D, but AD&D and Classic Traveller and Runequest). I wasn't really much of a wargamer yet either.
Traveller was particularly inspiring for me in that it didn't push a lot of setting at me... no art, no fiction chunks. It was a blank slate I could write my already crowded imagination on.

OD&D is for DMs that want to get on with taking a table of people to a state of action instead of players projecting through characterization before dice are rolled.  I love it.

Granted, I'm an AD&D guy first and foremost.  But that's mainly because AD&D represents the rules I'd add to OD&D if AD&D didn't exist.  I'm perfectly happy rolling in an OD&D campaign with a DM that takes the table somewhere.