Quote from: I on May 31, 2023, 10:38:48 PM

Quote from: S'mon on May 31, 2023, 02:04:18 AM

This seems a bit Six Degrees to Kevin Bacon to me. The NAACP was traditionally a respectable organisation, and this statement supporting BLM seems pretty minimalist to me. If HPLHS has only shown support for the NAACP and not directly funding BLM, to me that shouldn't be a Red, otherwise I think you're in danger of purity spiralling.

Considering that the NAACP Legal Defense Fund is an entirely separate organization from the NAACP and has been since the 1950s, your argument that they're "supporting the NAACP" would seem to be a little specious.  IIRC, the NAACP has actually taken the LDF to court to try to get them to drop the "NAACP" from their title.  The LDF pretty much spends all of its money fighting any and every reasonable measure to keep voting honest.  So every dollar given to them helps perpetuate no voter ID, eternal mail-in ballots with no signature or proof of identity, no purging of the names of dead people from voter rolls, etc.  It's what they call "protecting our democracy" and what the rest of us call FRAUD.

This misunderstanding is my fault. It is ofcourse LDF but I thought it was the same basic organisation. I'm not from the US but I should have been more precise, so no excuse.

That said, i am reading through the whole thread and have come to a point where criteria is being discussed, and the Lovecraft society might be in Yellow if Ocule decides to add them at all.

I agree that Yellow is where it belongs.  Red is for full-blown woke: either overt fascism/intolerance for intellectual diversity, or the company officially is a mouthpiece for SJW causes, or is giving your profits to them, or hatred for consumers who think differently.

Quote from: Cathode Ray on June 01, 2023, 09:36:09 PM
I agree that Yellow is where it belongs.  Red is for full-blown woke: either overt fascism/intolerance for intellectual diversity, or the company officially is a mouthpiece for SJW causes, or is giving your profits to them, or hatred for consumers who think differently.

I'd count donations under yellow unless they're doing too much of the others.

There's good odds a company could throwing bones to the twitter mob to get them to go bother someone else.

Basically I'd only go full on red unless attacks are made or their content is just explicit in it's obnoxious pontification.

Quote from: Psyckosama on June 02, 2023, 02:31:33 AM

Quote from: Cathode Ray on June 01, 2023, 09:36:09 PM
I agree that Yellow is where it belongs.  Red is for full-blown woke: either overt fascism/intolerance for intellectual diversity, or the company officially is a mouthpiece for SJW causes, or is giving your profits to them, or hatred for consumers who think differently.

I'd count donations under yellow unless they're doing too much of the others.

There's good odds a company could throwing bones to the twitter mob to get them to go bother someone else.

Basically I'd only go full on red unless attacks are made or their content is just explicit in it's obnoxious pontification.

Yes, the definition in my book could be something like:
Green: Neutral or Non-Woke.
Yellow: Somewhat woke (perhaps just virtue signalling or openly supporting woke cause)
Red: Could be woke Activism through their game or on the net, history falsification for political reasons, threatening behavior, hostility towards customers or Antifa supporters. I.e. totalitarian left wingers.

Quote from: Rift on June 02, 2023, 03:34:22 AM
Yes, the definition in my book could be something like:
Green: Neutral or Non-Woke.
Yellow: Somewhat woke (perhaps just virtue signalling or openly supporting woke cause)
Red: Could be woke Activism through their game or on the net, history falsification for political reasons, threatening behavior, hostility towards customers or Antifa supporters. I.e. totalitarian left wingers.

Sounds good to me. Green can include anti-woke non-Totalitarians, classical Liberals & Libertarians. The list has been putting Far Right in Red, which sounds right for activists at least, applying a consistent standard.  If standards were consistent I'm not sure if Judges Guild would be in Red for BBII's trailer park racism, since it seemed to be absent of any actual activism - unlike say MAR Barker's work with a Neo-Nazi organisation, or Vikernes' church burning etc. Vox Day I believe has an RPG, which likewise I think should be in Red if he met the notability standard. I understand why the Left gets more leeway though. The commanding heights of our culture are wholly Left-dominated. I remember a survey report that the views of the median UK Conservative Party MP on social issues were to the Left of the median Labour Party voter, and another one that 80% of Tory MPs were to the Left of the median UK citizen. You can imagine how far Left the other political parties are!

Quote from: S'mon on June 02, 2023, 03:58:57 AM

Quote from: Rift on June 02, 2023, 03:34:22 AM
Yes, the definition in my book could be something like:
Green: Neutral or Non-Woke.
Yellow: Somewhat woke (perhaps just virtue signalling or openly supporting woke cause)
Red: Could be woke Activism through their game or on the net, history falsification for political reasons, threatening behavior, hostility towards customers or Antifa supporters. I.e. totalitarian left wingers.

Sounds good to me. Green can include anti-woke non-Totalitarians, classical Liberals & Libertarians. The list has been putting Far Right in Red, which sounds right for activists at least, applying a consistent standard.  If standards were consistent I'm not sure if Judges Guild would be in Red for BBII's trailer park racism, since it seemed to be absent of any actual activism - unlike say MAR Barker's work with a Neo-Nazi organisation, or Vikernes' church burning etc. Vox Day I believe has an RPG, which likewise I think should be in Red if he met the notability standard. I understand why the Left gets more leeway though. The commanding heights of our culture are wholly Left-dominated. I remember a survey report that the views of the median UK Conservative Party MP on social issues were to the Left of the median Labour Party voter, and another one that 80% of Tory MPs were to the Left of the median UK citizen. You can imagine how far Left the other political parties are!

Yeah. I don't mind listing neo-nazis in the red as such,  but of course it would not be a woke list anymore, as they are far from woke, rather it would be more an activist list for all fringe ideologically hate driven companies and individuals. These people are simply two sides from the same coin, left or right, and I would not buy from any of them.

A seperate brown category could be a solution on the tail of the document for non-woke political activists etc. That would include games pushing white supremacy views, anti-semitism etc. So a woke list - with honorable mention of brown shirts.

Quote from: Rift on June 02, 2023, 04:16:15 AM

Quote from: S'mon on June 02, 2023, 03:58:57 AM

Quote from: Rift on June 02, 2023, 03:34:22 AM
Yes, the definition in my book could be something like:
Green: Neutral or Non-Woke.
Yellow: Somewhat woke (perhaps just virtue signalling or openly supporting woke cause)
Red: Could be woke Activism through their game or on the net, history falsification for political reasons, threatening behavior, hostility towards customers or Antifa supporters. I.e. totalitarian left wingers.

Sounds good to me. Green can include anti-woke non-Totalitarians, classical Liberals & Libertarians. The list has been putting Far Right in Red, which sounds right for activists at least, applying a consistent standard.  If standards were consistent I'm not sure if Judges Guild would be in Red for BBII's trailer park racism, since it seemed to be absent of any actual activism - unlike say MAR Barker's work with a Neo-Nazi organisation, or Vikernes' church burning etc. Vox Day I believe has an RPG, which likewise I think should be in Red if he met the notability standard. I understand why the Left gets more leeway though. The commanding heights of our culture are wholly Left-dominated. I remember a survey report that the views of the median UK Conservative Party MP on social issues were to the Left of the median Labour Party voter, and another one that 80% of Tory MPs were to the Left of the median UK citizen. You can imagine how far Left the other political parties are!

Yeah. I don't mind listing neo-nazis in the red as such,  but of course it would not be a woke list anymore, as they are far from woke, rather it would be more an activist list for all fringe ideologically hate driven companies and individuals. These people are simply two sides from the same coin, left or right, and I would not buy from any of them.

A seperate brown category could be a solution on the tail of the document for non-woke political activists etc. That would include games pushing white supremacy views, anti-semitism etc. So a woke list - with honorable mention of brown shirts.

Come to think of it... My idea has not been thought through fully as you would need a "soft" category for the right wing brownshirts as well - a right wing yellow - just makes it way too complicated.

People like Varg fits well in red, as they define how valuable a person is by race and sexual orientation, just like the lefties. So a it's a woke list, with honorable mentions. That even leaves room for criminals, who are not politically driven.

So listed in red are all the assholes.

Neo-Nazis are very much Woke and indeed "Wake up, white man!" is one of their slogans. They often praise black nationalist movements as models to aspire to.

Quote from: S'mon on June 02, 2023, 06:13:43 AM
Neo-Nazis are very much Woke and indeed "Wake up, white man!" is one of their slogans. They often praise black nationalist movements as models to aspire to.

I might have a more narrow definition of woke, but I see your valid point.

Quote from: Rift on June 02, 2023, 03:34:22 AM
Yes, the definition in my book could be something like:
Green: Neutral or Non-Woke.
Yellow: Somewhat woke (perhaps just virtue signalling or openly supporting woke cause)
Red: Could be woke Activism through their game or on the net, history falsification for political reasons, threatening behavior, hostility towards customers or Antifa supporters. I.e. totalitarian left wingers.

Yeah. I agree completely.

In most cases you'll probably find that yellow companies are just doing virtue signaling because not doing so and trying to maintain an apolitical stance without paying homage to the woke gods of twitter will get the hoard to fall upon you. By offering a small tithe and flashing the signal of virtue, you can deflect their foul attentions to more recalcitrant companies and have peace in your time. At least until someone makes a fart joke on instagram. Then you're fucked.

Quote from: Rift on June 02, 2023, 04:16:15 AM

Quote from: S'mon on June 02, 2023, 03:58:57 AM

Quote from: Rift on June 02, 2023, 03:34:22 AM
Yes, the definition in my book could be something like:
Green: Neutral or Non-Woke.
Yellow: Somewhat woke (perhaps just virtue signalling or openly supporting woke cause)
Red: Could be woke Activism through their game or on the net, history falsification for political reasons, threatening behavior, hostility towards customers or Antifa supporters. I.e. totalitarian left wingers.

Sounds good to me. Green can include anti-woke non-Totalitarians, classical Liberals & Libertarians. The list has been putting Far Right in Red, which sounds right for activists at least, applying a consistent standard.  If standards were consistent I'm not sure if Judges Guild would be in Red for BBII's trailer park racism, since it seemed to be absent of any actual activism - unlike say MAR Barker's work with a Neo-Nazi organisation, or Vikernes' church burning etc. Vox Day I believe has an RPG, which likewise I think should be in Red if he met the notability standard. I understand why the Left gets more leeway though. The commanding heights of our culture are wholly Left-dominated. I remember a survey report that the views of the median UK Conservative Party MP on social issues were to the Left of the median Labour Party voter, and another one that 80% of Tory MPs were to the Left of the median UK citizen. You can imagine how far Left the other political parties are!

Yeah. I don't mind listing neo-nazis in the red as such,  but of course it would not be a woke list anymore, as they are far from woke, rather it would be more an activist list for all fringe ideologically hate driven companies and individuals. These people are simply two sides from the same coin, left or right, and I would not buy from any of them.

A seperate brown category could be a solution on the tail of the document for non-woke political activists etc. That would include games pushing white supremacy views, anti-semitism etc. So a woke list - with honorable mention of brown shirts.

No, they're woke, just for a different skin color than the leftist wokes.

Quote from: Psyckosama on June 02, 2023, 08:56:59 AM

Quote from: Rift on June 02, 2023, 03:34:22 AM
Yes, the definition in my book could be something like:
Green: Neutral or Non-Woke.
Yellow: Somewhat woke (perhaps just virtue signalling or openly supporting woke cause)
Red: Could be woke Activism through their game or on the net, history falsification for political reasons, threatening behavior, hostility towards customers or Antifa supporters. I.e. totalitarian left wingers.

Yeah. I agree completely.

In most cases you'll probably find that yellow companies are just doing virtue signaling because not doing so and trying to maintain an apolitical stance without paying homage to the woke gods of twitter will get the hoard to fall upon you. By offering a small tithe and flashing the signal of virtue, you can deflect their foul attentions to more recalcitrant companies and have peace in your time. At least until someone makes a fart joke on instagram. Then you're fucked.

Yes. "Yellow" is very apt for them, because they're all cowards.

Chaosium has doubled and tripled down on their virtue signaling since the founder passed away. Like god damn vultures

Quote from: Ocule on June 03, 2023, 11:44:39 PM
Chaosium has doubled and tripled down on their virtue signaling since the founder passed away. Like god damn vultures

Yes, and this is why your list is so important. I was about to order a considerable amount to get started but I got vintage stuff instead, even though it's a bit more costly it's worth it.

I hope you will consider HP Lovecraft Historical Society for yellow list as well, I had to cancel my order after I found they were woke too.

Latest situation with Bud Light and Target shows we can make an impact if we decide to take a stand against the nonsense.

Does lovecraft society produce rpg material thought they were more about books