After reading that trainwreck of a thread on RPG.net, I figure I'll throw in my two cents on the matter.  I'll be stereotyping offensively throughout all of this.  Also, I'm gay, so that gives me bonus leverage in criticizing these weepy cunts.

First of all, people on the "social justice" bandwagon tend to be extremely weak, passive individuals who can't handle conflict at all.  Instead of dealing with conflict in an adult manner--that is, talking things out and occasionally screaming at one another until things are resolved--they immediately run to their Internet hugboxes where they can whine and whimper about nonsense ideas like "privilege" and "cis blindness" so their equally dull-witted, cowardly allies will reassure them.  They demand lockstep support with their ideology, and any deviation from what they deem acceptable is met with hostility and name-calling.  If the person who is part of the Social Justice Squad (SJS hereafter) has any degree of power over the situation, the power will be abused and tyranny enforced because feelings are Very Important to the SJS.  (If you don't believe me, visit a feminist website and agree with every feminist issue except mention that you're pro-life.  You won't survive very long.)

RPG.net, of course, fosters this attitude and causes it to thrive.  Because here on theRPGSite, I can just say, "Fuck off, you whiny faggot," and even though it's not nice, people will deal with it, grievances will be aired, and discussions will take place.  On RPG.net, however, subtle attacks and passive-aggressive behavior are encouraged because anyone stepping out of line with the feelgood "Internet safezone" modsquad is banned.  So, yes, there you have an environment that caters to weak-willed nerds, which is why the SJS crowd populates that particular website.

On top of this, Kynn is transgender, and transgenderism is a mental disorder.  I realize this is a contentious statement in the era of political correctness, but if you are transgender--and I honestly mean no offense with this--you are fucked in the head.  Believing you are a woman (or man) trapped in a man's (or woman's) body is crazy.  Completely batshit insane.  And while I don't wish any ill-will to anyone who is transgender, I'm also not about to put up with any bullshit about how "they're completely normal" and "you have cis privilege."  (Of course I have cis privilege; I'm not a lunatic.)  Flooding your body with hormones and flaying your penis, turning it inside out, and transforming it into a pseudogina is not the behavior of someone who is mentally stable.  Sorry.  Them's the breaks.  And obviously, someone who is crazy enough to believe that s/he is transgender is probably going to be crazy enough to have fucked up opinions.  And lo and behold, Kynn has fucked up opinions fed by the victim complex of the SJS.

See, the difference between Kynn and I--despite me being mostly sane and him/her being mostly crazy--is that my viewpoints are very conservative (especially for a homo).  Life sucks, it's not fair, and you either deal with it or you don't.  When someone isn't nice to me, I have two options: shrug it off or get whiny about it.  I choose to shrug it off.  In addition, I have very realistic expectations about homophobia and the people around me.  No, I don't expect everyone to immediately accept my being gay and throw me a pride parade because that's not how people work.  Nor do I want them to.  Overall, I want my sexual orientation to be left alone, as it is not the focus of my existence; it's just a side part of who I am.  Kynn, on the other hand, is clearly consumed with being transgendered and it defines his/her personality.  Because of that, any talk on transgenderism is a talk about Kynn's personality, so anything like "gee, transgenderism sure is unusual" is an shrieking assault on Kynn's character.  (If you read the thread, you would see where Kynn got offended by someone abbreviate "transgender" as "TG" and mentioning that transgendered people were relatively rare because that was "erasing his/her existence.")

On top of this, women are often extremely irrational.  You can call me a sexist if you want, but it's true.  Women get bent out of shape over the dumbest shit.  Obviously, there are some legitimate issues with sexism in society (and D&D, with things like the chainkini), but women overreact a lot, especially women in the SJS.  Read any feminist blog, or, better yet, read about this dramasplosion between Rebecca Watson and Richard Dawkins.  Women make huge deals out of innocuous situations and then bitterly shriek and wail about it.  They also immediately blame any female-to-male ratio discrepancies on sexism.  (Hint: The reason there are few women construction workers and football players has nothing to do with sexism.)  Any attempt to reason with them on the basis that they might just be overreacting a teeny-tiny bit is MANSPLAINING and MALE PRIVILEGE.  Basically, the understanding and tolerance street goes one way, and if you don't flow with the traffic, you're a misogynist.

To wrap this rambling up, let's talk about the RPG industry.

1. Is there sexism in the RPG industry?  Yes.  Do I care?  Not really.  I'd like to tone down the cheesecake art, but I'm something of a prude myself.
2. Why are there fewer women gamers?  Probably because math and killing dragons is less appealing to women than men.
3. Are women valuable members of the RPG community?  Absolutely.  I love gaming with a mix of men and women because, in my experience, the women generally enjoy roleplay and the men enjoy killing things.  This helps strike a nice balance and also helps diminish any retardation like "DUDE HOW BIG ARE THE BARTENDER'S TITS."
3. Is RPG.net cancer?  Yes.  Is the feminist movement filled with worthless dramaqueens and beta males whiteknighting for them?  Absolutely.

Quote from: Pseudoephedrine;469861Fuck you, you hypocritical ass-scab. You have no grounds to criticise RPG.net for censorship or banning so long as Seanchai is banned. Unban him and you might have a leg to stand on.

Seanchai is banned? How so? When did it happen?

Quote from: B.T.;469890After reading that trainwreck of a thread on RPG.net, I figure I'll throw in my two cents on the matter.  I'll be stereotyping offensively throughout all of this.  Also, I'm gay, so that gives me bonus leverage in criticizing these weepy cunts.

First of all, people on the "social justice" bandwagon tend to be extremely weak, passive individuals who can't handle conflict at all.  Instead of dealing with conflict in an adult manner--that is, talking things out and occasionally screaming at one another until things are resolved--they immediately run to their Internet hugboxes where they can whine and whimper about nonsense ideas like "privilege" and "cis blindness" so their equally dull-witted, cowardly allies will reassure them.  They demand lockstep support with their ideology, and any deviation from what they deem acceptable is met with hostility and name-calling.  If the person who is part of the Social Justice Squad (SQS hereafter) has any degree of power over the situation, the power will be abused and tyranny enforced because feelings are Very Important to the SQS.  (If you don't believe me, visit a feminist website and agree with every feminist issue except mention that you're pro-life.  You won't survive very long.)

RPG.net, of course, fosters this attitude and causes it to thrive.  Because here on theRPGSite, I can just say, "Fuck off, you whiny faggot," and even though it's not nice, people will deal with it, grievances are aired, and discussions take place.  On RPG.net, however, subtle attacks and passive-aggressive behavior are encouraged because anyone stepping out of line with the feelgood "Internet safezone" modsquad is banned.  So, yes, there you have an environment that caters to weak-willed nerds, which is why the SQS crowd populates that particular website.

On top of this, Kynn is transgender, and transgenderism is a mental disorder.  I realize this is a contentious statement in the era of political correctness, but if you are transgender--and I honestly mean no offense with this--you are fucked in the head.  Believing you are a woman (or man) trapped in a man's (or woman's) body is crazy.  Completely batshit insane.  And while I don't wish any ill-will to anyone who is transgender, I'm also not about to put up with any bullshit about how "they're completely normal" and "you have cis privilege."  (Of course I have cis privilege; I'm not a lunatic.)  Flooding your body with hormones and flaying your penis, turning it inside out, and transforming it into a pseudogina is not the behavior of someone who is mentally stable.  Sorry.  Them's the breaks.  And obviously, someone who is crazy enough to believe that s/he is transgender is probably going to be crazy enough to have fucked up opinions.  And lo and behold, Kynn has fucked up opinions fed by the victim complex of the SQS.

See, the difference between Kynn and I--despite me being mostly sane and him/her being mostly crazy--is that my viewpoints are very conservative (especially for a homo).  Life sucks, it's not fair, and you either deal with it or you don't.  When someone isn't nice to me, I have two options: shrug it off or get whiny about it.  I choose to shrug it off.  In addition, I have very realistic expectations about homophobia and the people around me.  No, I don't expect everyone to immediately accept my being gay and throw me a pride parade because that's not how people work.  Nor do I want them to.  Overall, I want my sexual orientation to be left alone, as it is not the focus of my existence; it's just a side part of who I am.  Kynn, on the other hand, is clearly consumed with being transgendered and it defines his/her personality.  Because of that, any talk on transgenderism is a talk about Kynn's personality, so anything like "gee, transgenderism sure is unusual" is an shrieking assault on Kynn's character.  (If you read the thread, you would see where Kynn got offended by someone abbreviate "transgender" as "TG" and mentioning that transgendered people were relatively rare because that was "erasing his/her existence.")

On top of this, women are often extremely irrational.  You can call me a sexist if you want, but it's true.  Women get bent out of shape over the dumbest shit.  Obviously, there are some legitimate issues with sexism in society (and D&D, with things like the chainkini), but women overreact a lot, especially women in the SQS.  Read any feminist blog, or, better yet, read about this dramasplosion between Rebecca Watson and Richard Dawkins.  Women make huge deals out of innocuous situations and then bitterly shriek and wail about it.  They also immediately blame any female-to-male ratio discrepancies on sexism.  (Hint: The reason there are few women construction workers and football players has nothing to do with sexism.)  Any attempt to reason with them on the basis that they might just be overreacting a teeny-tiny bit[/url] is MANSPLAINING and MALE PRIVILEGE.  Basically, the understanding and tolerance street goes one way, and if you don't flow with the traffic, you're a misogynist.

To wrap this rambling up, let's talk about the RPG industry.

1. Is there sexism in the RPG industry?  Yes.  Do I care?  Not really.  I'd like to tone down the cheesecake art, but I'm something of a prude myself.
2. Why are there fewer women gamers?  Probably because math and killing dragons is less appealing to women than men.
3. Are women valuable members of the RPG community?  Absolutely.  I love gaming with a mix of men and women because, in my experience, the women generally enjoy roleplay and the men enjoy killing things.  This helps strike a nice balance and also helps diminish any retardation like "DUDE HOW BIG ARE THE BARTENDER'S TITS."
3. Is RPG.net cancer?  Yes.  Is the feminist movement filled with worthless dramaqueens and beta males whiteknighting for them?  Absolutely.

Should we ever meet, I will gladly buy you a beer for this awesome post.

Quote from: jeff37923;469895Should we ever meet, I will gladly buy you a beer for this awesome post.

Ditto. Great no BS post.

Quote from: Imperator;469894Seanchai is banned? How so? When did it happen?

On page 10 of the When is Point Buy acceptable thread, of all places.

Well, I guess it was only a matter of time until the gender wars reached these shores.  I swear to God, it's like the entire internet suddenly realized that, since there's a black man in the White House and thus it's Not Cool to whine about race anymore, they'll just go back to good old fashioned gender wars instead!

Thing about war is though, in the end, everyone looks like an asshole.  And I can't think of any better way to describe the events I've been observing for the past month or so than that.  

You know what I thought was most fucked up about the particular battle this thread was started over?  For all the mischaracterization I've seen in this thread of what I saw of RPGnet's initial response to this, some of the stupidest attacks I saw on this game were from other feminists.  

I expect the usual "call something sexist, have guys respond with sexist remarks" thing, it's pretty much a rule of the internet, especially when gaming is involved.  

But at the same time you had the vagina warrior types who are so fucking defined by their role in the gender wars that they have to comb through every last thing for any perceived offense against their "side", to the extent of attacking this game right out the gate because "We don't need your help" or some shit like that.

Because the bottom line is, once you start looking at something as basic as the relationships between the sexes as a "war", you're pretty fuckin' gone. It's a completely fucking warped perspective, and it just winds up with everyone being absolute douchewaffles to one another while being totally oblivious to the fact that the conflict they're seeing has as much to do with their own behavior as anyone else's.  

That's why fucking "privilege" is such a stupid fucking concept.  It's maybe technically true on an academic level, but on a basic discourse level, it is absolutely fucking useless.  It is the "nuclear option" of gender discussions, it's sticking your fingers in your ears and declaring "LALALALALALA You're privileged you'll never understand".  That's all it is, it's a debate ender, not a conversation.

You have a problem with something's portrayal being sexist, then you can do one of two things: 1) you can put your money where your mouth is, and make something better yourself, 2) or you can tell people what's wrong, really tell them, and hope they come around.  

I realize #2 can seem pretty fucking hopeless in a sausagefest like this hobby, but what you absolutely do not do is take that for some kind of declaration of war, and simply march about declaring shit "sexist" as if that explains anything, and then accuse the "other side" of being "too privileged" to understand when someone responds.

Gender relationships are fuckin' complicated, and after thousands of years of human evolution we're not that much closer to figuring all this shit out, but the thing is, this is something people do every day and while they have their problems, they work it the fuck out, or they live pretty lonely fucking lives.  It's called being a fucking grownup.  

Staking your claim and declaring your side like it's some kind of war just makes you sound like a fucking child.

Quote from: RPGPundit;469847Villains?

Isn't he the villain from Gangs of New York? Or are you thinking he wasn't a villain? Either way, the character's awesome.

Quote from: B.T.;469890After reading that trainwreck of a thread on RPG.net, I figure I'll throw in my two cents on the matter.  I'll be stereotyping offensively throughout all of this.  Also, I'm gay, so that gives me bonus leverage in criticizing these weepy cunts.

First of all, people on the "social justice" bandwagon tend to be extremely weak, passive individuals who can't handle conflict at all.  Instead of dealing with conflict in an adult manner--that is, talking things out and occasionally screaming at one another until things are resolved--they immediately run to their Internet hugboxes where they can whine and whimper about nonsense ideas like "privilege" and "cis blindness" so their equally dull-witted, cowardly allies will reassure them.  They demand lockstep support with their ideology, and any deviation from what they deem acceptable is met with hostility and name-calling.  If the person who is part of the Social Justice Squad (SQS hereafter) has any degree of power over the situation, the power will be abused and tyranny enforced because feelings are Very Important to the SQS.  (If you don't believe me, visit a feminist website and agree with every feminist issue except mention that you're pro-life.  You won't survive very long.)

RPG.net, of course, fosters this attitude and causes it to thrive.  Because here on theRPGSite, I can just say, "Fuck off, you whiny faggot," and even though it's not nice, people will deal with it, grievances are aired, and discussions take place.  On RPG.net, however, subtle attacks and passive-aggressive behavior are encouraged because anyone stepping out of line with the feelgood "Internet safezone" modsquad is banned.  So, yes, there you have an environment that caters to weak-willed nerds, which is why the SQS crowd populates that particular website.

On top of this, Kynn is transgender, and transgenderism is a mental disorder.  I realize this is a contentious statement in the era of political correctness, but if you are transgender--and I honestly mean no offense with this--you are fucked in the head.  Believing you are a woman (or man) trapped in a man's (or woman's) body is crazy.  Completely batshit insane.  And while I don't wish any ill-will to anyone who is transgender, I'm also not about to put up with any bullshit about how "they're completely normal" and "you have cis privilege."  (Of course I have cis privilege; I'm not a lunatic.)  Flooding your body with hormones and flaying your penis, turning it inside out, and transforming it into a pseudogina is not the behavior of someone who is mentally stable.  Sorry.  Them's the breaks.  And obviously, someone who is crazy enough to believe that s/he is transgender is probably going to be crazy enough to have fucked up opinions.  And lo and behold, Kynn has fucked up opinions fed by the victim complex of the SQS.

See, the difference between Kynn and I--despite me being mostly sane and him/her being mostly crazy--is that my viewpoints are very conservative (especially for a homo).  Life sucks, it's not fair, and you either deal with it or you don't.  When someone isn't nice to me, I have two options: shrug it off or get whiny about it.  I choose to shrug it off.  In addition, I have very realistic expectations about homophobia and the people around me.  No, I don't expect everyone to immediately accept my being gay and throw me a pride parade because that's not how people work.  Nor do I want them to.  Overall, I want my sexual orientation to be left alone, as it is not the focus of my existence; it's just a side part of who I am.  Kynn, on the other hand, is clearly consumed with being transgendered and it defines his/her personality.  Because of that, any talk on transgenderism is a talk about Kynn's personality, so anything like "gee, transgenderism sure is unusual" is an shrieking assault on Kynn's character.  (If you read the thread, you would see where Kynn got offended by someone abbreviate "transgender" as "TG" and mentioning that transgendered people were relatively rare because that was "erasing his/her existence.")

On top of this, women are often extremely irrational.  You can call me a sexist if you want, but it's true.  Women get bent out of shape over the dumbest shit.  Obviously, there are some legitimate issues with sexism in society (and D&D, with things like the chainkini), but women overreact a lot, especially women in the SQS.  Read any feminist blog, or, better yet, read about this dramasplosion between Rebecca Watson and Richard Dawkins.  Women make huge deals out of innocuous situations and then bitterly shriek and wail about it.  They also immediately blame any female-to-male ratio discrepancies on sexism.  (Hint: The reason there are few women construction workers and football players has nothing to do with sexism.)  Any attempt to reason with them on the basis that they might just be overreacting a teeny-tiny bit[/url] is MANSPLAINING and MALE PRIVILEGE.  Basically, the understanding and tolerance street goes one way, and if you don't flow with the traffic, you're a misogynist.

To wrap this rambling up, let's talk about the RPG industry.

1. Is there sexism in the RPG industry?  Yes.  Do I care?  Not really.  I'd like to tone down the cheesecake art, but I'm something of a prude myself.
2. Why are there fewer women gamers?  Probably because math and killing dragons is less appealing to women than men.
3. Are women valuable members of the RPG community?  Absolutely.  I love gaming with a mix of men and women because, in my experience, the women generally enjoy roleplay and the men enjoy killing things.  This helps strike a nice balance and also helps diminish any retardation like "DUDE HOW BIG ARE THE BARTENDER'S TITS."
3. Is RPG.net cancer?  Yes.  Is the feminist movement filled with worthless dramaqueens and beta males whiteknighting for them?  Absolutely.

I...I just peed a little. You've no idea how good it feels to read that. Not because it fits how I believe, but that you are able to post it and not get banned!

Quote from: B.T.;469890(Hint: The reason there are few women construction workers and football players has nothing to do with sexism.)

Eh that depends how or rather where you look at it really...




That's not to draw any cultural lines as to who is being sexist in the above cases, but however. I'll say it again, this whole farce seems like a huge distraction from the serious business of having fun.

Quote from: The Traveller;469919I'll say it again, this whole farce seems like a huge distraction from the serious business of having fun.

Whoa, I learned on RPG.net that you can't have fun unless you're pushing an agenda and making others miserable by flaunting your privilege!

Seriously, you are correct.

Quote from: DKChannelBoredom;469896Ditto. Great no BS post.

On page 10 of the When is Point Buy acceptable thread, of all places.

Wow. I didn't read that thread and there was no other thread alluding to that, that must be why I missed it.

Well, a man's patience is limited.

Oh, and by the way, B.T., I'll buy your drinks should you ever visit Barcelona. Great post:)

Quote from: Pseudoephedrine;469876I'm uninterested in your specious defense, Pundit.

No, what you seem most interested in is trying to cling on to any excuse to avoid having to address your own pathetic PC beliefs; being stuck in the hard place of having to either disavow feminism or defend a politic of censorship you know will leave everyone here opposed to you.

RPGPundit

Quote from: Talking_Muffin;469905Isn't he the villain from Gangs of New York? Or are you thinking he wasn't a villain? Either way, the character's awesome.

Suggesting that Bill the Butcher was the villain would in essence seem to suggest that Leonardo Di Caprio was a "hero".  And I can't even write that without putting in quotation marks around it.

Bill was the only guy in the entire film that actually Got It, that understood what was happening.  That alone to me makes him, if not the "hero", then at least the real protagonist.

RPGPundit

Quote from: RPGPundit;469927Bill was the only guy in the entire film that actually Got It, that understood what was happening.

I'd have put my money on Brendan Gleeson to be honest.

The interesting thing about feminism is that its not one single thing; but I don't mean that in the typical "there are lots of feminisms we're not all so bad" sort of thing.   I mean it in the sense that feminism is in essence an ideology that devours itself, as the latest effort to be the "Most Enlightened" inevitably requires a purge of what went before.

2nd wave feminists, for example, would have taken serious issue in many cases with the fact that the writer of this game is a MtF transsexual, because some of their luminaries taught that the MtF transsexual is nothing but a "male eunuch" who "seeks to usurp femininity by transforming himself into a mockery of patriarchal images of the woman".  They believed that transsexual women, far from being real women, were portraying a PARODY of everything the patriarchy says a woman has to be: all lipstick and dresses and mincing around like Emily Howard from Little Britain, being a "lady" and doing "ladies' things".  Why? Fear; they were terrified that if they acknowledged trangenders then they would also be forced to acknowledge that there was something biological about femininity in its "patriarchal" definition.

That group is mostly out of favor these days, though they still pop up (recently in Vancouver a feminist woman's shelter gained some notoriety when they refused to allow MtF transsexuals from volunteering there or receiving assistance from them, on account of them not being "real women").  The group that dominates RPG.net tends to be of the 3rd wave of feminism, which is much more obsessed with ideas of "inclusiveness", of everything other than white males, and ironically (because of its obsession with "privilege" having evolved beyond the concept of mere biological gender, into issues of class, race, and sexuality) probably rate white middle-class women as the people 2nd least worthy of listening to after white males. They aren't based so much on fear as they are on hate and a lust to control.  They see the old struggle for equality as basically useless.  What they want now is not to be mens' equals, or to be apart from men in some kind of wymyn's utopia; they want hardcore social engineering that destroys what they imagine as "privilege", which unfortunately happens to be most of the virtues of Western Civilization that have been the only thing keeping us from descending into utter decadence and becoming fat worthless easy-pickings for the barbarians at our gates.

You see similar shit like this happening in GLBT studies, where of course there are certain "old school" gays, like our own B.T. apparently is, that reject transgenderism as a dangerous, almost treasonous element within their movement, because they see it as an emasculation; knowing all too well that historically, homosexual men often could only have a place in society as transvestites, being forced (you could even say punished) by their desires to become "like women".  In many primitive or backward societies you still see that, which is why in Iran, for example, homosexuality is punishable by death but if you're a man who declares that you want to become a woman the Iranian government pays for every step of your transition and society accommodates you.

Anyways, personally I think they're all fucking idiots.  B.T.'s comments more or less included. Seriously, if you've bought into that whole idea of "transgenderism is a mental disease"/ male-eunuchs-playing-at-ladies bullshit, then you're basically a fucking retard. You don't like the pussy, fine, and you get freaked out at the idea that someone else would want to have one. But seriously dude, your argument is essentially demanding the idea that gender identity is optional, or even that "gender" not exist as a biological concept.  It does.

And yes, most women ARE extremely irrational, so are most men.
You know who sometimes are not? Individuals.  You'll recognize them as those who don't make fucking excuses for themselves by hiding behind some kind of group mentality construct.

Kynn's problem, and the problem of those who fawned over the idea of this RPG, was not that they were transsexuals or women, it was that they were fucking retards. Kynn was apparently a manipulative piece of shit, those who praised this project were hipsters desperate to assuage their white/male guilt or lazy failed human beings that were looking for some utopian formula they could cleave to with all the fanaticism of religion (without, you know, actually being anything nearly as demanding or sophisticated as religion), and they were all basically collectivists.  Not in the Stalin/5-year-plan kind of sense, but in the sense that they were all too happy to not have to be individuals and to instead want to get their little Groovy Cards punched to show that they were members in good standing of the Head Up Your Ass club.

I have to find myself in agreement with your conclusions; but when you show your work something fails to add up for me, B.T. I get the feeling that there's an undertone in your long-division that you've drunk some kool-aid of your own in terms of the notions you have.

Your post just smacked a little too hard of someone wanting to get their own Groovy Card punched too, I'm just not totally sure by WHO yet.

RPGPundit

Quote from: The Traveller;469929I'd have put my money on Brendan Gleeson to be honest.

Nope. He clearly did not get it. The cleaver in his back proved it.

RPGPundit