Shadowrun system..

Silverlion · July 30, 2012, 06:31:08 PM

Just a note. While I build SR characters by hand, their are a couple of free computer programs (Daegenns, and Chummer) which let one build 20A/4E characters quickly.

warp9 · July 30, 2012, 07:09:24 PM

Quote from: Halloween Jack;566452IME Shadowrun is a world where megacorporations own almost everything,

Obviously the mega-corps have a great deal of power in some locations, I was never quite sure how the Tribal Nations were supposed to fit into that whole picture. And areas like the Tir seemed to have their own type of ruler-ship by elven nobles.

gleichman · July 30, 2012, 07:14:23 PM

Quote from: warp9;566531Obviously the mega-corps have a great deal of power in some locations, I was never quite sure how the Tribal Nations were supposed to fit into that whole picture. And areas like the Tir seemed to have their own type of ruler-ship by elven nobles.

Fit? Shadowrun is a kitchen sink, not a simulated world. Asking if something fits with respect to the official setting is a fool's game.

Better to decide on your own what does and does not exist in the setting and how it relates to other elements.

warp9 · July 30, 2012, 07:14:42 PM

Quote from: gleichman;566404For a setting that is all about the dysfunction of civilization, Shadowrun is all about everybody and everything be 'valid' and equal.

Is it all about the dysfunction of civilization?

I'd say that cyberpunk is about the dysfunction of civilization, but Shadowrun is not really pure cyberpunk, it is a mixture of things.

gleichman · July 30, 2012, 07:17:04 PM

Quote from: warp9;566535Is it all about the dysfunction of civilization?

I'd say that cyberpunk is about the dysfunction of civilization, but Shadowrun is not really pure cyberpunk, it is a mixture of things.

I sort of agree with you in the post just above your reply.

And it's exactly that mixture I'm complaining about it- it doesn't know what it is and that causes serious problems for gamers of a simulation bent. The first thing IMO Shadowrun needs is a chainsaw taken to it's setting (I had the same problems with Deadlands).

warp9 · July 30, 2012, 07:30:47 PM

Quote from: gleichman;566539I sort of agree with you in the post just above your reply.

And it's exactly that mixture I'm complaining about it- it doesn't know what it is and that causes serious problems for gamers of a simulation bent. The first thing IMO Shadowrun needs is a chainsaw taken to it's setting (I had the same problems with Deadlands).

Yeah, that does make sense.

Halloween Jack · July 31, 2012, 08:30:01 AM

Quote from: warp9;566531Obviously the mega-corps have a great deal of power in some locations, I was never quite sure how the Tribal Nations were supposed to fit into that whole picture. And areas like the Tir seemed to have their own type of ruler-ship by elven nobles.

I think the political state of the NAN could be compared to the US when it was bound only by the Articles of Confederation. As for the makeup of the individual nations, the best explanation I got was someone who said, paraphrased, "In order for 'Native Americans' to actually populate and hold that much territory, they had to be very generous in their definition of 'Native.'"

Sigmund · July 31, 2012, 01:16:42 PM

Quote from: Halloween Jack;566729I think the political state of the NAN could be compared to the US when it was bound only by the Articles of Confederation.

That's kinda the way I've always looked at it. I kinda also compare it now to the EU. They will band together for mutual defense, and give each other trade concessions, and even develop a common currency, but also still bicker with each other and on a governmental level remain suspicious of each other.

QuoteAs for the makeup of the individual nations, the best explanation I got was someone who said, paraphrased, "In order for 'Native Americans' to actually populate and hold that much territory, they had to be very generous in their definition of 'Native.'"

I think this is a good point, hadn't thought of it but it makes sense. Especially if they are going to be prejudiced against non-humans (I had originally written "metahumans", but silva pointed out that the modern usage of the term includes humans).

silva · July 31, 2012, 01:20:33 PM

As an aside, I think the term "metahuman" in 1st and 2nd editions referred only to non-human races, no (elves, dwarves, orcs and trolls) ? While from 3rd onwards its used for humans too, right?

Sigmund · July 31, 2012, 01:30:16 PM

Quote from: silva;566858As an aside, I think the term "metahuman" in 1st and 2nd editions referred only to non-human races, no (elves, dwarves, orcs and trolls) ? While from 3rd onwards its used for humans too, right?

I think so, but in my context above I meant it as non-human only, although the more modern usage did come to mind. Hope it isn't too confusing. I think I'll amend it.

silva · July 31, 2012, 01:34:00 PM

No, thats ok. I got it.

I still prefer the old usage though. More discriminating and racist that way, more in line with the social post-apoc feeling of the original setting.

Sigmund · July 31, 2012, 01:45:30 PM

Quote from: silva;566864No, thats ok. I got it.

I still prefer the old usage though. More discriminating and racist that way, more in line with the social post-apoc feeling of the original setting.

I agree. Might be a small example of the liberalism that the arrogant Mr. G has previously referred to.

crkrueger · July 31, 2012, 03:38:28 PM

The original term of metahuman was usually associated with a non-human.

Metatype however, was considered what branch of Homo Sapiens you were, so Humans were one of the metatypes.
Humans = Homo Sapiens Sapiens
Elves = Homo Sapiens Nobilis
Dwarves = Homo Sapiens Pumilionis
Orks = Homo Sapiens Robustus
Trolls = Homo Sapiens Ingentis

Metahumanity was usually used to refer to all the metatypes of Homo Sapiens.

But it depends who you talk to. Talking to a Humanis Goon who mentions a "meta" you know they're talking about non-humans. Talking to a liberal activist who says "all of metahumanity", they're probably talking about everyone including sasquatches.