Quote from: VisionStorm on March 28, 2022, 08:41:58 AM

Quote from: Ghostmaker on March 28, 2022, 08:31:07 AM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on March 27, 2022, 10:26:40 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 27, 2022, 10:23:46 PM
It's funny, the idea that "shield maidens" are somehow a conservative symbol, given that the very concept of "shield maidens" is a historically dubious idea that got pushed into this narrative of "there were entire batallions of shield maidens in every viking army" by feminist academics.

Were there some women who fought with viking men? Almost certainly. But there's very little proof that they were anything but rare, and mostly existed only in folk tales and mythology. There's no evidence that women were regularly warriors.

The proof is that when there were women warriors people noticed and wrote/told about it. Because it was so fucking rare, except in sieges, the loosing city womenfolk commonly fought off the invaders, because they were in a siege and couldn't escape.

Desperation can inspire greatness, though it's not exactly the sort of thing you want to rely on.

True, though, the case could be made that Norse culture allowed women to train with weapons, which made them more capable of fending off attacks, even if they weren't primary warriors.

As long as there's evidence for it.

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 27, 2022, 10:23:46 PM
It's funny, the idea that "shield maidens" are somehow a conservative symbol, given that the very concept of "shield maidens" is a historically dubious idea that got pushed into this narrative of "there were entire batallions of shield maidens in every viking army" by feminist academics.

Were there some women who fought with viking men? Almost certainly. But there's very little proof that they were anything but rare, and mostly existed only in folk tales and mythology. There's no evidence that women were regularly warriors.

I'd agree about a historical setting. When I ran a semi-historical vikings game, any women warriors were the rare exception even though they were known in folklore. However, that makes women warrior fit fine with the Mongoose game since it is about re-interpreted mythology. This is the description I see:

QuoteYou are a daughter of Freya, blessed by the divine. It is your task to free Yggdrasil from the tyrannical forces that control the greatest source of power: Ymir's Blood. Elves have been ripping worlds apart for it, and Fenrir is killing Midgard with their constant drilling. The lifeblood of worlds is almost spent, and the Shield Maidens are the only thing that stands between the spring and fimbulwinter. You will meet all manner of mythical and technological figures throughout your journeys on the Bifrost, and you alone can save them.

Shield Maidens brings Vikings and cyberpunk together, melding to form a Norse inspired science-fiction tabletop roleplaying game.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on March 28, 2022, 12:38:30 PM

As long as there's evidence for it.

I've seen a few accounts where women took up arms in desperate moments.

But these are few and far between the vast majority that do not for whatever reasons.

None of which has a thing to do with Radiant Citadel.

And as usual. After the initial baiting they go quiet about what all else is in the book. SOP WOTC now-a-days.

I doubt it will actually be an adventure book without any conflict or anything like that.
The worst thing about the book is how uncreative this is. You have multiverse location that brings together people from many fantasy worlds based on Earth's cultures. So it's just like an average big US city. Scratch that. It's worse than that since big cities have racial tensions, crime, conflict, dark alleys etc. Everything that Radiant Citadel lacks.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on March 27, 2022, 04:10:58 PM

Quote from: Mistwell on March 27, 2022, 04:04:47 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on March 27, 2022, 02:15:39 PM

Quote from: Mistwell on March 27, 2022, 12:40:26 AM

Quote from: jeff37923 on March 24, 2022, 08:41:06 PM

Quote from: Omega on March 24, 2022, 08:10:38 PM
Eh, we do not know that yet and odds are WOTC is being deceptive again in some manner.

The very adventures set in the city show its not all sparkles and rainbows. The mask slips before its even out the gate.

They want people to bitch about it.

Outrage Marketing? Well, WotC drones do have a tendency to buy anything they make, regardless of how craptastic it is.

Hmmm, do you think that Mongoose is doing the same thing with Shield Maidens?

Is outrage marketing the new thing in game advertising?

I think they just like tweaking the alt-right in the same manner the alt-right likes tweaking the SJWs.

Impliying that anyone who doesn't like the turd sandwhich is part of the Alt-Right...

No you just made a false inference. They are DOING IT to piss off the alt-right. That it also pisses off others who are not part of the alt-right isn't their aim. They might enjoy that as a side effect or might not, but I think their aim is to piss off the alt-right.

Okay then, you're still wrong, they do it to inject their ideology or destroy the vehicle. Any of those is a win for them.

If that were the case, they wouldn't SAY they're doing it and then end up not doing it. They'd actually do it if the point were to actually change people's ideology, right? Naw, it's to tweak people off. Which is a proven strategy to gain attention. Heck, it was a major component of Trump's marketing for his campaign.

Quote from: jeff37923 on March 27, 2022, 07:10:14 PM

Quote from: Mistwell on March 27, 2022, 04:04:47 PM
They are DOING IT to piss off the alt-right. That it also pisses off others who are not part of the alt-right isn't their aim. They might enjoy that as a side effect or might not, but I think their aim is to piss off the alt-right.

By your inference, anyone who is irked by their baiting bullshit is an alt-right....

I literally just said the opposite in the very paragraph you quoted. You cannot make that inference if you comprehended the paragraph.

The alt-right is a sub-category of "people not on the left." Their intent is to piss off that sub-category. If you are also pissed off about it also, that doesn't make you a member of the sub-category, it just makes you a member of the large group of "people not on the left" who are pissed by it. You're not their target - the alt-right is their target. You are merely collateral damage and/or a bonus, depending on their view of things.

The intent, I believe, is to spread word about the product by upsetting people they perceive to be both unpopular in the larger audience they're actually targeting for sales, AND who talk about it a lot on the Internet. This is, again, a strategy Trump also used - piss off loud progressives who complain on the Internet about Trump a whole lot, which gets the attention of the rest of the nation which isn't enamored with progressives. It's a marketing technique which costs very little in marketing dollars but gains a large bang for those few resources in attention. In this case they perceive the alt-right to be relatively unpopular with the larger general target audience for D&D products right now, but also prone to complain loudly about WOTC products on the Internet. Which attracts the attention of the target larger general population not particularly enamored by the alt-right.

Quote from: Mistwell on March 29, 2022, 04:26:20 PM

Quote from: jeff37923 on March 27, 2022, 07:10:14 PM

Quote from: Mistwell on March 27, 2022, 04:04:47 PM
They are DOING IT to piss off the alt-right. That it also pisses off others who are not part of the alt-right isn't their aim. They might enjoy that as a side effect or might not, but I think their aim is to piss off the alt-right.

By your inference, anyone who is irked by their baiting bullshit is an alt-right....

I literally just said the opposite in the very paragraph you quoted. You cannot make that inference if you comprehended the paragraph.

The alt-right is a sub-category of "people not on the left." Their intent is to piss off that sub-category. If you are also pissed off about it also, that doesn't make you a member of the sub-category, it just makes you a member of the large group of "people not on the left" who are pissed by it. You're not their target - the alt-right is their target. You are merely collateral damage and/or a bonus, depending on their view of things.

The intent, I believe, is to spread word about the product by upsetting people they perceive to be both unpopular in the larger audience they're actually targeting for sales, AND who talk about it a lot on the Internet. This is, again, a strategy Trump also used - piss off loud progressives who complain on the Internet about Trump a whole lot, which gets the attention of the rest of the nation which isn't enamored with progressives. It's a marketing technique which costs very little in marketing dollars but gains a large bang for those few resources in attention. In this case they perceive the alt-right to be relatively unpopular with the larger general target audience for D&D products right now, but also prone to complain loudly about WOTC products on the Internet. Which attracts the attention of the target larger general population not particularly enamored by the alt-right.

It isn't as much about comprehending the paragraph, but about comprehending your intent.

I especially like your Trump whataboutism. Nice touch that.

Quote from: Mistwell on March 29, 2022, 04:26:20 PM

Quote from: jeff37923 on March 27, 2022, 07:10:14 PM

Quote from: Mistwell on March 27, 2022, 04:04:47 PM
They are DOING IT to piss off the alt-right. That it also pisses off others who are not part of the alt-right isn't their aim. They might enjoy that as a side effect or might not, but I think their aim is to piss off the alt-right.

By your inference, anyone who is irked by their baiting bullshit is an alt-right....

I literally just said the opposite in the very paragraph you quoted. You cannot make that inference if you comprehended the paragraph.

The alt-right is a sub-category of "people not on the left." Their intent is to piss off that sub-category. If you are also pissed off about it also, that doesn't make you a member of the sub-category, it just makes you a member of the large group of "people not on the left" who are pissed by it. You're not their target - the alt-right is their target. You are merely collateral damage and/or a bonus, depending on their view of things.

The intent, I believe, is to spread word about the product by upsetting people they perceive to be both unpopular in the larger audience they're actually targeting for sales, AND who talk about it a lot on the Internet. This is, again, a strategy Trump also used - piss off loud progressives who complain on the Internet about Trump a whole lot, which gets the attention of the rest of the nation which isn't enamored with progressives. It's a marketing technique which costs very little in marketing dollars but gains a large bang for those few resources in attention. In this case they perceive the alt-right to be relatively unpopular with the larger general target audience for D&D products right now, but also prone to complain loudly about WOTC products on the Internet. Which attracts the attention of the target larger general population not particularly enamored by the alt-right.

But you're totally not saying that anyone that doesn't like the turd sandwhich is part of the Alt-Right...

I don't understand why they can't just bring back Planescape. Sigil was awesome. Planescape: Torment really sold how amazing the place is.

Quote from: BoxCrayonTales on March 29, 2022, 07:34:13 PM
I don't understand why they can't just bring back Planescape. Sigil was awesome. Planescape: Torment really sold how amazing the place is.

Considering how badly WotC handles everything, I'm glad they're leaving Planescape the F alone. Given how Planescape was the setting that basically introduced Tieflings, which appeal to a certain crowd, imagine how bad they would wokeify Sigil. The Lady of Pain would be LGBTBBQ+ and zapping people for misgendering her (which would probably be "them" now, or maybe "xer").

Quote from: VisionStorm on March 29, 2022, 08:02:40 PM

Quote from: BoxCrayonTales on March 29, 2022, 07:34:13 PM
I don't understand why they can't just bring back Planescape. Sigil was awesome. Planescape: Torment really sold how amazing the place is.

Considering how badly WotC handles everything, I'm glad they're leaving Planescape the F alone. Given how Planescape was the setting that basically introduced Tieflings, which appeal to a certain crowd, imagine how bad they would wokeify Sigil. The Lady of Pain would be LGBTBBQ+ and zapping people for misgendering her (which would probably be "them" now, or maybe "xer").

Yep, just leave Planescape alone...and that 'certain crowd' wouldn't last 5 minutes playing an actual tiefling back in 2e Sigil.
 
"Wait. What do you mean no one trusts me and some merchants are overcharging me...and the Hardheads always question me first when there's a disturbance..."   

Quote from: Mistwell on March 29, 2022, 04:26:20 PM
The intent, I believe, is to spread word about the product by upsetting people they perceive to be both unpopular in the larger audience they're actually targeting for sales, AND who talk about it a lot on the Internet.

The Alt-Right were effectively banned from social media almost five years ago, so I'm guessing you don't mean the Alt-Right.

Quote from: Overcrowdedmarketplace on March 29, 2022, 03:34:15 PM
I doubt it will actually be an adventure book without any conflict or anything like that.
The worst thing about the book is how uncreative this is. You have multiverse location that brings together people from many fantasy worlds based on Earth's cultures. So it's just like an average big US city. Scratch that. It's worse than that since big cities have racial tensions, crime, conflict, dark alleys etc. Everything that Radiant Citadel lacks.

At least two of the mentioned adventures are conflict oriented in some manner. I'm guessing its going to be like Candlekeep where its all over the place in theme and tone.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on March 23, 2022, 04:58:04 PM
Trust me, I don't think the leftards even realized that the only way their Utopia cuold exist is with a strong man dictator with an iron hand in a very thin velvet glove fascist.

Doesn't mean my analysis isn't spot on IMHO. There's no way this place could ever exist without some type of fascist magic involved.

Agreed.

This level of understanding begins with the naive belief that their philosophy is so compelling that everyone will simply comply, and ends with the authoritarian belief that it'd all work out if only they had the power to make choices for others, and at no point is the middle of this dilemma explored.

Any place that wants to maintain peace that isnt somehow magically and thoroughly screened is going to need some manner of policing to put down every maniac out there that wants to destroy it for the giggles. Or people who think peace is boring. Or any given lunatic that thinks peace is oppression.

To have and maintain a utopia you are going to have to fight tooth and nail to keep it and find solutions to problems that dont end up turning the whole thing into a living hell.

So Radiant Citadel reads like its a place running on goodwill and probably has some sort of screening or violence damper for entry otherwise it it falls apart ASAP. As said. Sigil without the grime, and better policed.

People are going to buy the book just out of curiosity about these sorts of off topic discussions to see how they pull it off. Which is likely going to be another Candlekeep affair. For that matter Candlekeep has various defenses installed to keep things running.