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Is OSE now the Undisputed Champ of the OSR?

Started by Persimmon, July 19, 2022, 10:50:09 PM

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Spinachcat

#75
July 25, 2022, 08:34:18 PM
Palladium Fantasy 1e is one of the best fantasy RPGs in actual play. It's really remarkably great at the table, regardless of its wokiness on page.

VengerSatanis

#76
July 25, 2022, 09:10:38 PM
Quote from: Persimmon on July 19, 2022, 10:50:09 PM
So I was recently notified by Necromancer Games (affiliated with Frog God) that they're running a new Kickstarter for conversions of the Zach Glazar adventure/setting "Whisper & Venom."  What surprised me was that the conversions are for 5e and Old School Essentials.  I knew that Matt Finch had broken from Frog God and decided to take Swords & Wizardry with him despite a fairly successful Swords & Wizardry KS last year that produced a digest sized boxed set along the lines of those produced by Necrotic Gnome for OSE (and inspired by the LBB of course).  Not sure what prompted Finch to leave but the decision by Necromancer/Frog God to start producing material for OSE seems to be an indication that OSE is fully established as the "Top Dog" in the OSR these days.  They've even indicated they're emulating OSE's module layout with the bullets points (which I don't care for myself), though the verdict is still out on digest-sizing.

As for OSE, Gavin Norman has done a great job of marketing it.  He's essentially been recycling the same material in different packages for three years now yet each KS has surpassed the previous one.  The most recent one surpassed $770K and all it does is re-package old material.  Amazing what presentation, layout and buzz can do for you.  Even my pretty mediocre FLGS carries OSE products.  I like it well enough, but that's because of my love of B/X D&D and now that I have my Rules Tomes I see no need to keep buying the same material.  But OSE has seemingly driven Labyrinth Lord, which used to be the game that seemed to get the most third party material, into the ground.  I suspect S&W will retain its smaller niche market as should games like Hyperborea, which just released a third edition.  But they just don't seem to have the mass appeal of OSE.

So what do you think?  Is OSE the new champ?  What OSR game has a reasonable chance of dethroning it?

Crimson Dragon Slayer D20, of course!  Lol...

Armchair Gamer

#77
July 26, 2022, 07:58:58 AM
Quote from: Spinachcat on July 25, 2022, 08:34:18 PM
Palladium Fantasy 1e is one of the best fantasy RPGs in actual play. It's really remarkably great at the table, regardless of its wokiness on page.

  Did you mean 'wonkiness'? Because I have a hard time seeing any Palladium project--especially one from the early 80s--as 'woke' ... :)

weirdguy564

#78
July 26, 2022, 10:18:16 AM Last Edit: July 26, 2022, 10:29:14 AM by weirdguy564
Quote from: Armchair Gamer on July 26, 2022, 07:58:58 AM
Quote from: Spinachcat on July 25, 2022, 08:34:18 PM
Palladium Fantasy 1e is one of the best fantasy RPGs in actual play. It's really remarkably great at the table, regardless of its wokiness on page.

  Did you mean 'wonkiness'? Because I have a hard time seeing any Palladium project--especially one from the early 80s--as 'woke' ... :)

It's Palladium.  "Wonkiness" is just implied, right?   

It's definitely not woke.  It's got rules for drug use, and Ogres who reproduce using the old school method of just killing villager men and riding off with the good looking girls back to their lands. 
I'm glad for you if you like the top selling game of the genre.  Me, I like the road less travelled, and will be the player asking we try a game you've never heard of.

Chunkthulhu

#79
July 26, 2022, 11:49:59 AM
I have the Rules Tome, and the Advanced Fantasy add-ons from the original Kickstarter.  I've never used it once, though.  If I'm going to run something in that vein, I'm going to run either LotFP or just straight up B/X D&D.

Batjon

#80
July 26, 2022, 01:54:18 PM
OSE is simply the best in OSR.

danskmacabre

#81
July 26, 2022, 09:19:28 PM Last Edit: July 26, 2022, 09:24:19 PM by danskmacabre
I got the OSE Tome book in PDF format, as it was on sale on Drivethru anyway.
I don't have the Original Basic/Expert set of rules anymore and I like the idea of running it again for one offs etc.

It's a fun read and IMO the PDF is formatted well enough. 
The physical books in either tome or Boxed set aren't available to buy anyway, although even if they are, not sure I really need a physical copy of the rules seeing as they're so simple.


Frankly, I'm really over DnD 5E and might try and move the existing campaigns I'm running to this if I can convince the players. If I can, I'll just sell all my 5E Physical books.

jeff37923

#82
July 26, 2022, 09:38:15 PM
I have OSE and like it a lot. I also like Advanced Labyrinth Lord and Basic Fantasy. I would say that OSE, while good, is just the flavor of the season for OSR.
"Meh."

Eric Diaz

#83
July 27, 2022, 10:34:12 AM Last Edit: July 27, 2022, 11:29:53 AM by Eric Diaz
I think OSE is a cool game and looks great.

The only thing that amazes me is that the current flavor of OSR is so focused in being exactly like B/X that they apparently copied the typos.



Even if this wasn't a typo, and cook/marsh deliberately put it there to mess with out heads, we've had this game for about 40 years...

I love old school D&D, but is it unreasonable to think we could improve it even a little bit?

EDIT: wrote a full post about this sentiment.

https://methodsetmadness.blogspot.com/2022/07/minimalist-bx-ii-skills-and-nostalgia.html
Chaos Factory Books  - Dark fantasy RPGs and more!

Methods & Madness - my  D&D 5e / Old School / Game design blog.

Steven Mitchell

#84
July 27, 2022, 11:25:48 AM
Eric Diaz, that is hilarious!  Also amazing dedication.

DocJones

#85
July 27, 2022, 11:48:45 AM
I've looked at AD&D 1e, Basic Fantasy, and Labyrinth Lord for an answer to a question about certain monsters.
I think I used to rule this as a NO, but how do you rule this?

Can skeletons and zombies open doors? 
Other "mindless" monsters?

Jam The MF

#86
July 27, 2022, 12:53:54 PM
Will those little OSE hardbacks ever lay open at the table; without one having to keep a hand on the page constantly, to try to make it lay flat?

That issue seems to worsen with increased page count, especially on smaller sized books.
Let the Dice, Decide the Outcome.  Accept the Results.

rytrasmi

#87
July 27, 2022, 04:03:45 PM
Quote from: Eric Diaz on July 27, 2022, 10:34:12 AM
Even if this wasn't a typo, and cook/marsh deliberately put it there to mess with out heads, we've had this game for about 40 years...
Could be a copyright trap.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trap_street


The worms crawl in and the worms crawl out
The ones that crawl in are lean and thin
The ones that crawl out are fat and stout
Your eyes fall in and your teeth fall out
Your brains come tumbling down your snout
Be merry my friends
Be merry

weirdguy564

#88
July 27, 2022, 06:34:38 PM Last Edit: July 27, 2022, 08:02:50 PM by weirdguy564
See, I almost consider clones of Basic/Expert to be a distinct genre separated from White Box or Advanced 1E, and Advanced 2E.   

But I would still pick Basic Fantasy over OSE.  It's a set of rules that has the fixes I would want.  Things like classes and races split up, or ascending armor class only. 

So naturally I play neither of them and went with another OSR style game based on dice pools.  Dungeons and Delvers Dice Pool Edition. 
I'm glad for you if you like the top selling game of the genre.  Me, I like the road less travelled, and will be the player asking we try a game you've never heard of.

danskmacabre

#89
July 27, 2022, 07:34:06 PM
Quote from: jeff37923 on July 26, 2022, 09:38:15 PM
I would say that OSE, while good, is just the flavor of the season for OSR.

That's probably true. But it's convenient to have it all in one book (or a boxed set).
I can't really be bothered tracking down the original boxed Basic and Expert sets and the slight rules changes and optional rules are pretty good.

I recently got the Advanced OSE PDF and whilst still is a Basic DnD feel, has some optional rules that makes it feels bit more like ADnD, such as Optional rules for multiclassing, Race/Class combos etc. But I won't be using those rules.
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