Quote from: CarlD.;1036797I can see that ringing some alarm bells,yes. I've gotten to the same point but it was over other issues than racism. It would have be pretty egregious and/or making other players uncomfortable. I admit its a "know it when I see it" definition which isn't satisfactory for many.

Agreed on all accounts. Though I've had false alarm bells, too.

QuoteGot it, I was just comparing experiences.

OK.

QuoteWould you say that you encounter more tensions along these lines in fantasy/history/pesudo historical settings or modern/future settings?

Fantasy, but that's possibly a red herring. That is, much as I like historical, modern and future settings, the majority of my gaming has been in fantasy settings.
It was certainly easier to detect in a future setting. Which is to say, the gal who didn't like 80% of the NPCs in the setting because of their skin (races varying from mixed to all the non-white) was kinda easier to spot than the guy who considered his elves' policies about avoiding miscegenation as "the ideal of how the white race should behave".

Quote from: CRKrueger;1036842Hobbits are essentially the idealized pastoral, agricultural Englishmen, Elves and Dunedain are the legendary historical Englishmen who helped create England, nobles and royals.  Sauron and Saruman represent the forces of industry and war and orcs are the working class, slaves to the meatgrinder of progress.

Makes sense, indeed.
And explains why I actually like playing half-orcs:p!

Quote from: Mike the Mage;1036826I don't know about you folks, but I don't like being falsely accused of participating in an intrinsically racist hobby.

In fact, on reflection, I think I would like to tell everybody who makes such an defamatory accusation to fuck off, keep fucking off until they get to a wall saying "no fucking off beyond this point", then climb the wall and fuck off some more.

Lately, I've been tempted to agree with this approach:D!

Quote from: CRKrueger;1036840It's very, very odd for someone who holds their complete and total ignorance of the hobby at large outside of the 4 games they play as a point of pride to then turn around and claim that elements of the hobby they purposely remain ignorant of don't exist. :rolleyes:

It's even odder when the element they are claiming doesn't exist is linked to in the very first post.

I don't think I claimed an element didn't exist. And I'm not completely and totally ignorant of the hobby at large, at all, just because I don't know or care about certain game designers of the current edition of D&D or Made-Annoying-by-the-Apocalypse, both styles I know PLENTY about to know that I don't want to play them!

My confusion I think is mainly because of all the hyperbolic rants and use of political terms to mean very different things and ridiculous rambling off-topic arguments by people with diametrically opposed viewpoints and on and on.

The fact is that you're not really doing anything interesting if a busybody isn't whining and crying about how you're a bad person for doing it.

fearsomepirate is banned?

Quote from: Mike the Mage;1036826I don't know about you folks, but I don't like being falsely accused of participating in an intrinsically racist hobby.

In fact, on reflection, I think I would like to tell everybody who makes such an defamatory accusation to fuck off, keep fucking off until they get to a wall saying "no fucking off beyond this point", then climb the wall and fuck off some more.

Agreed.  I refuse to be bullied.

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1036917fearsomepirate is banned?

He kept posting in another thread after being told to stop. The whole thread turned into a huge mess that resulted in multiple bannings, but FP was given multiple warnings and either somehow missed them all or chose to ignore them. Ulairi came right out and demanded Pundit drop the ban hammer on his head, but with FP it was a little more weird. I don't know if he was just oblivious or stupid, but it seems unlikely he somehow missed all the warnings.

Quote from: Mike the Mage;1036826I don't know about you folks, but I don't like being falsely accused of participating in an intrinsically racist hobby.

I'm not concerned. In the 80s, we were all Satanists. Now we're all racists. So what?  

We won last time by mocking the enemy. These SJW fucks are way easier to mock and far more sensitive to it.

In reality, gaming's actual reputation is earned table by table in kitchens, living rooms and dens across the world.

Quote from: Kiero;1036410Agreed, The Expanse beats every sci-fi show to date.

I love it. But half way through season 2 and I still don't know what the hell is going on. It beats nuBSG out by miles.

Quote from: Brand55;1036925He kept posting in another thread after being told to stop. The whole thread turned into a huge mess that resulted in multiple bannings, but FP was given multiple warnings and either somehow missed them all or chose to ignore them. Ulairi came right out and demanded Pundit drop the ban hammer on his head, but with FP it was a little more weird. I don't know if he was just oblivious or stupid, but it seems unlikely he somehow missed all the warnings.

Multiple bannings on a site that proclaims that free speech is its watchword?  Must have been some thread.

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1036978Multiple bannings on a site that proclaims that free speech is its watchword?  Must have been some thread.

It got trashed. Not everybody that was off-topic was trashing it, but one or two were out to wreck it.

Check out the thread, its a firestorm. RPGPundit did not want the thread derailed and many of us were doing what we do, so Pundit told everyone to cut it out, stay on topic and dropped repeated warnings to specific people. For whatever reason, Pundy really wants RPG Industry Politics on the main page and he wants everyone to stick to the topic inside that thread.

To Pundy's credit, he made it clear than bannings for derailing the thread would happen "regardless if you were to the Left of Mao or the Right of Buchanan", so the bannings are clearly not politically motivated. Especially clear after he nuked Ulairi and FP. Voros threw down recently, even posting Bon Jovi's "Blaze of Glory" as his finale.

I don't agree with the bannings whatsoever, but I don't pay the rent here.

Quote from: Spinachcat;1036929I'm not concerned. In the 80s, we were all Satanists. Now we're all racists. So what?  

We won last time by mocking the enemy. These SJW fucks are way easier to mock and far more sensitive to it.

In reality, gaming's actual reputation is earned table by table in kitchens, living rooms and dens across the world.

While the SJWs miss the forest for the leaves, even a racist clock is right twice a day.

The D&D world is an incredibly warped and twisted one where it is socially acceptable to engage in mass murder simply because the targets are "evil." Not evil in the sense of real world morality, but aligned with evil as defined by the game and this is usually inherent to their bloodline. Most of these targets tend to be dressed in stereotypical tribal getup and are often led by "shamans" and "chieftains," because that style and that terminology is seen as a short hand for "barbarism." The only positive example I can recall off the top of my head is in the barbarian character class, and then only because it is available to PCs and the game assumes PCs are good.

Similar criticism could be level at a lot of mass media. Western cultures tend to glorify violence.

Why do we even need orcs? Why not kill humans? Or demons?

Quote from: Spinachcat;1036982Check out the thread, its a firestorm.

It's worth reading, if only to answer for oneself the question for yourself of whether Pundy should in fact start a TTRPG variant of gamergate (based on his ability to/not to keep his cool when facing opposition).

I don't agree with Pundy's behavior at all, but I said my piece and left.

Quote from: BoxCrayonTales;1037034The D&D world is an incredibly warped and twisted one where it is socially acceptable to engage in mass murder simply because the targets are "evil." Not evil in the sense of real world morality, but aligned with evil as defined by the game and this is usually inherent to their bloodline. Most of these targets tend to be dressed in stereotypical tribal getup and are often led by "shamans" and "chieftains," because that style and that terminology is seen as a short hand for "barbarism." The only positive example I can recall off the top of my head is in the barbarian character class, and then only because it is available to PCs and the game assumes PCs are good.

Yes. The entire thing is the creation of designated enemies (the entire point) and it breaks down under intense scrutiny. And people have been making the mistake of doing so for 40+ years.

QuoteWhy do we even need orcs? Why not kill humans? Or demons?

The reason we need orcs is so that our PCs aren't killing humans. Again, the point. As to demons, what does turning the orc into a demon do to improve the situation? Make them more clearly designated-evil?

Quote from: Willie the Duck;1037035The reason we need orcs is so that our PCs aren't killing humans. Again, the point. As to demons, what does turning the orc into a demon do to improve the situation? Make them more clearly designated-evil?

You can't really get more other/alien than beings that don't even come from the same plane of existence as we do.

Quote from: Kiero;1037043You can't really get more other/alien than beings that don't even come from the same plane of existence as we do.

Sure, but it just changes them from having a sign over their head saying 'designated villain,' into a sign over their head saying, "~~~***Designated Villain***~~~." It literally doesn't change the actual moral calculus, nor the ridiculousness of applying moral calculus to the situation.