The initial.post is why I no longer enjoy dnd, or many other systems. You have some systems that have devolved to being a number fest. Or some weird abstract word play, I have an average strength or some silliness. My husband has stories and he has been gaming since 79, and tells how because of the system, how gms and players had to cook the characters in dnd .

Welcome to the forums Sylvemoonkitten

I think the best way to go lighter on rules is to use a rules light system.

Quote from: Sacrosanct;684975

That is a fuckingly awesome suit of armor.

That is all.

Somewhat related to my original post, I'm also seeing A LOT more type of responses where there seems to be a very large faction of people who are hating the way Next is going because of lack of character options.  I see comments like:

"D&D doesn't inspire your imagination any more than Monopoly.  There has to be abilities and powers to do that (a "cool" or thematic action for the character to take)."

"Without access to powers and abilities to give the character choice, all you will ever do is hit with your sword every round because it does the most damage."

"Out of the box thinking, or use of imagination is always suboptimal compared to a clearly defined power or ability, and will never be used."

And so on and so on.  It's like the pictures I posted.  MMO DPS and power chained abilities are the most important thing in the game.  

Oh, and that picture is from Eric Lofgren, a mighty fine artist and a better man, for those who asked.

Quote from: Sacrosanct;687793Somewhat related to my original post, I'm also seeing A LOT more type of responses where there seems to be a very large faction of people who are hating the way Next is going because of lack of character options.  I see comments like:

"D&D doesn't inspire your imagination any more than Monopoly.  There has to be abilities and powers to do that (a "cool" or thematic action for the character to take)."

"Without access to powers and abilities to give the character choice, all you will ever do is hit with your sword every round because it does the most damage."

"Out of the box thinking, or use of imagination is always suboptimal compared to a clearly defined power or ability, and will never be used."

And so on and so on.  It's like the pictures I posted.  MMO DPS and power chained abilities are the most important thing in the game.  

So you agree that D&D Next shouldn't have any spellcasters then ;3

Quote from: gamerGoyf;687797So you agree that D&D Next shouldn't have any spellcasters then ;3

I'm not sure what you mean.  Spellcasting existing in a game doesn't mean that characters can't and won't do any other action outside of spamming the most powerful spell over and over.

Quote from: Sacrosanct;687799I'm not sure what you mean.  Spellcasting existing in a game doesn't mean that characters can't and won't do any other action outside of spamming the most powerful spell over and over.

Railing against "those damned kids on your lawn and their kewl powers" seems kind of silly when we're talking about a game where 50% of the classic party have actual magic powers ;3

Quote from: gamerGoyf;687801Railing against "those damned kids on your lawn and their kewl powers" seems kind of silly when we're talking about a game where 50% of the classic party have actual magic powers ;3

Only that's not what I'm doing.  I'm railing against those "damn players" who insist that without a ton of powers and abilities, there is no imagination or out of the box thinking that will be used.  Every player will pick their highest DPR attack and use it and only it every single time, over and over.

Quote from: Sacrosanct;687799I'm not sure what you mean.  Spellcasting existing in a game doesn't mean that characters can't and won't do any other action outside of spamming the most powerful spell over and over.

Not to your avarage new school player, sadly.

Just look at how many discussions included "low level casters are boring, you get one spell and then you can't contribute, you just have to sit around" and "high level casters cause a 15 miniute adventure day because once they run out of spells you have to stop playing"

Quote from: gamerGoyf;687801Railing against "those damned kids on your lawn and their kewl powers" seems kind of silly when we're talking about a game where 50% of the classic party have actual magic powers ;3

Looks like gamerGoyf is a LFQW mujahideen.

Both the char op dweebs and LFQW jihadists will probably find Next disappointing. Thankfully, those players don't appear to be all that common out in the real world. At least WotC doesn't think they're a big enough market to aim D&D at.

Quote from: Haffrung;687804Looks like gamerGoyf is a LFQW mujahideen.

Both the char op dweebs and LFQW jihadists will probably find Next disappointing. Thankfully, those players don't appear to be all that common out in the real world. At least WotC doesn't think they're a big enough market to aim D&D at.

U mad bro ;3

Quote from: Piestrio;687803Not to your avarage new school player, sadly.

Just look at how many discussions included "low level casters are boring, you get one spell and then you can't contribute, you just have to sit around" and "high level casters cause a 15 miniute adventure day because once they run out of spells you have to stop playing"

Reminds me of all those goobers whining about the shaken rules in Savage Worlds...

Quote from: Sacrosanct;687793Somewhat related to my original post, I'm also seeing A LOT more type of responses where there seems to be a very large faction of people who are hating the way Next is going because of lack of character options.  I see comments like:

"D&D doesn't inspire your imagination any more than Monopoly.  There has to be abilities and powers to do that (a "cool" or thematic action for the character to take)."

"Without access to powers and abilities to give the character choice, all you will ever do is hit with your sword every round because it does the most damage."

"Out of the box thinking, or use of imagination is always suboptimal compared to a clearly defined power or ability, and will never be used."

And so on and so on.  It's like the pictures I posted.  MMO DPS and power chained abilities are the most important thing in the game.  

Oh, and that picture is from Eric Lofgren, a mighty fine artist and a better man, for those who asked.

Since you used double-quotes, I presume that you're actually quoting what someone actually said, rather than making up words that you think are to the same effect?  Because I know a lot of people (like myself) that enjoy meaningful character options but I don't fit into any of those quotes.  So, maybe you could provide links to the original quotes?

Or if you're just making up interpretations of what you think you've read, perhaps you should say that, and if you're interested in why others don't share your enthusiasm for Next, you could always ask.

Quote from: Sacrosanct;687793Somewhat related to my original post, I'm also seeing A LOT more type of responses where there seems to be a very large faction of people who are hating the way Next is going because of lack of character options.  I see comments like:

"D&D doesn't inspire your imagination any more than Monopoly.  There has to be abilities and powers to do that (a "cool" or thematic action for the character to take)."

"Without access to powers and abilities to give the character choice, all you will ever do is hit with your sword every round because it does the most damage."

"Out of the box thinking, or use of imagination is always suboptimal compared to a clearly defined power or ability, and will never be used."

And so on and so on.  It's like the pictures I posted.  MMO DPS and power chained abilities are the most important thing in the game.  

You know, it's harder to rely on your imagination the further out from human/historical baseline you deviate.

For example, I happen to think angel wings on people are basically super rad. I will always consider playing a character like that if the system supports it and it doesn't clash with the scenario/setting. I don't even give much of a toss about what those wings actually DO, or cost for that matter. Just the fact that they're there is nice.

Now, this is not something you can just "use your imagination on". I mean yeah we could do a by the book AD&D and I could have wings on my character that are entirely for the show and don't actually do anything and that would be largely okay but basically just more work for everyone for the same thing and confusing to some.

Does it make sense to you? Or is it still about teh ememohs?

QuoteOh, and that picture is from Eric Lofgren, a mighty fine artist and a better man, for those who asked.

Good to know, I'll look him up.