Has anyone looked at mashing-up H&H and Traveller? I like the setting and sandbox toolkit in H&H much more than the default Traveller universe. However, having played a lot of D&D-like games lately, I thought it might be fresh to try a change in pace of game mechanics.

I worry that everyone would just die because Traveller combat is so brutal. Thoughts? Are the "Techniques" from Judge Dredd MT or the "Hero Points" from the Campaign Guide for MT worthwhile?

Quote from: amacris;651497Has anyone looked at mashing-up H&H and Traveller? I like the setting and sandbox toolkit in H&H much more than the default Traveller universe. However, having played a lot of D&D-like games lately, I thought it might be fresh to try a change in pace of game mechanics.

I worry that everyone would just die because Traveller combat is so brutal. Thoughts? Are the "Techniques" from Judge Dredd MT or the "Hero Points" from the Campaign Guide for MT worthwhile?

Um, have you considered possibly just playing Traveller in a universe that you create yourself? You don't have to use the default Official Traveller Universe.

See, Traveller already has several adventures set-up as dungeon crawls. Shadows, Annic Nova, Death Station, all come immediately to mind as adventures to try and see if Traveller is the preferred system for you to use.

For myself, I wouldn't try to do a mash-up, I like both games and while they are both SFRPGs, they are different enough in their execution that their playstyles are radically different when used. I'd just pick one and run with it.

I am looking forward to running H&H to see how it differs from a Traveller space dungeon in actual play. Certainly H&H has more "powers" than you would encounter in most Traveller campaigns and the character classes feel tighter niched in my reading than randomly rolled Traveller characters would generally be.

But the background in H&H could easily be replaced with Traveller's Imperium, or Warhammer 40k or Fading Suns, or any other vast empire that has some dark scary corners.

Traveller combat is brutal, but I did a mock combat with H&H and I might invoke the optional rule of starting HP equal to CON when I run the game. In my mock combat, 2 of 5 PCs got splattered.

I've considered using Traveller with extra transhuman options on top, to run an Alastair Reynolds-inspired game of transhuman xenoarcheologists dungeon-crawling their way through ancient alien astroengineering megastructures, and possibly capturing rare working alien tech and reverse-engineering it and getting rich and influential... well, you get the idea.

I love H&H and it's certainly better focused on "SF dungeoneering" than Traveller, and it'll definitely crank out a more D&D-like experience. But like Jeff remarks above, the idea has already been explored by a few classic Traveller modules (I should really check some of these, BTW).

Quote from: The Butcher;652105I've considered using Traveller with extra transhuman options on top, to run an Alastair Reynolds-inspired game of transhuman xenoarcheologists dungeon-crawling their way through ancient alien astroengineering megastructures, and possibly capturing rare working alien tech and reverse-engineering it and getting rich and influential... well, you get the idea.

I love H&H and it's certainly better focused on "SF dungeoneering" than Traveller, and it'll definitely crank out a more D&D-like experience. But like Jeff remarks above, the idea has already been explored by a few classic Traveller modules (I should really check some of these, BTW).

Are you trying for a "Diamond Dogs" kind of gameplay? I think that is what you are referencing when you talk about Alastair Reynolds style game of transhuman xenoarcheologists dungeon-crawling their way through ancient alien astroengineering megastructures, but I'm not sure.

See, you might want to look at the module Twilight's Peak for Classic Traveller instead.

I have run Traveller's Shadows and Annic Nova many times over the years, but they are mostly deck plans with some basic ideas and bare bones dressing.

I run Annic Nova like Event Horizon and the enemy in Shadows is much more the environment than the beasties. Both would be great for Hulks & Horrors too.

Quote from: Spinachcat;652129I have run Traveller's Shadows and Annic Nova many times over the years, but they are mostly deck plans with some basic ideas and bare bones dressing.

That is because it is up to the Referee to ensure that the adventures are interesting for the Players.

Quote from: Spinachcat;652129I run Annic Nova like Event Horizon and the enemy in Shadows is much more the environment than the beasties. Both would be great for Hulks & Horrors too.

See? Like that.

Quote from: jeff37923;652133That is because it is up to the Referee to ensure that the adventures are interesting for the Players.

I only half agree.

The "bare bones" approach of many of the early products did not help novice GMs become successful GMs. The DIY approach that is lauded by hardcore hobbyists isn't something that interests most people. It's why Pizza Hut does not deliver a bag of flour and a can of sauce.

Quote from: Spinachcat;652138I only half agree.

The "bare bones" approach of many of the early products did not help novice GMs become successful GMs. The DIY approach that is lauded by hardcore hobbyists isn't something that interests most people. It's why Pizza Hut does not deliver a bag of flour and a can of sauce.

If you do not have an imagination, than maybe you should find another hobby.

A "bare bones" or "just enough" approach to purchased products allows Referees to tailor their adventures to their Players for the enjoyment of all. This not only helped, but empowered Referees using those early products to create their own using the toolkit provided. Without this approach FASA, Judges Guild, and others would not have had the freedom to become producers in their own right.

Then as is now, there is an explosion of possibilities using Mongoose Traveller as a base. Of particular note is Zozer Games and their Orbital setting, which is absolutely fan-fucking-tastic.

When all you have is a bag of flour and a can of sauce, you can make a lot of different foods besides just pizza.

Quote from: jeff37923;651623Um, have you considered possibly just playing Traveller in a universe that you create yourself? You don't have to use the default Official Traveller Universe.

As I said in my original post, I like the universe presented in Hulks & Horrors.

QuoteSee, Traveller already has several adventures set-up as dungeon crawls. Shadows, Annic Nova, Death Station, all come immediately to mind as adventures to try and see if Traveller is the preferred system for you to use.

I have all of those adventures. I have the three LBBs, 2 copies of Starter Traveller, and most of the books for Mongoose Traveller, too. What I do *not* have is familiarity with the Judge Dredd/Strontium Dogs/cinematic style of Traveller play. So that's what I'm asking about.

QuoteFor myself, I wouldn't try to do a mash-up, I like both games and while they are both SFRPGs, they are different enough in their execution that their playstyles are radically different when used. I'd just pick one and run with it.

I am afraid you have left me confused. You began by saying that I could useTraveller to get the dungeoneering feel I want. Then you warned that their playstyles are so radically different that you wouldn't do a mashup. So is your conclusion that Traveller *can* do space dungeoneering, or that it *can't*?

Quote from: Spinachcat;651629I am looking forward to running H&H to see how it differs from a Traveller space dungeon in actual play. Certainly H&H has more "powers" than you would encounter in most Traveller campaigns and the character classes feel tighter niched in my reading than randomly rolled Traveller characters would generally be.

But the background in H&H could easily be replaced with Traveller's Imperium, or Warhammer 40k or Fading Suns, or any other vast empire that has some dark scary corners.

Yes, H&H could work with a lot of backgrounds. That said, I do like the default "Surveyor's Guild/Plague Horror" background a lot. It get's the job done without a lot of overhead.

I like the "powers" of H&H and the tight niche of the characters. What I dislike is (a) the limited equipment list, (b) the silliness factor in many of the items that are present; it works against the space-horror vibe the game otherwise has; (c) the fact I haven't been able to make any sense at all of the masses and sizes of the starships, or their costs. So those points made me want to see if there might be a way to apply Traveller in those areas and/or just use Traveller as the system as H&H as the toolkit.

Jeff, I know you love Traveller. But you are sabotaging your own love. Every time someone dares to criticise Traveller in any, no matter how trivial way, or compares Traveller to other SciFi game and considers using it above it, you charge with a full blown frontal assault, that destroys the thread.

I didn't want to say it, because you are in general a good poster, but you need to calm down about Traveller a bit.

Quote from: amacris;652215I am afraid you have left me confused. You began by saying that I could useTraveller to get the dungeoneering feel I want. Then you warned that their playstyles are so radically different that you wouldn't do a mashup. So is your conclusion that Traveller *can* do space dungeoneering, or that it *can't*?

Yes, Traveller can do space dungeoneering, but it will be very lethal.

Quote from: Rincewind1;652250Jeff, I know you love Traveller. But you are sabotaging your own love. Every time someone dares to criticise Traveller in any, no matter how trivial way, or compares Traveller to other SciFi game and considers using it above it, you charge with a full blown frontal assault, that destroys the thread.

I didn't want to say it, because you are in general a good poster, but you need to calm down about Traveller a bit.

I will take that under advisement.

Quote from: jeff37923;652270Yes, Traveller can do space dungeoneering, but it will be very lethal.

OK. Since you are the site's expert in Traveller, what is your opinion on ways to reduce the lethality of Traveller combat on PCs? Here are some of the ideas I've seen and/or am bandying about. I'm working from Mongoose Traveller as my baseline.

1) When you Dodge, you apply your Athletics as a DM to the attacker's die roll. (Like melee with parrying)
a) Same idea, but you apply your Gun Combat instead, on the assumption that the skill includes defensive tactics.
b) Same idea, but you apply some sort of Armor skill instead.
2) Use Judge Dredd/Strontium Dog Special Techniques
3) Use Advantages/Disadvantages from Chthonian Stars
4) Use Hero Points from Supplement 9: Campaign Guide
5) Other thoughts??