Quote from: HinterWeltIn industry fora they call this the "Gaming Club" model. It is what I based my stores on back in the day. Basically, the risks you run are becoming a hang out where:
1. Regulars run off new customers

2. A bunch of regulars who do not buy anything

3. A focal point for illegal or undesirable behavior (this is a danger for any bar, mall or place where people can "Hang-out").

It does work but requires a lot of work (beyond the already lot of wrk retailing requires).

Bill

How did the stores do? Did you run into 1 or 2 (3 I'm familiar with, oddly)? How did you handle that?

Did I just hijack this thread...sorry...

Quote from: HinterWeltTo be clear, I also do not understand this approach. My business ventures always have, as part of the BP, a level of profit. To be sure, you should do it because you like it but profit should be part of the BP. Honestly, it sounds more like a restaurant than a game store, which is fine.

And yet, as we both know, restaurants and game stores are dismal ways to try and make a profit.  If I was looking for real profit, I wouldn't even be considering either of those, given the fantastic odds that either of them will leave me bankrupt.  

In any endeavour, I really only want to to be able to make me enough money to live off of, so that I can continue doing sometihng I love.  

I'm just barely optimistic enough to dream for something like that, but pessimistic (or perhaps realistic) enough to know I shouldn't expect much more.

I'd love to suddenly become famous and wealthy and all that, just like anyone else would, but let's face it, it's about as likely in my fields of interest as me winning the lottery.  Possibly less.

Quote from: James J SkachHow did the stores do? Did you run into 1 or 2 (3 I'm familiar with, oddly)? How did you handle that?

Did I just hijack this thread...sorry...

I had two stores (LaSalle-Peru IL and Houghton MI). They grossed about 75k per year (1991-97) and I ended up selling them to separate owners. The one in Houghton is still going and the customer I sold the southern one to ran for about 2 years until it closed. I had a manager in the north who ran a number of games but was big into 40 K and magic.

Today, you should target more like 120K as your minimum for gross sales. Still, I found I was not a retailer at heart. I was too interested in fiddling with systems and putting books together.

Bill

Quote from: J ArcaneAnd yet, as we both know, restaurants and game stores are dismal ways to try and make a profit.  If I was looking for real profit, I wouldn't even be considering either of those, given the fantastic odds that either of them will leave me bankrupt.  

In any endeavour, I really only want to to be able to make me enough money to live off of, so that I can continue doing sometihng I love.  

I'm just barely optimistic enough to dream for something like that, but pessimistic (or perhaps realistic) enough to know I shouldn't expect much more.

I'd love to suddenly become famous and wealthy and all that, just like anyone else would, but let's face it, it's about as likely in my fields of interest as me winning the lottery.  Possibly less.

I am terribly sorry. We seem to have radically different definitions of profit. I am sorry for the misunderstanding. That said, I disagree with your assessment of game stores.

Bill

For years I nursed the fantasy of owning a Comic/Book/game store- then I worked in a SF book store for a few years. From very early on I was intimately involved in the finances and operation of the place, and I believe, depending on where you locate, you can make a good living. Location, though, is all- if you want to avoid reliance on regulars. IMO the ONLY place to put a store like this is across the street from / in the neighborhood of a university or college. This garuntees you a steady flow of new customers with time and money. As someone else said sell not just what you like, but what sells.
The two biggest obstacles I've seen in running a small place like this- and I've seen it over and over again, is the need for the owner to become a man of liesure. Owning a business doesn't mean you don't have to work, especially in the beginning. I was full time at the place I worked, and imo, I should not even have had a job- the owner should have been steering the counter, with maybe one part time assitant in the afternoons i was just an additional, unneccasry expence.
The second problem which often stems from the first is the customers. I am a nerd. Working at the Sf bookstore brought me in cantact with lawncrappers and catpissmen/women on an hourly basis. I was stalked by a female known as troll-girl for weeks on end. I had to bust friends for shop lifting. I had to referee arguements about Wolverine in order to keep them from becoming violent.
if you open such a busisness- you will learn to hate nerds. I can't even go into nerdspaces anymore without getting annoyed and disgusted.

Quote from: HinterWeltI am always surprised when people think
food/drink + paper products + computers = profit.

Especially the computer part.  Arcades are largely a thing of the past. Most people have PCs or console systems at home, so aren't jazzed by a chance to play in a store.  I've seen a few with the capability for lan parties but they appeared to be eeking by, not thriving.

Quote from: O'BorgOkay, assume there is a gaming population, but also assume you'd like to attract new customers into the hobby rather than tie yourself to a relatively fixed customer base.

Then expect salary to be a big expense. Because you've got to have people who are open, friendly, and knowledgeable and who have enough time to take new players under their wing and show 'em the ropes.

Seanchai

As a slight aside:

The most amusing downfall of any game store I've ever heard of was a local one in Knoxville, TN.

The owner stopped charging sales tax on items sold and got sloppy with records keeping...

That'll kill a store real quick.

Quote from: NicephorusEspecially the computer part.  Arcades are largely a thing of the past. Most people have PCs or console systems at home, so aren't jazzed by a chance to play in a store.  I've seen a few with the capability for lan parties but they appeared to be eeking by, not thriving.

I worked for a game center that rented out time on console systems.

We did quite fine actually, primarily with the Xboxes, because of the support for LAN play.  We had a fairly thriving base of regulars who came in almost every night of the week, and the concessions sold quite rapidly.  

The only reason the business closed was because of a dispute with the adjoined building over a fire door that the marshals insisted we had to have installed.

Quote from: HinterWeltI had two stores (LaSalle-Peru IL and Houghton MI). They grossed about 75k per year (1991-97) and I ended up selling them to separate owners. The one in Houghton is still going and the customer I sold the southern one to ran for about 2 years until it closed. I had a manager in the north who ran a number of games but was big into 40 K and magic.

Today, you should target more like 120K as your minimum for gross sales. Still, I found I was not a retailer at heart. I was too interested in fiddling with systems and putting books together.

Bill

Wow I really surprised a store like that could even survive at all in the UP.

Quote from: RoninWow I really surprised a store like that could even survive at all in the UP.

Actually, it did quite well. It was located in Houghton with two colleges. We were very seasonal. We made the money for the year between Sept-May. Two very different towns and two very different rythyms. The IL store had steady sales throughout the year with spikes at tax time and Christmas. The MI store had big sales when students were there.

It just takes planning.

Bill

having watched one our newer stores here sprout up and do well, very well, here's what I think:

#1- you have to be very willing to demo games.

#2- Sell what sells, not what you like to play (unless of course they are one in the same)

#3- Promote the store as a gaming club, focus on getting people to play. Once they get playing they will buy.

#4- Don't have "store copies" of games for general use by the public. For Demo purposes, yes. For free loaders, No.

#5- have a good amount of clean playing space and regulate conduct of the gamers in your store.

#6- Have snacks and/or sandwiches for sale. May not be a big money maker, but my FLGS sells a fridge full of them a week, plus drinks and candy.

#7-Keep tight records of your inventory and remember that in most cases it is better to under order something overstock something.

#8- Boardgames & Minis are the way to go these days. These two should make up most of your stock. CCGs, RPGs, and other games are just gravy on top if you make money on them.

#9- Be prepared to make business decisions that may not be popular with a few of your regulars. To many times store owners make decisions based more on what a few regulars think than what actually makes sense.

#10- Be willing to order anything. If you don't have any interest in carrying chess sets and someone comes in asking about a really nice set don't tell them "sorry we don't carry that", pull out the catalog and say we can special order it for you.

The chain that my store is part of made the decision ..years ago to locate all their stores in Malls.
 I think they did this for several reasons:
 1) trying to appeal to familie, parents. One third of our floor space is devoted to raditional games like SCRABBLE, Monopoly, CHESS, RISK, Bridge & Poker Supplies and cards.

2) Weather - if we're inside a mall  nthen people aren't walking through our front door straight from a dranching storm if its raining. (Or a bad snow fall)

3) Security - The Mall has its own security force, and the local police (Coubty and Township) also do patrols in the mall and the parking lot. People feel its a safe area.

4)  Other stores in the mall send customers to us. I don't think the owners planned this one  - but it does happen. We've had KAY-BEE TOY & HOBBY   sending customers to us who were looking for D&D or Magic:The Gathering as well as APPLES to APPLES.

- Ed C.

Quote from: HinterWeltActually, it did quite well. It was located in Houghton with two colleges. We were very seasonal. We made the money for the year between Sept-May. Two very different towns and two very different rythyms. The IL store had steady sales throughout the year with spikes at tax time and Christmas. The MI store had big sales when students were there.

It just takes planning.

Bill

Oh' man I forgot about the colleges. Course its been a long time since I've been to the Keweenaw pennisula.

Reminds me of the Gameboard chain in TN, Koltar.  I actually liked them a lot in part because they were in a mall.  Fewer nasty regulars, cleaner environment, etc.