I have colored pencils. I have plenty of paper. What I don't have is a clue on how to start. Thinking that I'm not alone, I'm starting this thread so folks can give us their methods, useful links and so on.

I start with a few rough sketches-they can vary in size and detail, but think about major landmarks, places that you really want on your map, and then sketch them out.

As you sketch you can add details, and refine things as you go. I'll add more to this later.

My drawing skills suck so bad (this is one real-life fantasy I've always had, to really be able to draw) but I have decent knowledge of geography and construction.  Once I have a very general overview of what kind of map I'm working on, I start with geographic features and think things through logically.  So say I want mountains, I'll put in mountains and from there I can then find alpine lakes and the rivers that flow down to branch off into tributaries, other lakes and eventually the ocean.  These follow the general trend to lower altitude that the location of the mountains have already set.  

Then I start thinking about where civilizations would settle and why.  What resources, transportation, defense factors would make a people start building in a place?  Asking those questions often helps define the shape and nature of a city or settlement and fills in lots of interesting details.  Where would farms then be, manufacturing, roads, etc.?

I follow this same approach with dungeons and indoor maps.  Why is this thing where it is?  How was it built, what tools and materials were needed?   How did it's construction impact the environment around it and how does the environment impact the structure?

I find that once I have a basic hook like those mentioned above to get started, the rest of the map flows from there quite easily.

I hope that's what you meant when you were asking for hints.

Hells yeah, this is good stuff. I gotta say walker, that it can be nice to think of maps in a geographic way. A little verity in maps is one of those things that is usually too small to be noticed, but in the end always appreciated.

For any map:

Unless there's magic involved, water goes downhill and rivers do not empty into two different seas. You'd be surprised how often I see that!

For realistic mapping:

Rivers have watersheds defined by high ground in between.

Lakes have outflows at the lowest point.

The flatter the land, the more a river will wind, sometimes tripling it's straight line distance over its course.

Major cities should be located at intersections of trade lines - sea ports, heads of river navigation, oases, and the like.

It takes a huge amount of farm land to support a large city, and the further back in time you go, the larger that farmland has to be.

Low, flat coasts tend to have beaches with marshes behind them, and often long, straightish, flat barrier islands off shore. The sea tends to be shallow near the coast. Ports are often in estuaries.

High, rocky coasts are usually far more fractal than flat coasts, with deeply embayed shorelines. Maine's coast, for example, is so embayed that it's longer than the Atlantic coast of the US between itself and Florida. Ports are usually in harbors.

Desert are usually found to the leeward (direction the prevailing wind blows towards) of high North-South mountains. If not desert, the land is usually at least arid. This is called a Wind Shadow.

Borders between states are usually natural - the crest of a mountain range, the course of a river, desert lands, etc. Straight line borders are usually only separators used for denoting island ownership.

Abstract and hex maps:

Use intuitive symbols.

The purpose of Abstract and hex maps is to show relationships. Where is this town relative to that mountain. Ancient maps were often abstract

-clash

I often say that geography determines who lives where, how and why. Civilization sprung up around fertile river lands, and expanded as man increased his tool usage and knowledge.

So when I set up a Campaign World I start with where civilizations started and expand. Natural routes help further expansion-rivers, plains, flatlands, etc...all of these natural terrain features help progress.

Mountains, and other rough terrain features tend to channel development, and only see wide spread development if something of value is to be found there. (Mineral deposits, space in a highly settled world.)

Think about how goods travel-over land, over water, through the air. This will help you figure out how things develop.

After some rough sketches I start refining the game world, and nailing down the map. I like to start looking at cultural development-and start planning what goes where.

Quote from: JamesVI have colored pencils. I have plenty of paper. What I don't have is a clue on how to start. Thinking that I'm not alone, I'm starting this thread so folks can give us their methods, useful links and so on.

Author Holly Lisle wrote up what she does here:

http://www.hollylisle.com/fm/Workshops/maps-workshop.html

Quote from: flyingmiceFor realistic mapping:
[...some great advice...]

You can find some detailed information on climatology here:

http://www.atmos.washington.edu/1998Q4/211/topics.htm

http://www.sci.ccny.cuny.edu/~stan/e31_clim.pdf

Anyone who would like to learn to draw, or draw better, should pick up this book:  



I was skeptical at first, but I gave it a chance and it really made a noticeable difference.  Definitely worth your time, but you need to take it seriously and do the exercises in order.

Quote from: flyingmiceFor any map:

Unless there's magic involved, water goes downhill and rivers do not empty into two different seas. You'd be surprised how often I see that!

Man, that just burns me. I understood the basic concept of water flowing downhill by the time I was about 9. It's shocking how many RPG maps were drawn by people utterly obvlivious to the most basic tenets of geography - even settings that are supposed to be lovingly crafted. I'm looking at you, Talislanta! And you Earthdawn! Rivers starting a few miles away from the coast and flowing in the opposite direction across mountain ranges, swamps, and hills, then splitting and flowing into two different seas. Madness! I pretty much have to redraw any map that's this moronic just so I don't have a fit every time I look at it. I dunno, it seems like a lot of RPG designers are simply map-illiterate.

Quote from: StuartAnyone who would like to learn to draw, or draw better, should pick up this book:  
I was skeptical at first, but I gave it a chance and it really made a noticeable difference.  Definitely worth your time, but you need to take it seriously and do the exercises in order.

Very cool.  Thanks for the recommendation. I've heard from artists that it is a skill  that you can train and improve yourself with practice, like sports or whatever.  I just need to find the time and discipline.  One more thing to put into TPW (Theoretical Project World).

Quote from: flyingmiceThe flatter the land, the more a river will wind, sometimes tripling it's straight line distance over its course.

It takes a huge amount of farm land to support a large city, and the further back in time you go, the larger that farmland has to be.

Two things I had not known.  Very cool. Thanks.

Aw...crap-crap-crap.  A few years back we did a thread just like this on RPG.net in the "Art of Game Design" forum.  I told myself I'd keep that link bookmarked, but I can't find it.  It's a gold mine if anyone else can dig it up.

!i!

Quote from: walkerpTwo things I had not known.  Very cool. Thanks.

Assume that for pre-modern societies, at least 80% (and, more often, closer to 90% or 95%) of the population is going to be involved in the production of food and such and that only 20% and often closer to 10% to 5% of the population will be able to be dedicated craftsmen, artists, clergy, dedicated warriors, rulers, and so on.  

A game that goes back to Apple ][ and TRS-80 days can be found online here:

http://www.santaparavia.com/Home.aspx

...provides an interesting simulation of the variables involved.

Also the game that one was based on:

http://www.hammurabigame.com/hammurabi-game.php

Quote from: flyingmiceUnless there's magic involved, water goes downhill and rivers do not empty into two different seas. You'd be surprised how often I see that!

Streams of water can, however, do some funny things, like anastomosing, where the stream branches or forks into two different channels, which may in turn feed into two different bodies of water.  The point at which the channel anastomoses has to be pretty darned flat, though (see next point).

QuoteThe flatter the land, the more a river will wind, sometimes tripling it's straight line distance over its course.

An important thing to remeber about water: Water does not want to get from Point A to Point B by the most direct means possible, it wants to lose energy as fast as possible.  On a steep slope, the quickest means of losing energy is to drop until it runs into something hard, and only then will it turn to go around it.  On a flat expanse, the quickest means of losing energy is to spread out, either by meandering or (in really flat land) braiding.

QuoteRivers have watersheds defined by high ground in between.

To clarify, watersheds are defined by surrounding ridgelines, and rivers (sometimes a number of them) are contained within watersheds.  No matter what the Exalted map of Creation suggests, water does not cross ridgelines from one watershed to another (though separate watersheds can and do merge).

!i!