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How Light Is Rules Light?

Started by Ashakyre, March 15, 2017, 01:32:01 PM

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jan paparazzi

#75
April 02, 2017, 08:02:43 PM
So Barbarians of Lemuria would be rules-light and basic roleplaying rules lite?
May I say that? Yes, I may say that!

AsenRG

#76
April 03, 2017, 02:05:11 AM Last Edit: April 03, 2017, 02:07:58 AM by AsenRG
Quote from: jan paparazzi;955102So Barbarians of Lemuria would be rules-light and basic roleplaying rules lite?

Probably yes, though it's more about a feeling, so I'd probably classify basic roleplaying as medium.

Remember, those aren't meant to be absolute categories, just stuff I reference for clarity when discussing RPGs with friends. You could replace "ruleslite" with "the intermediary stage between light and medium", and nothing would change, for example.
What Do You Do In Tekumel? See examples!
"Life is not fair. If the campaign setting is somewhat like life then the setting also is sometimes not fair." - Bren

Dirk Remmecke

#77
April 03, 2017, 02:20:18 AM
Quote from: Ashakyre;954854D&D is the the most played game right now and also historically, as far as I can tell. Good enough.

So "rules light" would mean something different in the 80s, 90s, 00s, and today?

80s/90s Basic with AD&D's race+class, more classes, more spells, and none of the AD&Disms (weapon vs. armor, segments, ...)
00s 3e/PF with loads of feats and class-dipping and AoO fests
10s 5e with moderate feats in one corner, and 0e/BX clones in the other? (And PF still strong?)
Swords & Wizardry & Manga ... oh my.
(Beware. This is a Kickstarter link.)

Ashakyre

#78
April 03, 2017, 12:22:50 PM
Quote from: Dirk Remmecke;955148So "rules light" would mean something different in the 80s, 90s, 00s, and today?

80s/90s Basic with AD&D's race+class, more classes, more spells, and none of the AD&Disms (weapon vs. armor, segments, ...)
00s 3e/PF with loads of feats and class-dipping and AoO fests
10s 5e with moderate feats in one corner, and 0e/BX clones in the other? (And PF still strong?)

Words change, especially ones used to categorize products. The best you can do is a useful approximation that serves your purposes.

It's a pointless conversation because a sufficiently spergy person can always play word games to to deconstruct meaning.

This is why I keep saying heuristics, not definitions. But linear thinkers have a hard time with that.

I only said that you quoted above because Justin's a bit of a pendant, and a charitable interpretation of Pundy's remarks is close enough to a functional word.

Man, "close enough" is really hard for some people.

Madprofessor

#79
April 03, 2017, 09:31:15 PM
Quote from: AsenRG;955051Sure:).
And I just define them by the amount of rules and the rules interactions, but admittedly, you can often argue for placing stuff in the next or previous category.

Rules-ultralight: Risus, Wushu, and various 1-page, 2-page and 3-page rulesets.
Rules-light: FU RPG, rulesets around 20 pages (including many quickstarts).
Ruleslite: Anything from GURPS Lite, through Flashing Blades, to OD&D, Original Traveller and Fate Core.
Medium: Savage Worlds, Mongoose Traveller, various OSR games, Mythras, Bethorm.
Rules-heavy: GURPS with only GURPS: Martial Arts and maybe one other book (or similar), The Riddle of Steel, Earthdawn 2e (the only one I've read;)).
Rules-extraheavy: Pathfinder, 3.5 with supplements, Legends of the Wulin, GURPS with all the supplements, and Phoenix Command:D!

That's a pretty fair evaluation. I like it.

Krimson

#80
April 03, 2017, 11:17:08 PM
While WEG d6 isn't really rules heavy I wouldn't exactly call it rules light either. However, the variant Mini Six is definitely rules light. I would also include Fate Accelerated, mostly for book size reference. If you start getting beyond 20 pages you might as well just write the rest of the game. Though I've played games like Risus or Window, I think those are a little too lite for me.
"Anyways, I for one never felt like it had a worse \'yiff factor\' than any other system." -- RPGPundit

Spinachcat

#81
April 03, 2017, 11:55:49 PM
What's the difference between WEG D6 and Mini-Six?

Krimson

#82
April 04, 2017, 12:22:58 AM
Quote from: Spinachcat;955277What's the difference between WEG D6 and Mini-Six?

Size for the most part. If you see it in print it's probably worth picking up but i wouldn't pay for the PDF considering Open6 and d6 Star Wars ReUp are available for free.
"Anyways, I for one never felt like it had a worse \'yiff factor\' than any other system." -- RPGPundit

Anon Adderlan

#83
April 04, 2017, 09:40:15 AM
Quote from: Ashakyre;955180Words change, especially ones used to categorize products. The best you can do is a useful approximation that serves your purposes.

No shit.

But what are your purposes, and how does labeling your game 'rules medium' help you achieve them? Because unless you can answer that, this is all semantic masturbation.

Ashakyre

#84
April 04, 2017, 10:34:34 AM
I already answered your question.

Ashakyre

#85
April 04, 2017, 10:35:47 AM
Quote from: Anon Adderlan;955333No shit.

But what are your purposes, and how does labeling your game 'rules medium' help you achieve them? Because unless you can answer that, this is all semantic masturbation.

I already answered your question.

AsenRG

#86
April 06, 2017, 03:50:23 PM
Quote from: Madprofessor;955267That's a pretty fair evaluation. I like it.

Thank you:).
What Do You Do In Tekumel? See examples!
"Life is not fair. If the campaign setting is somewhat like life then the setting also is sometimes not fair." - Bren

tenbones

#87
April 07, 2017, 11:46:54 AM
Quote from: AsenRG;955051Sure:).
And I just define them by the amount of rules and the rules interactions, but admittedly, you can often argue for placing stuff in the next or previous category.

Rules-ultralight: Risus, Wushu, and various 1-page, 2-page and 3-page rulesets.
Rules-light: FU RPG, rulesets around 20 pages (including many quickstarts).
Ruleslite: Anything from GURPS Lite, through Flashing Blades, to OD&D, Original Traveller and Fate Core.
Medium: Savage Worlds, Mongoose Traveller, various OSR games, Mythras, Bethorm.
Rules-heavy: GURPS with only GURPS: Martial Arts and maybe one other book (or similar), The Riddle of Steel, Earthdawn 2e (the only one I've read;)).
Rules-extraheavy: Pathfinder, 3.5 with supplements, Legends of the Wulin, GURPS with all the supplements, and Phoenix Command:D!

System-Mechanics Crunch Taxonomy. Hot.

AsenRG

#88
April 07, 2017, 12:21:48 PM
Quote from: tenbones;955943System-Mechanics Crunch Taxonomy. Hot.

I tend to use "hot" for number-related stuff only when said stuff contains the numbers 90-60-90, in order:p.
Hot taxonomy, however, seldom has those qualities. At best, it merits to be called "useful", IMO;).
What Do You Do In Tekumel? See examples!
"Life is not fair. If the campaign setting is somewhat like life then the setting also is sometimes not fair." - Bren

tenbones

#89
April 07, 2017, 01:04:51 PM
Quote from: AsenRG;955949I tend to use "hot" for number-related stuff only when said stuff contains the numbers 90-60-90, in order:p.
Hot taxonomy, however, seldom has those qualities. At best, it merits to be called "useful", IMO;).

Apparently I've cruised into the dorkier end of the game mechanics pool and stayed a little too long.
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