Indeed, once you accept that what Hasbro/WotC has always wanted is what they tried to set up with 4E... then it's easy to see they think they've lulled enough people back to the fold that they can try again for their closed licensed online portal/VTT that forces all their competitors to pay them for access.

It's probably going to go even worse for WotC this time because we've already seen how to address a crap replacement for the OGL and this time everyone knows that when WotC pulls back and says "we learned our lesson" that they're just biding their time to try their money grab again.

Quote from: Eirikrautha on December 25, 2022, 07:36:54 PM
What we are discussing is, with the push to integrate the game within the VTT, the history and experience of the newest corporate hires at WotC, the drop in Hasbro stock, whether the new direction of OneD&D will create a situation where players will need to pay for features that were previously free.  This is especially true if physical books and tools will be de-emphasized (or even restricted) as D&D moves more digital.

Now, I know what your (and junior-shills like Mistwell) immediate response will be: "Well, all of that is speculation; WotC hasn't announced what all this will look like yet."  Which is, in fact, irrelevant.  See, fools (feel free to claim membership if you so desire) are reactive, not proactive.  In every walk of life (business, relationships, war, finance, etc.) those who succeed are those who look ahead, plan for multiple possibilities, try to figure out where things are going rather than where things are at this moment.  I'm pretty sure the people at Kobold Press, the makers of Solasta, the others who plan to make products tangential to D&D, all are preparing for the worst, while hoping for the best.  Only the drooling fool bumbles along without assessing what the worst that can happen might be, and trying to mitigate the effects should the worst come to pass.

How much planning is needed? If they come out with a new edition that sucks, I won't buy it and I'll play something else instead. There are lots of options, and I've done the same previously. I never really bought into 2E from TSR, or 3.5E or 4E from WotC. (I did buy the historical campaign sourcebooks for 2E though I never played 2E. I played a handful of sessions of 4E because my nephew was running it, but those were my only play.)

Quote from: Eirikrautha on December 25, 2022, 07:36:54 PM
So, why don't you address the actual topic?  Do you support the possibility that integration with a VTT will create an ecosystem where previously free or easily integrated material will now come with a monetary cost?

That's an undefined hypothetical. Whether I play a new edition or new RPG will depend on whether I find it fun and worthwhile for the overall cost, compared to my other options. Whether it's in big up-front costs, subscription, or micropayments will change how the cost is calculated, but what matters is overall value to cost.

How good is it, and how much does it cost? Those are the question I would consider.

If it is the worst game ever and costs hundreds of dollars for expected play, then I won't play it. If it's cheap and fun, then maybe I will play it and pay a few bucks in micropayments for bits that I like.

Quote from: FingerRod on December 25, 2022, 02:35:01 PM
If you have the paid D&D Beyond subscription for DMs ($6 I think), you can share content with 50+ people digitally at no charge for them.

I will always prefer in-person gaming and the sharing of books.

Which is why wotc is near certainly aiming for their own platforn and removing the ability to share the books with the players. Everyone will have to buy everything if they want to use the platform.

Otherwise this whole "lets monetize the players" gag is a farce more than it already is.

Take note that of the three MMOs cryptic runs off the CO engine. Neverwinter is the only one that a player can not just buy a lifetime subscription and has to fork out upwards of 50$ every few months.

Quote from: jhkim on December 26, 2022, 02:31:56 AMIf they come out with a new edition that sucks, I won't buy it and I'll play something else instead.

Behind your walls of sophistry, you are far too aligned with the ideology of Nu-WOTC not to play it. If you have to stab the parts of your brain that hate it, out will come the ice-pick. You're the "this is fine" melting dog.

Quote from: Grognard GM on December 26, 2022, 09:40:11 AM

Quote from: jhkim on December 26, 2022, 02:31:56 AMIf they come out with a new edition that sucks, I won't buy it and I'll play something else instead.

Behind your walls of sophistry, you are far too aligned with the ideology of Nu-WOTC not to play it. If you have to stab the parts of your brain that hate it, out will come the ice-pick. You're the "this is fine" melting dog.

I don't think we know each other. Do you also not believe me about my play history? I've documented most of my play over the past 35 years or so. (ref)  I play some D&D, but it's never been the majority of my play.

As far as "this is fine" dog meme - you're implying that somehow everything is on fire within RPGs.  They're games we play for fun, and currently there are lots of choices across a wide variety of tastes. There are dozens of OSR publishers putting out loads of content, as well as lots of D&D choices. Other games are doing OK as well, though they are getting eclipsed.

As far as I'm concerned, the ideology of WotC is "make money". I'm fine with that if they make games that I enjoy, but they have a spotty history of that.

Quote from: Grognard GM on December 26, 2022, 09:40:11 AM

Quote from: jhkim on December 26, 2022, 02:31:56 AMIf they come out with a new edition that sucks, I won't buy it and I'll play something else instead.

Behind your walls of sophistry, you are far too aligned with the ideology of Nu-WOTC not to play it. If you have to stab the parts of your brain that hate it, out will come the ice-pick. You're the "this is fine" melting dog.

Greetings!

*Laughing* "This is fine!" Melting Dog! So funny, and true, as well.

You've noticed the techniques and "Walls of sophistry" that is employed? You have his allegiance and techniques down perfectly.

It's funny how with some people, no matter what the topic, angle, or criticism, they always somehow take the position of defending and gaslighting in favour of WOTC.

This kind of dynamic is so consistent over time here with several members, I always know who is going to be white knightting for WOTC.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK