Quote from: jeff37923;1046683Against players who tell me they want to play Kender, Malkavians, Gungans, or Ewoks? You bet your fuckin' ass.

I'd probably have a schizoid embolism if someone asked if they could play a Gungan or ecock. Thank frag I'm playing with some sane people.

Quote from: The Exploited.;1046702or ecock.

ecocks are the wurst.

I don't have that much I hate about most traditional D&D PC races. I dislike the takes on them in different settings. Im cool with the default coices of default AD&D Greyhawk and happily add even more choices from stuff like Planescape. If I would change anything in the basic setup of PC races I would make elves a bit more feylike and consider mergeing dwarves and gnomes into one but still kall them gnomes.

 I am even cool with kender if the DM enforces that the player himself does not have any real agency att all (suggestions may or may not be accepted by DM) on what they decide to "borrow" from anyone. Just a passive racial quirk in which the player can open his lootbag and check what he's character "borrowed today" and probably not know himself.

I don't really care for Wildens, Warforged and Dragonborn. Just kind of boring and  I don't see the need to shoehorn them into settings they never used to be a part of.

Quote from: jeff37923;1046656I don't have a problem with ejecting a disruptive player. Those races I mentioned, are usually early indications that the player intends to be disruptive.

I'm more interested in the character concept as a whole rather than the races they choose. I myself have used the aforementioned not liked Tieflings and Gungans and NPCs. The former has appeared several times as the owner of an Inn of various names because I keep forgetting what I call it, who hires adventurers to clear out the Ice Penguins and fits them with gear, feeds them and gives them a place to stay until they are ready to venture forth because Sigil is my default starting point in D&D. Ice Penguins because she has a portal to the paraelemental plane of Ice, which means she has the coldest beer in the Cage. The Gungan was an engineer who was at first despised. I even used the accent to speak for him, but unlike Jar Jar (who actually redeemed himself in Clone Wars), this one was competant. Loathing turned to love when he upgraded the obligatory Corellian Stock Light Frieghter's Sheild to something that could withstand hits from a Star Destroyer.

I once had a player play a Kender from Krynn who yes, stole things from everyone, including players. However, said Kender also handed stuff out when needed, claiming that they were just keeping the stuff safe. In other words, they played the Kender properly, having no concept of ownership of property and being genuinely helpful.

As for the aforementioned relocation of game, and physical ejection of a player. Those were two incidents that happened in my 33 years of roleplaying. I think that is a pretty good track record. I really really don't like barring the use of races that are in the rules, even if I personally don't like them. I do not want to be Captain Buzzkill. I have players who want certain adventures to happen, or certain gear, and I give them the chance to get it. But I do it in the context of giving everyone else a chance to take part and reap the rewards as well. Lethality is low in my games, but this not because of hand holding, but more that I remind players that fleeing is always an option. Well, except when it isn't but they usually have some sort of warning that they are entering a place where you succeed or die. If despite my warnings, players decide to charge off headlong into stupidity, then they get to find out what happens when they charge headlong into stupidity.

Mostly my games are about having fun. If I have a group of murderhobos, then we are going to murderhobo. If I have a group of roleplayers, they we are going to roleplay. I don't care. I don't run scripted adventures. I just make NPCs and locations, and figure out what's going on as I go along, and if players surprise me, no one is more pleased than myself. I always try and make sure everyone has something to do that is relevant and useful.

Quote from: Spinachcat;1046703ecocks are the wurst.

I know man... The should be downright illegal!:cool:

Quote from: The Exploited.;1046718I know man... The should be downright illegal!:cool:

They are in some states.

It's funny, while I almost always play humans/near-humans (main one currently a quarter-elf as we're playing the kids of the previous generation and the previous PC hooked up with a half-elf), I tend to run and create settings with a lot more unique options.

All the "normal" races in my setting have a twist (the dwarves are all arcane cyborgs because an ancient curse causes parts of their bodies to wear out at a different rate, the elves are literally fallen angels, gnomes are the embodied dreams of children who live like Peter Pan and the Lost Boys, and humans include all the half-races).

Then more unusual stuff (giants, dragons, sprites, elemental beasts, Minotaurs, centaurs, bat-like goblins, sapient golems, demon-tainted humans and hideous mutants that include orcs, ogres, trolls, troglodytes and cyclops in the current setting) is available on top of that.

The thing I absolutely cannot stand with races is when they don't even try to explain how multiple wildly different sapient (and generally warlike) species evolved on the same world and haven't wiped each other out. My settings always answer these in one way or another; ex. generally only the humans evolved naturally and everything else was either created with magic (the beastmen and golems were slave races created by past empires; mutants were created by a magical cataclysm two centuries ago) or come from another realm of existence (elves, gnomes, elemental beings like giants and dragons) or are men who were altered by contact with otherworldly entities (dwarves were forged from men by the demons who once rules; malfeans are the descendants of the half-demon overseers of that same Demon Empire who's demonic blood always breeds true).

I've been fortunate that the groups I typically run for tend to go more thematic when it comes to group structure and build for it. One of the things that makes backgrounds work in my games are we sit down and hash them out before the game begins so everyone has a reason to be part of the group... the aforementioned "heirs of past heroes" was one such theme; in another it was decided they'd all be members of a human criminal gang working out of the human ghetto in a kitchen sink fantasy metropolis ruled by elves. My main requirement as a GM is that all the PCs have to know each other and have a reason to adventure together before the first session starts so I don't have to do anything contrived like "you meet in a bar."

 Other than that, I don't care what starting scenario they all agree to; I can challenge a bunch of young nobles (even a king and his court) as easily as I can the blacksmith's son and innkeeper's daughter.

The point though is they typically use "one rare teammate" approach when it comes to theme building where most play a common species (human, occasionally an elf or dwarf) and one makes a fish out of water (a dragon, a unicorn, a tiefling or just someone from a distant land with different customs) to add contrast. This occasionally happens in reverse too where everyone decides to run some type of unusual species (ex. a group of dragons who hatched from the same clutch) and one more mundane figure (ex. a human who saved and befriend one of the hatchlings).

Quote from: Ratman_tf;1046243I have no problem with the Freak Factory idea of lots of races in a game. My old 80's campaign was full of wierdo race characters, long before there were Dragonborn and Tieflings.


One race that does rub me the wrong way is the Kender. For one specific reason. They have the racial advantage of being immune to fear, but Death Knights override that because the setting's darling, Lord Soth should be scary to everyone.
*rolleyes*

Generally, I agree with Omega. It's how the character is played.

Kender are not totally immune to fear. just immune to most conventional spell and aura type fear. In the books they have been effected by powerful auras from things like demon princes and gods. Though unfortunately one book noted that a kender would likely shake off the fear from a demon prince and start pestering them with questions...

Thats not so much the problem as their obsessive kelptomania which is supposed to come across as cute and innocent but more oft comes across as just damn annoying. Same with the tinker gnomes obsession with complexity. The thing most forget because its so often swept under the rug is that both races are the result of a super curse. Its not a personality quirk. Its literally curse hardwired into them.

Excuse me, I have a question:  Why do people assume that all Kender are uniform, that every single player HAS to play the race the EXACT same way?  I thought PC's were special by the virtue that they are adventurers, meaning they step out of the social norm.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;1046297I don't hate any race, I'm with Omega, it's not the race, it's how it's played.

But I do have issues, more confusion, about two races as typically portrayed in Dungeons and Dragons and that is the Gnome and Halfling.  They're often too much alike, with only a couple of superficial differences.  In fact, Gnomes seem to be a mashup of Dwarves and Halflings.  They have the Dwarven sense of crafting and live in Hobbit like burrows.

Personally, and I'm going to get burned at the stake for this, but I actually like what 4e tried to do with Halflings by making them into River Gypsies, it was inventive and different enough to give them a new identity that wasn't/isn't still leashed to Tokien.

Gnomes are based on legends. Effectively magic hill dwarves in D&D. There was also a popular book series about gnomes way back. But that came out in 76 and may have influenced the AD&D gnomes? Also they seem at least partially patterned on Leprechauns. In BX D&D they are a monster race and in the campaign I played in the DM had them arrayed against the halflings as enemies. Some sort of competition for choice hill lands after kicking the goblins out. And also had a large hill kingdom north of an elven forest kingdom.

Though Top Ballistia for BECMI took the gnomes and turned them into a pretty good setting book much like the others in the CC series did for undersea and lycanthrope themed settings.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;1046728Excuse me, I have a question:  Why do people assume that all Kender are uniform, that every single player HAS to play the race the EXACT same way?  I thought PC's were special by the virtue that they are adventurers, meaning they step out of the social norm.

Because Dragonlance was a good book series but a shit setting to play in? The klepto and fearlessness is hardwired into the race.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;1046728Excuse me, I have a question:  Why do people assume that all Kender are uniform, that every single player HAS to play the race the EXACT same way?  I thought PC's were special by the virtue that they are adventurers, meaning they step out of the social norm.

Its a part of the race. Its not a personality trait they pick up.

Other than that players are free to play them however. And have. Ive seen some evil kender PCs at cons and damn they make for some scary assassins in the right hands.

Its just that it feels like the majority of players play them exactly as described. They arent like say AD&D elves who tend to not have so much of their personalities hardcoded into the race.

Quote from: The Exploited.;1046324I've not heard of the Kender, so I had to do another wiki. Pixie kind of things?? Another race definitely not for me...

Nope. Pixies got their own entry later.

Kender are from Dragonlance. Short race with an overall childlike build and attitude, but with more adult elven features and the pointy ears. The main features were they were just short of totally immune to fear. And they were all kleptomaniacs. Tooootally iiiiinocent kleptos. They also tend to be very inquisitive and talkative. All-of-them...

As noted above the fearlessness and klepto are racial elements rather than personality quirks. Part of the curse that created them in the first place. Same with the Tinker Gnomes. They cant not make things overcomplex.

By hardcoded/hardwired, I believe you're referring to the curse that makes Kender what they are. Those annoying traits are not just personality aspects that can be changed by a player anymore than saying a Drow sees well in daylight.

In D&D 5e, the Kenku are the current "cursed to be a pain in the ass" race. They mimic those around them--they don't even have voices of their own--and they are supposedly incapable of original thinking. Yeah, that sounds like a fun one to play...:rolleyes:

Quote from: Christopher Brady;1046674Excuse me, I have a question.  Why are you against speshul snoflaks when you just created an option for a 'persecuted minority' in the hands of the players?  Why are you enabling the very thing you claim to hate.

Really, how so?