Quote from: Nexus;736929I'm not entirely sure what about you're trying to make. I'm talking about how they're trying to downplay the idea that its an anime game now when very recently they were pimping it as an anime game. You seem to be saying that this changed over the course of years. I saw it change over the course of weeks. Very recent ads were calling it "an anime fantasy game" so the denials come across as disingenuous to say the least.

Sorry, I was responding more to the seeming building comment that Exalted is, and should be, an Anime RPG. I didn't mean to argue against your specific observation about a change in the advertising in that last few weeks.

To be honest, I wasn't aware that WW had done any advertising for Exalted in the last two years given its been in development hell for that time. Then again I have also stopped following the most of the KS updates and any threads on RPGnet

Quote from: Skywalker;736930Sorry, I was responding more to the seeming building comment that Exalted is, and should be, an Anime RPG. I didn't mean to argue against your specific observation about a change in the advertising in that last few weeks.

To be honest, I wasn't aware that WW had done any advertising for Exalted in the last two years given its been in development hell for that time. Then again I have also stopped following the most of the KS updates and any threads on RPGnet

I don't have a stance of whether is "should" be an anime rpg or not. But the denials and various degree of scoff and insult I've seen from the developers recently at the very idea that anyone could think that it was or could be one given its presentation history strikes me as obnoxious posturing at best. Again, like Aberrant. But that attitude is consistent with how apparently Exalted can't be praised without crapping on something else.

Quote from: Nexus;736906White Wolf called it an anime fantasy game in their own ads until fairly recently. The whole "Oh its not THAT anime" thing came up when gamers started to question the game for having anime elements. Then the emphasis shifted "sword and sorcery" and "myth" and " any "Non Western"" Fantasy influence they could think of. It happened some previously, usually when someone that liked Exalted but disliked anime tried to justify liking it but lately its really come the official line and having seen how much the anime aspects were pimped when the game was release I find it funny watching them backpedal now (particularly claims that there is only a "little" anime fantasy influence in Exalted). It's more the same double talk I've come to expect from White Wolf and its spiritual heirs.

Quote from: Nexus;736929I'm not entirely sure what about you're trying to make. I'm talking about how they're trying to downplay the idea that its an anime game now when very recently they were pimping it as an anime game. You seem to be saying that this changed over the course of years. I saw it change over the course of weeks. Very recent ads were calling it "an anime fantasy game" so the denials come across as disingenuous to say the least. It rings very similar to how Aberrant supposedly wasn't a "superhero" game because superheroes were silly. It just had people with superpowers with code names and costumes (excuse me... "Signature Clothing") fighting various plots to take over the world and commit various crimes. Nothing like a superhero game.

Yup.

The 'it's not really anime, honest!' crowd remains the most disengenuous and stupid element of the entire Exalted fandom.

Seriously people, give it a fucking rest. You are not fooling goddamn anyone.

EXALTED (tm)3rd Edition: I Can't Believe It's Not Anime!

When I run Exalted it's anime as fuck, and I make it clear to my players that I draw my inspirataion heavily from anime and wu xia. Claiming that Exalted isn't anime? Not only is that disingenuous, it's also stupid. The brain parasites must be devouring the Exalted Dev Team.

To treat anime as if it is a insult word is just stupid.  Especially on Exalted which was one of the first rpgs to actually use anime.  What is next?  Complaining about Star Ship Troopers for using space marines even though the book is perhaps the very first to have space marines.  It is just plain stupidity.

Quote from: Snowman0147;737219To treat anime as if it is a insult word is just stupid.  Especially on Exalted which was one of the first rpgs to actually use anime.  What is next?  Complaining about Star Ship Troopers for using space marines even though the book is perhaps the very first to have space marines.  It is just plain stupidity.

Somebody already has done that.

Quote from: Warboss Squee;737272Somebody already has done that.

Yeah, isn't there a review floating around where the guy complains about Hienlein's use of that tired trope.

Quote from: Snowman0147;737219To treat anime as if it is a insult word is just stupid.  Especially on Exalted which was one of the first rpgs to actually use anime.  What is next?  Complaining about Star Ship Troopers for using space marines even though the book is perhaps the very first to have space marines.  It is just plain stupidity.

I would be interested to see the actual Dev quotes that Nexus is referring to. I suspect that this thread has singlehandedly taken a quote that "Exalted isn't just an anime game" to "Exalted is not an anime game" to "I am insulted at the suggestion that there is anime in Exalted'.

The first is an accurate statement. The other two are just stupid. Not that I put it past the Ex3 Dev time to be stupid, but I would be surprised that they went that far on this one.

No Dev has said "Exalted is not an anime game". They're not that silly. What they have been doing is downplaying the anime fantasy influence and elements more and more as the the genre lost some of its popular appeal (and the mechanics demonstrated more and more trouble handling that high octant level of play same as with the "power levels"). This after years of playing it up previously.

Now anime fantasy has 'little" influence aside from a few of the "visuals" and when the topic is broached in Exalted discussion that Devs come across like its an insult to claim there are strong anime influences, like it denigrating the game. Essentially the same reaction as when it was even suggested the Aberrant was a superhero game. Its same old elitist bullshit WWGS used to do with its "Storytelling game" crap or that laughable "Graduation your game" stuff from a few years back.

Quote from: Nexus;737399What they have been doing is downplaying the anime fantasy influence and elements more and more as the the genre lost some of its popular appeal (and the mechanics demonstrated more and more trouble handling that high octant level of play same as with the "power levels"). This after years of playing it up previously.

Cool. I think your statement here holds the reason behind the recent shift. I agree that its silly to deny the anime influence on Exalted as wears it on its sleeve and it is listed right there is the inspiration section. But the reaction is likely to be stronger to counter the fact that it has been disproportionally played up previously when it was a bigger selling point.

Quote from: Skywalker;737401Cool. I think your statement here holds the reason behind the recent shift. I agree that its silly to deny the anime influence on Exalted as wears it on its sleeve and it is listed right there is the inspiration section. But the reaction is likely to be stronger to counter the fact that it has been disproportionally played up previously when it was a bigger selling point.

I would be more willing to be charitable about if the tone wasn't so condescending towards the notion that, yes, anime fantasy has a major influence on Exalted, to those that like it and didn't come across trying to do some kind of revisionist fast one and play like it was never a major influence (and if you think it was you're foolish). Treat us like adults and just say we're shifting focus or we'd like to emphasis the other inspirations more, something besides condescension and not pander to the fans that like Exalted but have a problem with anime.

Quote from: Nexus;737404I would be more willing to be charitable about if the tone wasn't so condescending towards the notion that, yes, anime fantasy has a major influence on Exalted, to those that like it and didn't come across trying to do some kind of revisionist fast one and play like it was never a major influence (and if you think it was you're foolish).

The attitude of the Devs for 3e lead a lot to be desired and have for as long as they have worked on Exalted material as Ink Monkeys and the Errata. I totally sympathise with you there.

Its a sensitive area both ways though. I have seen a lot of Exalted detractors quickly dismiss the RPG as just an anime RPG, which is inaccurate and equally aggravating IME

I've never understood why Exalted was called an anime style game.  

I picked it up back in the day because of all the talk about how "anime" it was.  I like anime.  I have a whole bookcase ranging from Ah My Goddess to Venus Wars to Macross to Record of Lodoss War to Ninja Scroll and on and on and on.  I love console RPGs from Japan.  I've spent endless hours with Final Fantasies, Phantasy Stars, Shining Forces, and others.  Exalted sounded like just the thing for me.

To my mind the text never supported any anime tropes.  The art only ever looked animeish once (the Sword and Savant cover which the entire fanbase of the game threw a shitfit about).  It wasn't even a case of style over substance.  It was purely a case of propaganda over content.  

In fact the only thing I ever really picked up regarding anime from the fanbase and game was an aura of contempt.  So, while I'm just spectating in regards to this, having no horse in the race, I'm not surprised in the slightest to hear the people responsible for the new edition are wanting to distance themselves from the game's "anime roots."  But those aren't real roots to begin with, just phantoms.

Quote from: Gabriel2;737409I've never understood why Exalted was called an anime style game.  

Anime has always been an inspiration of Exalted. However, it was only one of four and didn't dominant the material even in terms of the art when it came out. But anime was initially disproportionately emphasised in the marketing as it was both a point of difference from the likes of D&D and also a growing market. This is pretty well detailed in the Making of Exalted book that came with the Exalted 1e LE book if its of interest.

Hand in hand with this was that anime also became a common reason given by Exalted detractors for not liking the RPG, which was odd as it didn't really accurately reflect on the RPG at all.

The amount of anime influence in Exalted did grow with the line. IMO (and seemingly with quite a number of other Exalted fans) this warped the initial balance of inspiration that the line started with that made it such a good RPG.

Given the dissatisfaction with this trend and the fact that anime no longer has the pulling power it once did, I think we are seeing a return to that initial balance of inspiration. That IMO is a very good thing.  On saying that, I don't think its good for the Devs to ignore anime or treat it as a bad influence.