Quote from: AsenRG;865047For once, I hope they do hold out:). People that raise shitstorms over sex charms in a game like Exalted are really annoying.

I've read Black Tokyo. A shitstorm spell in that game would fit in.  

JG

Quote from: Armchair Gamer;865309Yeah; from my perspective, minus-threads are really about venting more than anything, and that doesn't fit well with RPGNet's push to be a positive, constructive, affirming space (so long as you toe the ideological line ).

Someone should really tell several of the posters in Other Media that "positive affirming constructive space" thing.

Quote from: One Horse Town;865282Although i am finding it rather strange after all these years that our latest influx of new members is over the new edition of a game that is an RPGnet darling (surely nothing to do with the number of mods involved? No! Course not)

I don't find it strange.  If you want to talk about a game that's not anything story gamey, and you don't want to do it according to the laws of RPG.net's walled garden and strict moderation or deal with Something Awful's unique culture, this is the place to go.

If I want to learn about a new game, I probably go to SA, because for all of it's unique board culture, they really are good at breaking down the basics of a game in a thread and answering questions.  If I want to bounce ideas about a game that's popular or fringe, I go to RPG.net.  And if I put a high value on lack of moderation and being able to speak freely, but don't want to talk about anything remotely considered story-gamey, I go here.

Exalted 3 is big at all three sites, so I can only imagine people want different kinds of conversations and are going to the appropriate venues most of the time.

QuoteAnyway, as FVB is the current authorised RPGnet/RPGsite interface, i'm sure he'll explain away for the amusement of his chums.

Dude, I've been posting here for two years.  At this point, I'm probably more than just an authorized interface.  I'm probably a full-fledged Sleeper Cell.

"Plus" and "minus" threads are one RPGnet thing I don't get. "I've already made up my mind about this game and I only really want an echo chamber." What's the point of coming into a forum in the first place? Strikes me as navel-gazing bullshit.

Quote from: Future Villain Band;865320Something Awful's unique culture

This is probably the most polite way of saying "rancid cesspit" that I've ever seen.

Quote from: The Butcher;865321"Plus" and "minus" threads are one RPGnet thing I don't get. "I've already made up my mind about this game and I only really want an echo chamber." What's the point of coming into a forum in the first place? Strikes me as navel-gazing bullshit.

I started the plus threads thing, like, ten years ago, and it was because you couldn't talk about some games without a bunch of people wanting to come in and derail it by talking about their pet issues.  Like, HERO, for instance, was something I was really into,  but there were two or three guys who would show up every thread to turn "Help me build Green Lantern's ring" into round 15 of their discussion of why HERO didn't work for them anymore and please listen to me because I have all day to post and don't care that out of a twenty post thread, fifteen of the posts have been from me me me.

Burning Wheel had a similar kind of guy, until he got banned.

Quote from: Future Villain Band;865326I started the plus threads thing, like, ten years ago, and it was because you couldn't talk about some games without a bunch of people wanting to come in and derail it by talking about their pet issues.

For a current example, any fucking 5e thread over there gets the same group of 4e fans making comments about how 5e is broken and needs fixing, how the writers failed to take something in consideration and were too lazy to do it the right way and a bunch of other edition warring bullshit. A couple of the group are mods (Zeea and Metzgu or however they are spelled).

I may be completely misreading this but it seems like notanautomaton was challenged to provide links to support a claim by a mod in red text in Exalted thread but when those links were provided by someone else NAA caught a three week ban?

http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?770361-Infraction-for-notanautomaton-7)-Three-Week-Ban

Quote from: Nexus;865345I may be completely misreading this but it seems like notanautomaton was challenged to provide links to support a claim by a mod in red text in Exalted thread but when those links were provided by someone else NAA caught a three week ban?

http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?770361-Infraction-for-notanautomaton-7)-Three-Week-Ban

Close. NAA made a claim (against Holden, incidentally, for some stuff Holden said on another site last year) and the mod demanded sources or said it would be a PA. Someone else provided links and NAA was then subsequently banned again.

Technically NAA was wrong. Holden never specifically called him a sexual deviant. Holden just suggested he and others like him were insane sociopaths.

Quote from: Brand55;865347Close. NAA made a claim (against Holden, incidentally, for some stuff Holden said on another site last year) and the mod demanded sources or said it would be a PA. Someone else provided links and NAA was then subsequently banned again.

Technically NAA was wrong. Holden never specifically called him a sexual deviant. Holden just suggested he and others like him were insane sociopaths.

Ah, okay I did misunderstand but that doesn't seem much better.

Quote from: Brand55;865347Close. NAA made a claim (against Holden, incidentally, for some stuff Holden said on another site last year) and the mod demanded sources or said it would be a PA. Someone else provided links and NAA was then subsequently banned again.

Technically NAA was wrong. Holden never specifically called him a sexual deviant. Holden just suggested he and others like him were insane sociopaths.

I really don't get how someone as passive aggressive as him gets to be a mod...

Quote from: Warboss Squee;865315I've always been amused when someone goes into a plus thread and posts something negative only to be roundly castigated and banned. Cause there's a rule about that.

Same as there is for bringing your sunshine and bullshit into a minus thread. Which is the second post in the thread.

By an Admin.

And people wonder why we think their rules are bullshit.

Yeah, I was wondering why people don't get more bans for being positive in minus threads:). But then, I can't be bothered to care.

Quote from: James Gillen;865316I've read Black Tokyo. A shitstorm spell in that game would fit in.  

JG

I haven't, so can't relate. Sounded mostly boring, and the only reason I'm considering it is so I could write an Actual Play (and subsequently freak out some people I dislike).
I might reconsider the above if anyone was able to explain to me the appeal of Black Tokyo.

Quote from: The Butcher;865321"Plus" and "minus" threads are one RPGnet thing I don't get. "I've already made up my mind about this game and I only really want an echo chamber." What's the point of coming into a forum in the first place? Strikes me as navel-gazing bullshit.

Getting confirmation.

Quote from: Nexus;865348Ah, okay I did misunderstand but that doesn't seem much better.

Weirdly, after reading the discussion on SV, I'm on Holden's side.
Yes, adding a "willing" clause wouldn't be a bad idea. But it also does imply "some of you are going to play rapists", and not only that, it implies "we know that, and we're giving the good guys an edge".
And I'm not fine with the former statement;).

Quote from: AsenRG;865362Yeah, I was wondering why people don't get more bans for being positive in minus threads:). But then, I can't be bothered to care.

Yeah, there's some exchange about that in the so recently closed thread when some were pissed when I suggested that coming to argue the virtues of the subject of a - thread might be causing the problem, especially when those arguments were largely "Your problems and issues a meaningless and you're an idiot for having them."

QuoteI might reconsider the above if anyone was able to explain to me the appeal of Black Tokyo.

Some people like their horror edgy, sexual and dark and/or exploring dark, disturbing themes in their role playing. Allot of people play criminals, mass murderers and other, at best questionable, things in their games, after all. OTOH, others don't see the appeal in sitting around playing Let's Pretend at all regardless if you're pretending to be a Jedi Knight or or a serial killer.  

Different Strokes for Different folks.

Though, perhaps ironically, much of the focus in Black Tokyo is stopping or fighting some of the more messed up crap going on in the setting. You can play on the dark side or be corrupted by it but that's not the default assumption even in a "play the monsters" style campaign. But in that sense, its no different the WoD just more brazen about its sexual aspects.

QuoteWeirdly, after reading the discussion on SV, I'm on Holden's side.
Yes, adding a "willing" clause wouldn't be a bad idea. But it also does imply "some of you are going to play rapists", and not only that, it implies "we know that, and we're giving the good guys an edge".
And I'm not fine with the former statement;).

My position is the same as always. Charms are tools, they don't have morality clauses anymore than a knife does. Tools can be misused. The intent of the sex charms is, well, what they do, they can be used in whatever manner the character chooses and its up to the player/gm to determine that. Some Exalts probably did get up to pretty vile things with any of them (there are canon examples of such) things (like Desus and Admiral Arkady).

A character can use their Melee charms to defend a village from raiders or to slaughter the pathetic mortal forces raised to resist their brutal conquest or both. So a character could use Celestial Bliss Trick on an unwilling subject and that would be a majorly messed up thing to do. But allowing for the possibility doesn't mean that

1. The game is endorsing that activity or giving it a pass morally

2. That all players are going to rush eagerly to do so any more than having Grappling rules promotes playing rapists.

It depicts a world with no innate morality or even moral compass attached to power. Which I thought was supposedly one of the things that made Exalted so much more "mature" and "realistic" than games like D and D. Hell, you can use any of those charms for twisted purposes. Havesh used the disguise effects in Larceny to sleep with women as their husbands (whom he'd murdered to replace...). And some of the outrage brigade -defended- him at the time, even argued with people that called him a rapist for doing so. And I've heard of similar applications of other abilities.

And lets not forget the Exalted NC-17 contests.

I agree Holden is passive aggressive (among other things) but it is telling that that is the first place some people's minds go when looking at effects like that like how some want ideas censors because they'll tempt "other" people but they're really worried about themselves like they don't trust themselves not to do it or not to enjoy it.

Or maybe they just like acting as Morality Cops, making sure others don't have any unapproved fun on their watch.

Well, lets see how this one goes as I suppose its more constructive.

http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?770564-Exalted-What-problems-do-you-have-with-Ex3-and-what-are-you-doing-about-it

Edit: Though for the first page or so it appears that its more a "post your issues so we can dismiss them" thread.

Edit2: Oh good and here's Holden to add his usual dose of good cheer and level headed discourse.

Quote from: Future Villain Band;865326I started the plus threads thing, like, ten years ago, and it was because you couldn't talk about some games without a bunch of people wanting to come in and derail it by talking about their pet issues.

I understand that it sucks, but really, how hard is it to ignore the threadcrappers.