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Exalted 3 - What the hell?

Started by DisgruntleFairy, February 24, 2014, 01:51:28 AM

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Christopher Brady

#1500
October 27, 2015, 10:18:53 PM
I just wanna play Beowulf, why is it so hard to do that anywhere, short of an out and out Superhero RPG?
"And now, my friends, a Dragon\'s toast!  To life\'s little blessings:  wars, plagues and all forms of evil.  Their presence keeps us alert --- and their absence makes us grateful." -T.A. Barron[/SIZE]

Spike

#1501
October 27, 2015, 10:25:27 PM
Quote from: Daztur;862056In the defense of the Bechdel Test it's pretty useful for analyzing, say, the output of all Hollywood movies this year. It gives you some interesting information that way, especially looking at stuff year on year. But using it to look at individual movies is idiotic, that's running a statistical analysis with a sample size of one which is worse than useless.

No its not.  Its useless.  To borrow an example from a woman, Lesbian Dildo Sluts Seven would pass the Bechdel Test. Horror movies that torture female characters to death for explicitly misogynistic reasons can pass the Bechdel test.  

Even as an analytic tool for 'interesting information' its useless because of the sheer volume of false positives.   A comic artist making a joke is a terrible means of developing statistically meaningful analytic tools, more so when said artist explicitly denies its utility.  

The only thing it tests for is itself.
For you the day you found a minor error in a Post by Spike and forced him to admit it, it was the greatest day of your internet life.  For me it was... Tuesday.

For the curious: Apparently, in person, I sound exactly like the Youtube Character The Nostalgia Critic.   I have no words.

[URL=https:

Spike

#1502
October 27, 2015, 10:25:59 PM
Quote from: Christopher Brady;862059I just wanna play Beowulf, why is it so hard to do that anywhere, short of an out and out Superhero RPG?

Scion.

Just saying.
For you the day you found a minor error in a Post by Spike and forced him to admit it, it was the greatest day of your internet life.  For me it was... Tuesday.

For the curious: Apparently, in person, I sound exactly like the Youtube Character The Nostalgia Critic.   I have no words.

[URL=https:

Christopher Brady

#1503
October 27, 2015, 10:35:21 PM
Quote from: Spike;862061Scion.

Just saying.

Ever played Scion?

Just sayin'.
"And now, my friends, a Dragon\'s toast!  To life\'s little blessings:  wars, plagues and all forms of evil.  Their presence keeps us alert --- and their absence makes us grateful." -T.A. Barron[/SIZE]

Spike

#1504
October 27, 2015, 11:05:56 PM
Quote from: Christopher Brady;862062Ever played Scion?

Just sayin'.

No, friend. I'm a committed member of WWA, White Wolf Anonymous. I've been clean for five years now...







Amusingly, the very last thing I played... I should say TRIED to play... was Exalted 2nd edition. As a GM.

Never again.
For you the day you found a minor error in a Post by Spike and forced him to admit it, it was the greatest day of your internet life.  For me it was... Tuesday.

For the curious: Apparently, in person, I sound exactly like the Youtube Character The Nostalgia Critic.   I have no words.

[URL=https:

Nexus

#1505
October 27, 2015, 11:18:27 PM Last Edit: October 27, 2015, 11:23:03 PM by Nexus
Quote from: Christopher Brady;862059I just wanna play Beowulf, why is it so hard to do that anywhere, short of an out and out Superhero RPG?

Sounds like there's some promising new games coming out along those lines (mentioned earlier in the thread, IIRC). Hell, one of the draws that got us into Exalted was the "Beowulf teams up with Ryu to fight Dracula and Cthullu cultists" anime gonzo fantasy aspect. but now that's doing it wrong. .

On a more scholarly note, the connection between superheroes and mythological heroes and tales is pretty strong so it is kind of fitting. :)
Remember when Illinois Nazis where a joke in the Blue Brothers movie?

Democracy, meh? (538)

 "The salient fact of American politics is that there are fifty to seventy million voters each of whom will volunteer to live, with his family, in a cardboard box under an overpass, and cook sparrows on an old curtain rod, if someone would only guarantee that the black, gay, Hispanic, liberal, whatever, in the next box over doesn't even have a curtain rod, or a sparrow to put on it."

Daztur

#1506
October 27, 2015, 11:22:16 PM
Quote from: Spike;862060No its not.  Its useless.  To borrow an example from a woman, Lesbian Dildo Sluts Seven would pass the Bechdel Test. Horror movies that torture female characters to death for explicitly misogynistic reasons can pass the Bechdel test.  

Even as an analytic tool for 'interesting information' its useless because of the sheer volume of false positives.   A comic artist making a joke is a terrible means of developing statistically meaningful analytic tools, more so when said artist explicitly denies its utility.  

The only thing it tests for is itself.

It's kind of like BMI. It gives bullshit results for a lot of people (lots and lots of professional athletes are officially obese) but it gives useful results on the level of a population, especially when you look at changes over time.

If the BMI of a population shoots up 10 points in twenty years then you can tell that people got a hell of a lot fatter. But it's still really stupid to go and laugh at how fat body builders are because their BMIs are so high.

False positives/negatives mostly cancel each other out when you look at things like "how has the number of Hollywood movies that pass/fail the Bechdel Test changed from decade to decade."

Nexus

#1507
October 27, 2015, 11:24:09 PM
Quote from: Christopher Brady;862062Ever played Scion?

Just sayin'.

I've heard the new edition is supposed to be better but, AIU, the "new" system is yet another version of Storyteller.
Remember when Illinois Nazis where a joke in the Blue Brothers movie?

Democracy, meh? (538)

 "The salient fact of American politics is that there are fifty to seventy million voters each of whom will volunteer to live, with his family, in a cardboard box under an overpass, and cook sparrows on an old curtain rod, if someone would only guarantee that the black, gay, Hispanic, liberal, whatever, in the next box over doesn't even have a curtain rod, or a sparrow to put on it."

Christopher Brady

#1508
October 27, 2015, 11:27:10 PM
Quote from: Spike;862063No, friend. I'm a committed member of WWA, White Wolf Anonymous. I've been clean for five years now...







Amusingly, the very last thing I played... I should say TRIED to play... was Exalted 2nd edition. As a GM.

Never again.

The issue with Scion is the same that all WW games have, Combat and the Dexterity God (no pun intended) Stat.  And a Beowulf clone doesn't have a super Dexterity...
"And now, my friends, a Dragon\'s toast!  To life\'s little blessings:  wars, plagues and all forms of evil.  Their presence keeps us alert --- and their absence makes us grateful." -T.A. Barron[/SIZE]

Nexus

#1509
October 27, 2015, 11:43:33 PM
A little more on topic: I'm actually surprised that so far only one person has blown their stack about the two sex related charms in the core book. They didn't seem to be a backer so maybe that's really going to blow up when the book goes into wider release.

But well, they chose who to pander too.
Remember when Illinois Nazis where a joke in the Blue Brothers movie?

Democracy, meh? (538)

 "The salient fact of American politics is that there are fifty to seventy million voters each of whom will volunteer to live, with his family, in a cardboard box under an overpass, and cook sparrows on an old curtain rod, if someone would only guarantee that the black, gay, Hispanic, liberal, whatever, in the next box over doesn't even have a curtain rod, or a sparrow to put on it."

Nexus

#1510
October 28, 2015, 09:06:25 AM
Quote from: Daztur;862056It isn't just the Drama Club who do this sort of thing. .

Oh no, taking something that has, at best, a small kernel of truth or some vague applicability and then running it into the ground as some kind of ultimate truth definitely isn't limited to specific circles, look at IQ tests for example. But it sure feels like I run headlong into it from some more than others these days.
Remember when Illinois Nazis where a joke in the Blue Brothers movie?

Democracy, meh? (538)

 "The salient fact of American politics is that there are fifty to seventy million voters each of whom will volunteer to live, with his family, in a cardboard box under an overpass, and cook sparrows on an old curtain rod, if someone would only guarantee that the black, gay, Hispanic, liberal, whatever, in the next box over doesn't even have a curtain rod, or a sparrow to put on it."

Warthur

#1511
October 28, 2015, 11:56:45 AM
Somewhat confounding this place's general characterisation of RPG.net as an echo chamber, there's now a so far healthy and interesting thread of people sharing their criticisms and disappointments about 3E.

The discussion of the Charms stuff is particularly interesting - for instance, see this bit from Ghosthead on post 43:

QuoteAnd yes, it is a huge section if you feel you need to read through it and consider all your options before making your choices. In 1e the section is 74 pages, in 2e, 82 pages, and both have large Charm titles and subheadings (really, using colour to break out subheadings is not enjoyable) and with large Charm trees taking much up the pagecount. In 3e it is 176 pages with a very tight layout, no Charms trees (to break up the text and to show relationships and progression between Charms), probably about the same amount of art as the whole 2e Charm chapter. If you feel you have to read the whole thing through before making decisions, it is really a slog (esp. if you goal is also to read Sorcery and Martial Arts, and Evocations).

On top of that there's also discussion of how the writeup of each individual charm is obfuscatory and requires you to pick through the entire fluff writeup carefully to work out the rules effects.
I am no longer posting here or reading this forum because Pundit has regularly claimed credit for keeping this community active. I am sick of his bullshit for reasons I explain here and I don\'t want to contribute to anything he considers to be a personal success on his part.

I recommend The RPG Pub as a friendly place where RPGs can be discussed and where the guiding principles of moderation are "be kind to each other" and "no politics". It\'s pretty chill so far.

Nexus

#1512
October 28, 2015, 12:00:35 PM
Quote from: Warthur;862145Somewhat confounding this place's general characterisation of RPG.net as an echo chamber, there's now a so far healthy and interesting thread of people sharing their criticisms and disappointments about 3E.

Thanks Warthur, not sure how I missed that thread. It's going to be very interesting to see how that thread goes, particularly as far as Mod attention .
Remember when Illinois Nazis where a joke in the Blue Brothers movie?

Democracy, meh? (538)

 "The salient fact of American politics is that there are fifty to seventy million voters each of whom will volunteer to live, with his family, in a cardboard box under an overpass, and cook sparrows on an old curtain rod, if someone would only guarantee that the black, gay, Hispanic, liberal, whatever, in the next box over doesn't even have a curtain rod, or a sparrow to put on it."

Nexus

#1513
October 28, 2015, 12:03:04 PM
Solars
 Lunars
 Sidereals
 Dragon-Blooded
 Abyssals
 Liminals
 Exigents
 Getimians
 Alchemicals
 Infernals
 [Lunar-counterpoint]
 [Lunar-counterpoint]
 [Sidereal-counterpoint]
 [Chosen of the Deep]
 [Speakers]

So 15 splats?
Remember when Illinois Nazis where a joke in the Blue Brothers movie?

Democracy, meh? (538)

 "The salient fact of American politics is that there are fifty to seventy million voters each of whom will volunteer to live, with his family, in a cardboard box under an overpass, and cook sparrows on an old curtain rod, if someone would only guarantee that the black, gay, Hispanic, liberal, whatever, in the next box over doesn't even have a curtain rod, or a sparrow to put on it."

Nexus

#1514
October 28, 2015, 01:57:17 PM Last Edit: October 28, 2015, 02:11:15 PM by Nexus
In the first few pages that complaint thread looks like more of the same. People state problems or concerns they have and get told how stupid and wrong they are for that, how the game was obviously something different since the dawn of time and they're bad people for wanting or liking something different.

Edit: And, as I think I've said before and Resplendentscorpion mentions in that thread the frequent positive comments may indicate that many of the less that hardcore fans have left the fold awhile ago or just given up.
Remember when Illinois Nazis where a joke in the Blue Brothers movie?

Democracy, meh? (538)

 "The salient fact of American politics is that there are fifty to seventy million voters each of whom will volunteer to live, with his family, in a cardboard box under an overpass, and cook sparrows on an old curtain rod, if someone would only guarantee that the black, gay, Hispanic, liberal, whatever, in the next box over doesn't even have a curtain rod, or a sparrow to put on it."
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