Quote from: beejazz;479167I'm not telling you you can't do it, or passing moral judgements on what you pretend to do. You can imagine all kinds of shit. Go ahead.

I'm just asking what imagining infanticide brings to the table that not imagining infanticide would not.

About as much as imagining my wizard dressed in white robes rather than a linen tunic and leather pants does.

QuoteOr the difference between a dragon and an orc has something to do with diet. Namely, a dragon will eat fucking everything when it grows up, whether malicious or not.

So will my orcs.

QuoteAs I've said, evil is not the only way to justify killing. Inherent danger works too. Giant scorpions don't care one way or another, probably aren't hurting you for the sheer joy of it, etc. But you still don't want fifty of them running around your village.

Of course, but none of this speaks to evil orcs being a manifestation of real world racism.

QuoteI can see I'm not the only one who sees dragons as not inherently evil.

Then why is it "ok" to imaginarily kill dragon babies, but not orc babies? Why does that bring more to the game?

Personally, I see outsiders as sort of without free will. I don't pull my sources from judeo-christian stuff so much, and I see outsiders as made of the stuff of their planes. So demons are made of hellstuff, which is the origin of evil seeping into the world in the same way that elementals are made of fire and exist only to spread the flame everywhere possible.

They only serve free-willed gods for the same reason that gods can warp sympathetic planes around themselves.




I've always kind of liked the idea of the Judeo-Christian devil as an appointed antagonist. Off topic, I know.[/QUOTE]

Indeed. I don't have much to say about demons and devils as they really are kinda outside the topic.

Quote from: Imperator;479175I think he refers to Benoist's use of the term Team Left. Not sure I get the reference, though.

I take "Team Left" to refer to the left wing, or liberal side, of American politics.

Quote from: Sigmund;479185I take "Team Left" to refer to the left wing, or liberal side, of American politics.

I assumed he was referring to left wing in the Canadian/British sense of the term.

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;479189I assumed he was referring to left wing in the Canadian/British sense of the term.

What's their angle?

Quote from: Sigmund;479192What's their angle?

I don't really know to be honest. Not big into political discussions myself. I just always think of politics in the US being more conservative than in Canada or England. And I tend to think of the American left being more toward the center than the Canadian left.

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;479195I don't really know to be honest. Not big into political discussions myself. I just always think of politics in the US being more conservative than in Canada or England. And I tend to think of the American left being more toward the center than the Canadian left.

The Left wing in Britain were basically Marxists until about 20 years ago when it was obvious that that wasn't going to win may elections.
Those guys still exist but much smaller.
The British generally think that you have one party politics over there as you have a big right of centre party with 2 wings to it.

But we digress and anyway I always think of Marxists as Inherrently Evil as it makes the process of chopping them to peices with my sword much more palatable.

Quote from: jibbajibba;479202The Left wing in Britain were basically Marxists until about 20 years ago when it was obvious that that wasn't going to win may elections.
Those guys still exist but much smaller.
The British generally think that you have one party politics over there as you have a big right of centre party with 2 wings to it.

But we digress and anyway I always think of Marxists as Inherrently Evil as it makes the process of chopping them to peices with my sword much more palatable.

So the left wing isn't much different between here and there then. At least the perceptions of them anyway.

Quote from: Sigmund;479204So the left wing isn't much different between here and there then. At least the perceptions of them anyway.

Well over here Obama Care would be decried as a destruction of the National Health service and the end of the Welfare state.

Over there its seen as the introduction of a Socialist Welfare State and the end to the ability for a man to choose his own destiny.

so pretty different.

Quote from: Vmerc@;479174The cycle continues.

Saying that the other guy's evil is not the only justification for bloodshed is not the same as saying that evil only exists in the game to justify bloodshed.

The positions aren't opposite, but they really have nothing to do with each other.

To clarify:

I did not say that the purpose of evil in game was only to justify killing evil things.

I did say that evil is not the only justification for killing things.

Quote from: SigmundAbout as much as imagining my wizard dressed in white robes rather than a linen tunic and leather pants does.

I get it. It's distasteful for me, and not for you. Stuff like that varies. I'm cool with that.

So your answer is that it doesn't actually matter, then? And that infanticide doesn't contribute anything but infanticide?

QuoteOf course, but none of this speaks to evil orcs being a manifestation of real world racism.

Of course not. Because orcs=minorities is a stupid concept. I dismissed it as such pages ago.

QuoteThen why is it "ok" to imaginarily kill dragon babies, but not orc babies? Why does that bring more to the game?

Honestly? This wouldn't come up at my table for about the same reason PCs don't shit in the dungeon. It's just plain not what I showed up to the game to do. I'm just not into the helpless baby-killing.

But off the top of my head, eggs aren't really sentient yet, and even young dragons are still potentially combat-ready.

QuoteIndeed. I don't have much to say about demons and devils as they really are kinda outside the topic.

The topic has kind of drifted to when "inherent evil" is really an okay distinction to use. Or rather, when we as GMs would be okay with using it (since there isn't really an objective answer on when it's okay to imagine a particular thing).

I am perfectly willing to admit that I am racist against everything that is not human. If another intelligent race developed on Earth, in the real world, I would lead the charge to hunt and kill them off down to every last woman and child. Because there can only be one dominant species on a planet.

We did the same thing to the Neanderthals. And good riddance.

As for "inherent evil"; don't believe in it. Don't even think it makes much sense, as a concept. Evil describes what a person does, it tells you nothing about who they are.

Rabid dogs aren't evil. They still need to be put down.

Quote from: TristramEvans;479221We did the same thing to the Neanderthals. And good riddance.

This question is a bit more debated than you put it here.

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Quote from: jibbajibba;479154So how are the half-orcs treated when they find themselves with civilised folks.

*snip*.

We have been treated good for the most part. Perhaps the prevalent attitudes in Bens version of Ptolus are a bit more forgiving.

I think it helps that Runch is a cleric. Tudd has a high charisma so is able to charm folk by his...naivete and imposing strength?!

A NPC that recently joined the group is a bit more touchy. I've got my eye on him....he is showing some suspicion regarding Runch and Tudd and he is for killing my prisoner Erarht, a cowardly Orc captured in battle.
Some PC's in the party are for wasting the thing as well, others are "Meh".

It has been fun RPing the situation as it adds depth to the game and brings the NPC/PC's more to life.

Quote

Quote from: Imperator;479175*snip*
Couple of intellectuals, if there was ever one
*snip*.

Remember that next time you need healing (1/2) Elf boy...

Runch has a good Wis. though mediocre Int. Coupled with a low Cha. he is a bit socialy inept.
Tudd has the Cha. and Str...taken as a whole we are a formidable and friendly force!

Quote

Quote from: Sigmund;479181There is some stigma being RPed, but mostly because we (skofflox and I via our characters) are currently befriending an orc we encountered and the others just want to kill it. It's pretty fun, and I haven't seen so much as a shred of evidence pointing to actual real world racism on the part of anyone involved.

Yup!

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;479195I don't really know to be honest. Not big into political discussions myself. I just always think of politics in the US being more conservative than in Canada or England. And I tend to think of the American left being more toward the center than the Canadian left.

They're basically the same, but in Canada anyways, there aren't as many radicals...on either side. American politics has gotten to the point where the conservative and liberal parties are now defined by the radicals, whereas the majority of the populace, as in any civilization, tends more towards the middle.

I have heard it said that the Canadian Right Wing is pretty much comparable to the American Left.

Quote from: jibbajibba;479206Well over here Obama Care would be decried as a destruction of the National Health service and the end of the Welfare state.

Over there its seen as the introduction of a Socialist Welfare State and the end to the ability for a man to choose his own destiny.

so pretty different.

Now that the US has officially lost the status of an AAA first world nation, every AAA-rated country in the world now has national health care. I find that very amusing when I read the reactions to "Obama Care" from the Rightwing Americans.

Quote from: boulet;479227This question is a bit more debated than you put it here.

I didn't ask a question.