Since I used to frequent Enworld in the run up 3rd Ed, the more I see of its decline to wokism the more I am saddened by the loss. Not as bad as RPGNet, but heading squarely in that direction:

https://www.enworld.org/threads/coyote-crow-stories-of-the-free-lands-an-interview-with-connor-alexander.690686/

The comment in the thread by 'doctorhook' is really telling as an example of white guilt virtue signaling. Had to post something here because if I vent my spleen there I would get banned by that twat Morrus and there are genuinely some threads there I am interested in posting to now and again.

Just remember folks, in the words of our friend Connor Alexander, creator of Coyote & Crow - "It's not a perfect world, just a different one. One that lacks colonial trauma."

Rant over.

It's been a slow but steady decay for years now.  It was round about 2014 - 2015 that I gave up on them, as I could see where it was going.  The problem is two-fold:  Morrus wants it this way.  Every time a moderator quits and they replace with a new person, the new moderator is slightly worse than the one replaced.  This is exactly the course that rpg.net took when it first started to go off the rails--slow at first, then only later cascading more rapidly into losing all pretense of fairness to moderation for the non-woke.  In some ways, rpg.net has given Enworld a lot of undeserved cover, on the grounds that it wasn't yet as bad.  With both of them sliding into worse, that's of dubious comfort.

Sorry man, I used to browse those forums during the 3.X days, and they had some good stuff.
Ultimately any place that has been infiltrated by leftists will continue down the path of eliminating those who disagree, until everyone there quakes in fear and repeats the chant of the One True Party.

Coyote and Crow is made by a man who hates whites with a burning passion, and it shows.  A place set up to allow for people to fan his balls while eliminating dissent is exactly what I would expect of a fully infiltrated and weaponized forum.

Disappointing. I still use Enworld from time to time, but I've steadily drifted away from it.

I used to practically live on ENWorld.

Lively discussion topics, lots of free content, and enthusiasm for 3.x products (warts and all). Nary a complaint about OA being raciss or the use of "he" as a generic pronoun in published products being patriarchal.

Three things killed ENW:

1. Being sold to a guy who is just slightly to the right of TBP.  He's just slightly less of a cunt than the TBP mods or Umbran.

2. The move to 4e.  I don't know what it is, but the enthusiasm for generating amazing content (a 3.x treatment of old adventures, free and pay utilities, expansions of canon content, etc.) died in the wake of the GSL.

3. Turning Dragon into an online thing before killing it and Dungeon.

4. The rise of shitty (not even woke, just shitty) RPG content for D&D and Pathfinder.  There was definitely distinct "jump the shark" moments for 3.x, 4e, and 5e, as well as Pathfinder.  Moreso the 4e retread of previous 4e content.

I mean, I look at ENW now, and it's been a lot of nothing but disguised ads, complaints about mechanics with no solutions offered, and whining about wrongthink for a really long time.  No creative content. No utilities, etc. You can only hope that OneD&D results in some decent discussion, but I doubt it

I post on Enworld pretty often and their moderation is reasonable. It is nothing like TBP. You have to be an over the top asshole or violate some pretty simple rules (don't make it political and claim agenda) and you are pretty free to argue your point.

There are plenty of far left people that post there but many are very thin-skinned and immediately spam the ignore button so you never see their posts again.

Your example thread is an interview (which they do for many RPG creators) with pretty softball questions. That is a fairly normal interview there, they are not pretending to be some hard hitting investigative site. Doctorhook is quite correct - in Canada the hottest political issue is the embarrassingly bad way that Native Americans were treated compared to the political fiction that all Canadians are nice. I guess the fact that the major high level youth hockey organization has been covering up rape is the absolute hottest now, but otherwise the point raised is pretty right on. Unless you are into language wars.

So I don't get your complaint and why you had to come here to make it.

Quote from: Myrdin Potter on August 25, 2022, 08:12:12 PM
So I don't get your complaint and why you had to come here to make it.

Some people are so sick and tired of seeing virtue signaling everywhere - ask GeekyBugle1. He's one of my fave people who argue with the knobslobbers on the left, although I fear he'll have an aneurysm one day. ENWorld is a big rpg forum that has been overrun by leftoids. At one time it was decent, but those days are long ago.

Where else can someone vent and get people to talk with? Far as I know this is pretty much it for any discussion of once much better rpg related forums. People used to discuss games on rpg forums, sadly not so much anymore. I'm going to blame tangency, which should be killed by fire, for that.

Quote from: Myrdin Potter on August 25, 2022, 08:12:12 PM
I post on Enworld pretty often and their moderation is reasonable. It is nothing like TBP. You have to be an over the top asshole or violate some pretty simple rules (don't make it political and claim agenda) and you are pretty free to argue your point.

There are plenty of far left people that post there but many are very thin-skinned and immediately spam the ignore button so you never see their posts again.

Your example thread is an interview (which they do for many RPG creators) with pretty softball questions. That is a fairly normal interview there, they are not pretending to be some hard hitting investigative site. Doctorhook is quite correct - in Canada the hottest political issue is the embarrassingly bad way that Native Americans were treated compared to the political fiction that all Canadians are nice. I guess the fact that the major high level youth hockey organization has been covering up rape is the absolute hottest now, but otherwise the point raised is pretty right on. Unless you are into language wars.

So I don't get your complaint and why you had to come here to make it.

That's not true. The reason why I left enworld was because I was participating in a thread in which there was a tangent that explained something that was a phenomenon in game communities and also touched upon political topics. There were at least 4-5 people arguing the "liberal" (in reality, regressive) point in overtly political terms. Morrus himself shut down the discussion and perma-banned one person. Guess who was the one who was banned? It's only gotten worse in terms of who gets moderated and who gets a free pass. Nope, that place is explicitly leftist with a thin veneer of respectability from the past.

This topic makes me sad every time it comes up.  It was a _great_ place to hang out and talk games once upon a time.  I remember the inflection point.  Morrus got into argument with a member about gay rights and definitively lost.  The next day there was a new policy that ENW was to be an "inclusive" site and other opinions were not allowed.  That was the day the rules changed from "no politics" to "no politics that Morrus disagrees with."  At that point I left and never looked back.  I see a lot of familiar names from ENWorld on this site now.

Quote from: Skullking on August 25, 2022, 02:21:50 PM
Just remember folks, in the words of our friend Connor Alexander, creator of Coyote & Crow - "It's not a perfect world, just a different one. One that lacks colonial trauma."

Only "inter-indigenous trauma" then, I suppose.

Quote from: Myrdin Potter on August 25, 2022, 08:12:12 PM
So I don't get your complaint and why you had to come here to make it.

Hi Myrdin Potter.

Please read the other posts on this thread plus the threads on Coyote & Crow and you might get my complaint. Other posters have expressed views like mine but much more eloquently and more thoroughly. For example Venka's comment "Coyote and Crow is made by a man who hates whites with a burning passion, and it shows."

I posted here because I felt like it, and because I thought that the promotion of Coyote & Crow was a 'jump the shark' moment in Enworld's decay that needed highlighting, plus I didn't 'come here', I have been here for a while.

Didn't post it there because, as Hzilong's anecdote makes clear, the likelihood of getting a permaban is exceptionally high there challenging the regressive 'liberal' hivemind and I have had several near run-ins with Morrus already so I'm sure he would happily pull the trigger.

Quote from: Mishihari on August 26, 2022, 03:00:17 AM
That was the day the rules changed from "no politics" to "no politics that Morrus disagrees with."  At that point I left and never looked back.  I see a lot of familiar names from ENWorld on this site now.

Yes, although notably there was indeed a decay, it didn't happen all at once. There was a weird period when (Left) Sex Politics was allowed but (Left) Race politics wasn't. They eventually Converged on a consistent SJW/Woke line, same as RPGnet. Last time I checked their moderation is still different from RPGnet though, typically you get Umbran being a cunt (as mentioned upthread) for some innocuous statement, he makes a snarky comment and gives a thread ban or temporary ban where RPGnet would give a perma-ban. ENW mods also talk a lot less than RPGnet mods about how 'tired' they are from all the bannings - makes me wonder how tired Beria felt in the red room after a hard day executing Polish officers. 

I guess my feeling about ENW is that it gets harder and harder to read, while offering less and less of any value. Basically the same trajectory as RPGnet but 5-8 years behind.

I thought Enworld was mostly about D&D and all other gamers were an afterthought.  Is this not the case?

Also, is there really even a need for a forum like EnWorld when you have places like this to talk about D&D and all other gamers?

Quote from: Hzilong on August 25, 2022, 09:57:01 PM

Quote from: Myrdin Potter on August 25, 2022, 08:12:12 PM
I post on Enworld pretty often and their moderation is reasonable. It is nothing like TBP. You have to be an over the top asshole or violate some pretty simple rules (don't make it political and claim agenda) and you are pretty free to argue your point.

There are plenty of far left people that post there but many are very thin-skinned and immediately spam the ignore button so you never see their posts again.

Your example thread is an interview (which they do for many RPG creators) with pretty softball questions. That is a fairly normal interview there, they are not pretending to be some hard hitting investigative site. Doctorhook is quite correct - in Canada the hottest political issue is the embarrassingly bad way that Native Americans were treated compared to the political fiction that all Canadians are nice. I guess the fact that the major high level youth hockey organization has been covering up rape is the absolute hottest now, but otherwise the point raised is pretty right on. Unless you are into language wars.

So I don't get your complaint and why you had to come here to make it.

That's not true. The reason why I left enworld was because I was participating in a thread in which there was a tangent that explained something that was a phenomenon in game communities and also touched upon political topics. There were at least 4-5 people arguing the "liberal" (in reality, regressive) point in overtly political terms. Morrus himself shut down the discussion and perma-banned one person. Guess who was the one who was banned? It's only gotten worse in terms of who gets moderated and who gets a free pass. Nope, that place is explicitly leftist with a thin veneer of respectability from the past.

You're not correct in your assessment.  They happily label a post with a warning for "Anti-inclusive content" before banning the poster for having the audacity to not conform to their groupthink - for example - by daring to state that making drow have dark skin and commit evil acts isn't racism against African Americans.  Or arguing that regardless of whether or not Zak S is a piece of shit, someone making a claim on the interwebs about being doxxed by Mike Mearls is going to need a burden of proof to be taken seriously - an "I know he did it" isn't evidence.

Being less shitty than TBP doesn't make ENW not shitty.  I sometimes wonder if Eric Noah was prescient in selling and getting the hell out - I'm sure that part of ENWs wokeness is profit-based as much as it is a certain type of Brit being a typical leftist twat.

A couple of things.

I, too, enjoyed the heady days when enworld was Eric Noah, pre-3 release. There was so much creativity. And some of the Story Hours were a thing of beauty (still re-read sep's occasionally). But to me enworld is irrelevant now, just like TBP.

And as far as racistoyte & wokerow is concerned, you're telling me white cherokee, after lamenting his problems that seem to indicate financial issues, is going to shill for a new setting?

Okay, we'll see how that works for them.