https://x.com/Dexerto/status/1862232004005126183 (https://x.com/Dexerto/status/1862232004005126183)
It could be a troll by Elon, but this is how Elon's purchase of Twitter/X began.
It could save D&D if it happens.
I'll believe it when I see it
Quote from: jeff37923 on November 28, 2024, 06:40:35 PMhttps://x.com/Dexerto/status/1862232004005126183 (https://x.com/Dexerto/status/1862232004005126183)
It could be a troll by Elon, but this is how Elon's purchase of Twitter/X began.
It could save D&D if it happens.
It would probably cost a lot less than Twitter did. And it's not just D&D, it's got all sorts of properties that could be saved.
I guarantee this, given what happened with his son, the only Trans you'd ever see in Elon's Hasbro would be the Transformers.
I would think MSNBC would be more likely.
Hasbro owns more IPs than they know what to do with, or even know that they own. The Transformers multiverse, the D&D multiverse, the Magic multiverse, Gamma World, Star Frontiers, Alternity...
It's ridiculous. Hasbro isn't even monetizing a fraction of what they own. In a just world, the IPs they don't care about would enter public domain rather than rotting in obscurity.
Hasbro is sitting on a goldmine of IPs that could compete with pretty much every video game IP that exists. Forget D&D letting you make a competitor to Dragon Age. Kromosome and CyberRave provide a competitor to Cyberpunk 2077, Star Frontiers and Star*Drive provide a competitor to Mass Effect, Urban Arcana provides a competitor to Bloodlines, Gamma World provides a competitor to Fallout...
And instead of monetizing any of that, they hired a former Bioware employee to make an original untested IP that has... *checks notes*... talking bears? Who the fuck is running this company? Seriously, who thought it was a good idea to spend money on an original IP when they already own dozens that haven't been used in decades? I'm surprised they even okayed an original IP when usually these companies are so averse to new IPs. The only way that reasoning makes sense is if they genuinely don't know they own several scifi IPs that haven't been published in decades.
Again, this is ridiculous. If companies aren't monetizing their IPs, then they should lose ownership so that fans can do something with it.
Hasbro owns chunks of the Marvel Universe that Marvel hasn't been able to make use of in decades. Stuff that became foundational elements of the setting. And it's just being let rot. Stuff like Micronauts and Rom Spaceknight.
It was my personal hope that out of this mess Hasbro has become, that Disney would buy them. So they can mine the IPs that have just been left to rot for decades.
So no. Elon Musk buying Hasbro isn't an outcome I would like. Because it would be more of the same. IPs being wasted and going fallow as Hasbro does nothing with them.
What exactly would Elon do with and D&D as a brand/product?
As much as I like him I actually don't care for his business practices (subscription heated seats in his overpriced shitty cars for example, or naming Twitter X...)
So I'm a little worried he goes the full digital route like Hasbro would have gone, just better (meaning more plebs buy it cause it's "good", but forever locks main brand D&D into DRM digital hell)
In truth I don't understand what is the obsession is with main brand given the OSR and better versions of it exist under different names.
same reason people hate watching things or enjoy The Boys I guess? it's the thing to hate or the thing to do I guess?
Quote from: BoxCrayonTales on November 28, 2024, 08:26:33 PMHasbro owns more IPs than they know what to do with, or even know that they own. The Transformers multiverse, the D&D multiverse, the Magic multiverse, Gamma World, Star Frontiers, Alternity...
It's ridiculous. Hasbro isn't even monetizing a fraction of what they own. In a just world, the IPs they don't care about would enter public domain rather than rotting in obscurity.
Hasbro is sitting on a goldmine of IPs that could compete with pretty much every video game IP that exists. Forget D&D letting you make a competitor to Dragon Age. Kromosome and CyberRave provide a competitor to Cyberpunk 2077, Star Frontiers and Star*Drive provide a competitor to Mass Effect, Urban Arcana provides a competitor to Bloodlines, Gamma World provides a competitor to Fallout...
And instead of monetizing any of that, they hired a former Bioware employee to make an original untested IP that has... *checks notes*... talking bears? Who the fuck is running this company? Seriously, who thought it was a good idea to spend money on an original IP when they already own dozens that haven't been used in decades? I'm surprised they even okayed an original IP when usually these companies are so averse to new IPs. The only way that reasoning makes sense is if they genuinely don't know they own several scifi IPs that haven't been published in decades.
Again, this is ridiculous. If companies aren't monetizing their IPs, then they should lose ownership so that fans can do something with it.
It's probably because the shot callers are ideologically driven and they got burned a couple times in the past years. The big complaint about a lot of new stuff from old IPs is that they completely ignore and sometimes slander the old material. The people at Hasbro saw this and learned the wrong lesson. They are unable to honor the spirit of the IP because the old material was *insert category of bigot here*. So, instead, they create new things that are unburdened by what has been. Of course, the problem with the new, corporate driven, IPs is that the creators are probably the kind of people who think brutalist style is the peak of architecture and worship at the altar of the HR department.
Can speak with a small measure of inside knowledge about Hasbro (and a bit more regarding WOTC)...
They are wildly incompetent and have no idea what they're doing at this point with a huge chunk of their IPs and have even actively tried to downplay a number of them. A primary example is GI Joe which Hasbro has been fumbling for decades which could be a goldmine especially since the rise of the FPS as a primary genre of video game.
They are a company lacking in all agility and have no capability to judge their audience. Success within Hasbro is almost always due to the passion of an individual or small team working on an IP...and if it gets too big it invariably leads to company leadership bungling it by having it taken over and mismanaged. Hasbro has also had hilarious damage done to it by the total collapse of Star Wars toys...which is, of course, quite funny since that failure was caused by Star wars own self-inflicted idiotic suicide via 'modern audience syndrome'.
WOTC, meanwhile, has been a dumpsterfire for YEARS. Recent changes to MTG for example including the ludicrous milking of classic cards and now a shift to 100% licensed sets replacing a full half of their set releases is because WOTC and MTG specifically are not doing anywhere near as well as people want to believe (including people internally). WOTC is desperate to make cash because they are drowning in product they can't sell.
WOTC is entirely ideologically captured and has been for quite a while with them running off the people that had genuine talent years ago. They have been coasting by on other peoples work for well over a decade. Internally, they are honestly more of a cult than a company at this point. To them losing money is eternally blamed on 'bigots' and 'hate campaigns' so, and I mean this entirely seriously, they almost seem to enjoy losing money because it allows them to act with righteous indignation at how good they must be because loss of money is directly equated to rejection by fascists. Failure is largely their metric for ideological purity and ideological purity is a bigger success metric for them internally than actual success.
I am not kidding about this. Their internal cope is so twisted and so all-consuming that they interpret all loss of revenue through this lens , justifying it because they are standing up for their progressive beliefs. The company is an insane asylum.
I think that the chances of Elon buying Hasbro have increased because of his "How much is Hasbro?" tweet. Hard to say what exactly he'd do with it. Given Elon's idea of "AI gaming", he'd probably continue with the 3D VTT thing, but I think he'd also show more respect for the printed game, which would get dewokeified.
Quote from: Rhymer88 on November 29, 2024, 02:01:30 AMI think that the chances of Elon buying Hasbro have increased because of his "How much is Hasbro?" tweet. Hard to say what exactly he'd do with it. Given Elon's idea of "AI gaming", he'd probably continue with the 3D VTT thing, but I think he'd also show more respect for the printed game, which would get dewokeified.
Politics is downstream from culture. The freaks of the entertainment industry were pushing trans/DEI crap into the heads of the mentally ill long before major politicians started picking up the cause.
What Hasbro, with all its IPs ostensibly targeted at kids while many are still beloved by adults, is a vehicle for impacting the culture and thereby the politics.
My hunch is Elon wouldn't even need to fire most of WotC, just the thought of working for the 'Right Hand of Orange Hitler' would drive nearly all of them to performative resignations.
Then it's just a matter of bringing in people who genuinely love D&D and Magic and GIJoe and so on.
Yeah, hire people who are actually fans of the IPs and know what Hasbro owns.
Like, they could easily do crossover events to advertise different IPs they own. Make something like Sliders: have Starscream and Thrustinator show up in Sigil and go through various portals searching for Cybertron. Each episode can be used to advertise a different Hasbro IP and gauge interest. In one episode they might fight Strahd from Ravenloft, in another they might fight a horde of klicks and kroaths from Star*Drive, in another they might fight Artificer robots from Bug Hunters... the possibilities are endless.
:( But I don't want to sign up for Twitter/X to play my D&D! And any Cyber D&D will probably gouge the finish of my pretty dining room table! :(
If Elon buys Hasbro, I see the D&D brand getting "Blueskied"--i.e., just like liberals are abandoning x/Twitter and joining BlueSky, I see someone else (like Piazo) getting those.
That may not be a bad thing, though...Twitter/X is now more balanced, and D&D could also become more balanced.
Quote from: Rhymer88 on November 29, 2024, 02:01:30 AMI think that the chances of Elon buying Hasbro have increased because of his "How much is Hasbro?" tweet. Hard to say what exactly he'd do with it. Given Elon's idea of "AI gaming", he'd probably continue with the 3D VTT thing, but I think he'd also show more respect for the printed game, which would get dewokeified.
I have no idea what he'd do, but if that was the course, would it be all that bad? Run with the brand on digital while selling reprints of the good versions of the game as "D&D"? It's not the best that can be done with it, but it's a lot better than anything we've had out of the owners lately.
Hasbro has lost over 50% of its stock valuation since 2019
-$4.64 EPS
they have some valuable IP for sure (G.I. Joe, Star Wars toys, etc.) and there is some value in WOTC
but a lot of their stuff is old and out-of-style.
Any Marvel IPs are declining in value at this point. The film series is exhausted, and the latest offerings have been bad. Generations Y & Z are simply not that interested in Marvel--they have other interests. The comic book line has completely cratered and is a joke at this point
Hasbro is owned by Vanguard, Blackrock, and some others. Doesn't look like anyone controls more than 10%
Musk could assemble a few more investors and do a takeover pretty easily. Get rid of a good 50% of the product offerings and trim the workforce. Bring in new writers, designers, and talent.
and completely revamp D&D
What would be new and in-style? That latest Jaguar ad?
Most of their IPs are fine and barely need any updating for a sane audience.
My advice:
Transformers: do a Beast Wars reboot that takes advantage of the advancements in cg animation. Show the Beast Wars in their full glory. Best of all, there wouldn't be any human characters!
D&D: make a Neverwinter Nights 3 with modding support and custom servers and so on.
GI Joe: play into 80s nostalgia and anemoia. Diverse cast of patriotic muscle studs.
Alternity: put the pdfs back on drivethrurpg, for a start.
Even if he doesnt do much the freakouts ive seen from him even suggesting he'd buy hasbro have been primo entertainment.
Quote from: Gog to Magog on November 28, 2024, 11:58:11 PMCan speak with a small measure of inside knowledge about Hasbro (and a bit more regarding WOTC)...
They are wildly incompetent and have no idea what they're doing at this point with a huge chunk of their IPs and have even actively tried to downplay a number of them. A primary example is GI Joe which Hasbro has been fumbling for decades which could be a goldmine especially since the rise of the FPS as a primary genre of video game.
They are a company lacking in all agility and have no capability to judge their audience. Success within Hasbro is almost always due to the passion of an individual or small team working on an IP...and if it gets too big it invariably leads to company leadership bungling it by having it taken over and mismanaged. Hasbro has also had hilarious damage done to it by the total collapse of Star Wars toys...which is, of course, quite funny since that failure was caused by Star wars own self-inflicted idiotic suicide via 'modern audience syndrome'.
WOTC, meanwhile, has been a dumpsterfire for YEARS. Recent changes to MTG for example including the ludicrous milking of classic cards and now a shift to 100% licensed sets replacing a full half of their set releases is because WOTC and MTG specifically are not doing anywhere near as well as people want to believe (including people internally). WOTC is desperate to make cash because they are drowning in product they can't sell.
WOTC is entirely ideologically captured and has been for quite a while with them running off the people that had genuine talent years ago. They have been coasting by on other peoples work for well over a decade. Internally, they are honestly more of a cult than a company at this point. To them losing money is eternally blamed on 'bigots' and 'hate campaigns' so, and I mean this entirely seriously, they almost seem to enjoy losing money because it allows them to act with righteous indignation at how good they must be because loss of money is directly equated to rejection by fascists. Failure is largely their metric for ideological purity and ideological purity is a bigger success metric for them internally than actual success.
I am not kidding about this. Their internal cope is so twisted and so all-consuming that they interpret all loss of revenue through this lens , justifying it because they are standing up for their progressive beliefs. The company is an insane asylum.
Man, that sounds bleak. While WotC has always been left-liberal, it was no where near what you describe when I worked there. Of course people like me got pushed out a long time ago.
I only care because WotC owns a lot of IPs that it would be a hassle to write substitutes for. We need to reform copyright so that their old abandoned IPs enter public domain.
After Ridley Scott fucked over the Alien franchise with his History Channel bullshit, Verhoven fucked Starship Troopers, Metzen fucked Starcraft, etc etc., the only other bug hunt IP that hasn't been fucked over is... what... TSR's Bug Hunters?
Every single IP eventually gets fucked over and the law disallows fans from fixing things. Entertainment is a giant scam. Abolish copyright for corpos!
I bit the bullet and bought the new Player's handbook since I plan on releasing material for it under my pseudonym. As I imagine the majority of 3rd party folks plan to, since the majority of 5th edition players will migrate to the new system since it's the "new shiny" and they have absolutely no care about politics.
From a mechanical perspective... I truly hate that it's actually good.
I won't get into the weeds of it here... But honestly if Elon did buy it, you wouldn't need to change the current edition in terms of mechanics. It would just be changing it in terms of aesthetics.
Get rid of the safety tool shit and just talk about session zero, put some more adventurous art in, and have some new folks write interesting setting material where Conflict is King. Other than that, the core rules seem to be good.
But honestly I don't think Elon is gonna buy it, I think he's just trolling.
Well I think its an interesting proposition but A few things do bug me about it so I figure I'll throw that line of thinking out in to the light and see what comes of it.
the first thing that comes to my mind is "exactly how much?" of these given IPs does hasbro own ?
Starwars is a good example they own the rights to make the toys but the truth is they are taking marching orders from Disney on a number of points in that area. What about there other IPs what do they own of that ? I can see a lot of road blocks that could very easliy come up and cause issue to any grand plans. I know transformers is another one given that its originally owned by several Japanese firms and have no idea who own exactly what parts of that conglomeration.
The next thought after the who owns what parts of what situation is would Elon be able to run that kind of business ? He's a tech and hard sciences guy I don't know how well he would do running an entertainment company. Also keep in mind that entertainment is one of the places hit hardest if the economy slumps even slightly.
I could go on explaining some of USA particularly USA children's entertainment problems and how part of it is that company's cant do things the way they used to but I'll leave that go for now.
Quote from: Gog to Magog on November 28, 2024, 11:58:11 PMInternally, they are honestly more of a cult than a company at this point.
Ironically that's how they started.
Quote from: Gog to Magog on November 28, 2024, 11:58:11 PMTo them losing money is eternally blamed on 'bigots' and 'hate campaigns' so, and I mean this entirely seriously, they almost seem to enjoy losing money because it allows them to act with righteous indignation at how good they must be because loss of money is directly equated to rejection by fascists. Failure is largely their metric for ideological purity and ideological purity is a bigger success metric for them internally than actual success.
While it makes sense for those who ideologically oppose capitalism to consider financial success a liability, the truth is they'd absolutely point to it as a validation of their ideology if they were.
Quote from: Chris24601 on November 29, 2024, 08:05:30 AMMy hunch is Elon wouldn't even need to fire most of WotC, just the thought of working for the 'Right Hand of Orange Hitler' would drive nearly all of them to performative resignations.
When everyone is guilty by association there's just no other choice. After all if there's just one Nazi at a table...
Quote from: Osman Gazi on November 29, 2024, 10:48:24 AMIf Elon buys Hasbro, I see the D&D brand getting "Blueskied"--i.e., just like liberals are abandoning x/Twitter and joining BlueSky, I see someone else (like Piazo) getting those.
Unlike when D&D 4e went down in flames they're so internally divided at this point that I don't see any alternative getting the majority. Hell they're already eating each other on #Bluesky.
You also can't influence culture and 'own the chuds' with a game your ideological opposition has no interest in, which was the whole reason they infiltrated #Hasbro in the first place.
Ideally they'll retreat to their safe spaces (which are getting smaller by the day because of how they alienate each other) to play the games they like, and we'll get to do the same. However I sadly suspect they're too authoritarian to stop attempting to ban and censor others in communities they're not a part of for long.
Quote from: Rhymer88 on November 29, 2024, 02:01:30 AMI have no idea what he'd do, but if that was the course, would it be all that bad?
All he needs to do is train a few AIs and let passionate and talented creators flex without interference, and I think he can manage that.
Quote from: MerrillWeathermay on November 29, 2024, 11:09:44 AMHasbro has lost over 50% of its stock valuation since 2019
Don't forget the class action suit they're facing because of that.
Quote from: Orphan81 on November 29, 2024, 02:51:33 PMhonestly I don't think Elon is gonna buy it, I think he's just trolling.
Which is exactly
why I think he's serious.
Quote from: M2A0 on November 29, 2024, 02:18:06 PMMan, that sounds bleak. While WotC has always been left-liberal, it was no where near what you describe when I worked there. Of course people like me got pushed out a long time ago.
Indeed. Back in the early 00s it was far FAR more sane (if that is when you are talking about). As was the video game industry (which I was in at the time). Since then, however, there's been a winnowing of sane staff who are pushed out or allowed to leave because they do not meet the ideological purity test.
Quote from: Anon Adderlan on November 30, 2024, 05:02:16 AMWhile it makes sense for those who ideologically oppose capitalism to consider financial success a liability, the truth is they'd absolutely point to it as a validation of their ideology if they were.
Of course. That is how cults operate. If the doomsday prophecy comes true, they are validated. If the doomsday prophecy doesn't come true, why that means that they were so faithful that the whole world was spared! A cult is not allowed to be wrong. It is anathema to the very underpinnings of it. All things must validate the outlook of the cult.
The big thing with the crazy "progressives" is that they cannot be thought of in terms of the political mind. They are not political. Their thought process is religious. Fundamental religious. Once you look at them through the lens of religiosity everything they do and why they behave the way they do makes far more sense.
Quote from: Gog to Magog on November 28, 2024, 11:58:11 PMA primary example is GI Joe which Hasbro has been fumbling for decades which could be a goldmine especially since the rise of the FPS as a primary genre of video game.
Damn. This is the FPS shooter I didn't know I wanted until I just heard the idea for it.
But I wonder if it'd make sense for Elon to just buy Hasbro, sell the IPs off in pieces and keep D&D. I know Hollywood is still pretty much all about existing IPs, even if Marvel has gone stale. And they seem to be running out of old IPs to mine.
Quote from: Dracones on November 30, 2024, 07:08:31 PMDamn. This is the FPS shooter I didn't know I wanted until I just heard the idea for it.
Exactly. GI Joe should have been Overwatch before Overwatch. It has the perfect formula and roster for it...but Hasbro refuses to leverage GI Joe as a brand.
Quote from: Dracones on November 30, 2024, 07:08:31 PMBut I wonder if it'd make sense for Elon to just buy Hasbro, sell the IPs off in pieces and keep D&D. I know Hollywood is still pretty much all about existing IPs, even if Marvel has gone stale. And they seem to be running out of old IPs to mine.
Have they, now?
Let's see what movies they can make:
My Pet Monster, Galaxy Rangers, Dinosaucers, Robotman, Heathcliff, Silverhawks, Galaxy High, Pee Wee's Playhouse, Turbo Teen, Kissyfur, Gummi Bears, Madballs, Mighty Orbots, Meatballs & Spaghetti, The Littles, Army Ants, Barbie & The Rockers, Terrahawks, Strawberry Shortcake, Stella, Dragon's Lair, MUSCLE Things, Hell Town, Small Wonder, Trollkins, The V, Max Headroom, Airwolf, MASK, Spiral Zone, Silver Spoons, Q*Bert, Zybots, Visionaries, BraveStarr, Inhumanoids, Jayce & The Wheeled Warriors, Super Naturals, Captain Power & The Soldiers of the Future, Goldie Gold, Golden Girl, Air Raiders, Crystal Castles, Groo the Wanderer...
And, the girl I was in love in when I was 16: Maxie! (well, teh model who portrayed her in the commercials)
This is just one decade alone, and off the top of my head!
There's tons of IPs that are being ignored. In Hasbro's case, they own the entirety of TSR's back catalog. Instead of reviving Star Frontiers, Star*Drive, or whatever, they decided to immediately spend millions of dollars on latest new original IP Exodus. Which will probably bomb due to its extreme ambition and Hasbro's history of incompetence.
This is precisely why copyright terms need to be shortened to something economically reasonable, like 20 years. At least for abandonware. The way it works now is a fascist suppression of free speech that stifles competition and innovation. Not only are your favorite childhood games abandonware, but scientists and farmers routinely rely on abandonware software that they have no right to repair due to copyright.
We already know from the Burroughs Estate that trademark is plenty sufficient to protect rights after copyright expired.
Quote from: BoxCrayonTales on December 01, 2024, 07:45:31 AMThere's tons of IPs that are being ignored. In Hasbro's case, they own the entirety of TSR's back catalog. Instead of reviving Star Frontiers, Star*Drive, or whatever, they decided to immediately spend millions of dollars on latest new original IP Exodus. Which will probably bomb due to its extreme ambition and Hasbro's history of incompetence.
This is good. This protects Star Frontiers from WotW's stupidity. This is the main RPG that I'm playing, and I'm playing the original, physical edition, the way I live it. (Not to mention that buying the PDFs would mean financially supporting both Drive Thru RPG and Wizards anyway.) Much as I'd like to see SF expanding their frontiers, not under Wizards' regime.
also, I mentioned a bunch of IPs from the 80s that can be made into movies off the top of my head. I mentioned Goldie Gold and Golden Girl, and yet, amazingly, didn't think of The Golden Girls!
Quote from: Cathode Ray on December 01, 2024, 01:50:50 PMQuote from: BoxCrayonTales on December 01, 2024, 07:45:31 AMThere's tons of IPs that are being ignored. In Hasbro's case, they own the entirety of TSR's back catalog. Instead of reviving Star Frontiers, Star*Drive, or whatever, they decided to immediately spend millions of dollars on latest new original IP Exodus. Which will probably bomb due to its extreme ambition and Hasbro's history of incompetence.
This is good. This protects Star Frontiers from WotW's stupidity. This is the main RPG that I'm playing, and I'm playing the original, physical edition, the way I live it. (Not to mention that buying the PDFs would mean financially supporting both Drive Thru RPG and Wizards anyway.) Much as I'd like to see SF expanding their frontiers, not under Wizards' regime.
also, I mentioned a bunch of IPs from the 80s that can be made into movies off the top of my head. I mentioned Goldie Gold and Golden Girl, and yet, amazingly, didn't think of The Golden Girls!
Have you considered making a clone with serial numbers filed off? One Page Rules publishes a 1:1 ripoff of Warhammer without being sued, so you could probably due the same with Star Frontiers. Tweak the races a bit and you should be fine.
Quote from: BoxCrayonTales on November 28, 2024, 08:26:33 PMIt's ridiculous. Hasbro isn't even monetizing a fraction of what they own. In a just world, the IPs they don't care about would enter public domain rather than rotting in obscurity.
Hasbro and wotc have actually lost a few board games and RPGs they acquired because of wotc's ineptitude.
I'm laughing because Hasbro stock price has recently surged based upon just the rumor of Elon Musk buying the company.
https://gamerant.com/hasbro-stock-spike-elon-musk-acquisition-rumor-effect/#:~:text=Hasbro%20stock%20rose%20by%202,original%20creator%20of%20the%20franchise.
Doesn't Hasbro own Milton Bradley's entire catalog? I have yet to see any of the Gamemaster series except Axis & Allies released, and they don't even make the original as far as I can tell. Been trying to find a complete Fortress America for years...
Hasbro owns hundreds of adult, well 12yo and up, historical wargames by Avalon Hill.
Iirc Avalon Hill had purchased quite a bit of their own prior to Hasbro acquisition, including Simulation Publications, Inc, SPI
Some AH games were family type games they got from 3M etc.
Quote from: Brad on December 01, 2024, 10:31:05 PMBeen trying to find a complete Fortress America for years...
I know a guy that owns one. Played it a year or so back. If you're interested, I can ask him if he's willing to sell it.
Exactly. These dumb corpos are holding IPs hostage because of copyright extensions lobbied by Führer Mickey Mouse. Back when copyrights had to be renewed, they were only renewed 15% of the time. We need to roll back the law to that time. Fix the abandonware problem and give the IPs back to the fans who care.
I personally have never heard of any of the Avalon Hill games, but I still believe they should enter public domain so that anyone who does care can preserve, continue and remix them.
Quote from: Brad on December 01, 2024, 10:31:05 PMDoesn't Hasbro own Milton Bradley's entire catalog? I have yet to see any of the Gamemaster series except Axis & Allies released, and they don't even make the original as far as I can tell. Been trying to find a complete Fortress America for years...
I used to work on Avalon Hill stuff; WotC can't figure out who owns what when it comes to the vast, vast majority of the library of IP they inherited when Hasbro moved AH to WotC. It seems like it's a moot point now, since everything AH has been moved to Renegade Games.
Also, most of the old back catalog wouldn't sell enough copies to justify printing them.
Quote from: orbitalair on December 01, 2024, 10:52:26 PMHasbro owns hundreds of adult, well 12yo and up, historical wargames by Avalon Hill.
Iirc Avalon Hill had purchased quite a bit of their own prior to Hasbro acquisition, including Simulation Publications, Inc, SPI
Some AH games were family type games they got from 3M etc.
SPI was bought out by TSR. WotC technically had all those IP's but didn't even know or care. There is a reason TSR killed SPI product in what,? 1985 or 6 iirc. They stopped selling well when RPG's surpassed chit wargames in popularity.
Quote from: M2A0 on December 02, 2024, 09:25:39 AMQuote from: orbitalair on December 01, 2024, 10:52:26 PMHasbro owns hundreds of adult, well 12yo and up, historical wargames by Avalon Hill.
Iirc Avalon Hill had purchased quite a bit of their own prior to Hasbro acquisition, including Simulation Publications, Inc, SPI
Some AH games were family type games they got from 3M etc.
SPI was bought out by TSR. WotC technically had all those IP's but didn't even know or care. There is a reason TSR killed SPI product in what,? 1985 or 6 iirc. They stopped selling well when RPG's surpassed chit wargames in popularity.
Chit wargames are still out there. GMT, Decision, etc. MMP has Advanced Squad Leader, they were smart enough to buy the IP back then. Compass Games makes reprints of old games; fixing errors, updating the artwork. However to me part of the allure is the simple b/w rules, and simple clear art of the older days. Newer is not always better.
And look at NobleKnight games reselling old items for big $.
$280+ for GDW Scorched Earth game when they can find one....and it sells in a couple of days.
Oh well, I'll play the games I have, they will last me the rest of my life.
Remember: the Twitter buyout started as a meme/joke.
Stranger things have happened.
IMO, this would be hilarious. The blue-haired Seattle crowd are shitting their pants.
I wish D&D just entered the public domain, away from both Hasbro & Musk.
Quote from: Dracones on November 30, 2024, 07:08:31 PMBut I wonder if it'd make sense for Elon to just buy Hasbro, sell the IPs off in pieces and keep D&D. I know Hollywood is still pretty much all about existing IPs, even if Marvel has gone stale. And they seem to be running out of old IPs to mine.
D&D isn't the most interesting part of Hasbro- hell, it's not even the most profitable part of WotC. Buying Hasbro and selling off Magic The Gathering would be pretty retarded I think.
Yeah, I don't think Musk should buy Hasbro.
The most valuable thing in Hasbro at the moment is Magic: The Gathering. The rest isn't even close. The problem is that with about half of MTG releases being power-crept Universes Beyond, MTG is absolutely at market saturation, and so you have to pull back to recover. Pulling back means sales losses.
So the smart buyer's decision is to let Hasbro burn to the ground and then consider buying it, not to buy it while it at least has one high value IP at peak extraction.
To be honest, I love 5e, but political controversy matter less to me now. I've started running my own games in my own world only to realize people have been doing it ...forever?
I'm not fan of Hasbro and I've moved away from 5e and DnD Beyond since. My favourite designers are all leaving the company, I don't know who's staying.
I watch QuestingBeast and Prof. DungeonMaster on youtube - I would like to see more of their crafting and OSR videos and less of the Hasbro/Musk/DnDBeyond controversy that feels so click-bait-y.
I for one think Musk should buy Hasbro. I think WoTC's LoTR cards could be re-done without race-swapping. And the art on the cards now feel so photo-shoppy its just so awful compared to old cards.
There's no reason Hasbro or WoTC should be struggling the way they are other than they're being self-sabotaged by the mind virus that has infected them.
Quote from: Osman Gazi on November 29, 2024, 10:48:24 AMIf Elon buys Hasbro, I see the D&D brand getting "Blueskied"--i.e., just like liberals are abandoning x/Twitter and joining BlueSky, I see someone else (like Piazo) getting those.
That may not be a bad thing, though...Twitter/X is now more balanced, and D&D could also become more balanced.
Paizo exists because of a "blue skying" away from 4th edition, I don't know how many of those people came back from pathfinder to D&D 5e, but hardcore paizo fans will probably not be missed much.
Quote from: Banjo Destructo on December 04, 2024, 09:35:02 AMPaizo exists because of a "blue skying" away from 4th edition, I don't know how many of those people came back from pathfinder to D&D 5e, but hardcore paizo fans will probably not be missed much.
How is this any different from those that have gone away from D&D to OSR? I believe that the hardcore OSR fans that don't go back to D&D will probably not be missed muchh either.
Quote from: HappyDaze on December 04, 2024, 10:47:38 AMQuote from: Banjo Destructo on December 04, 2024, 09:35:02 AMPaizo exists because of a "blue skying" away from 4th edition, I don't know how many of those people came back from pathfinder to D&D 5e, but hardcore paizo fans will probably not be missed much.
How is this any different from those that have gone away from D&D to OSR? I believe that the hardcore OSR fans that don't go back to D&D will probably not be missed muchh either.
Greetings!
So, Shadowdark, Dragonslayer, OSE, are all OSR. Are they not D&D? There is also AD&D. All part of the OSR. It seems to me that the OSR is really keeping D&D alive, and expanding, growing, and increasing inspiration and fun in the hobby for everyone. WOTC can thus be seen in many ways as essentially leaving D&D.
The OSR hasn't "Left D&D". The OSR embraces, cherishes, and exalts D&D.
Beyond that, as OSR fans have *Left WOTC*--who is it that is "missing" the OSR people, or *not* missing them? The fat, ugly, blue-haired freaks at WOTC? The Woke fans of NuD&D?
That doesn't seem to be a bad thing to me. It is a positive thing to see, and embrace. Let the Woke Nu-D&D fans gobble up whatever WOTC serves them. It isn't like the OSR people need them, or miss them, in the slightest. It is a helpful and beneficial split within the hobby. This should be embraced and celebrated. Let the Woke freaks wallow in WOTC.
The OSR doesn't need THEM.
Semper Fidelis,
SHARK
The thing about this, and im sure others have thought/said this. Elon does whatever he wants, i think he would remove the cap on all the "troublesome material" orcs, drow, dark sun etc. WHich could be great, in my oppinion, but also, who knows anything could happen.
Not a Musk fan, but something has to change.
I'm so tired of WotC, none of my money is going that direction, ever.
Its a blessing in disguise really because of the other systems weve played in the last year or so. Its kind of the push we needed to have a more varied rpg life.
Long live everything else!
Fascinating to see how Trump Derangement has transferred onto Musk since the election.
Quote from: Ruprecht on December 05, 2024, 09:51:28 PMFascinating to see how Trump Derangement has transferred onto Musk since the election.
It started before he bought Twitter, really. The guy who literally dragged the world kicking and screaming into electric cars should be the God Emperor of the left, but he outed the Twitter collusion everyone knew was there and so he's been the Great Satan ever since.