Pierce,

Now you are misreading me. I was talking about the gameplay. And about you, as a player, being given XP for clever ressource use. Or in other games, being given XP for talking in Character, and not disturbing the GM.

You are talking about the assumptions in the world, and I say: That´s literary critique. And it doesn´t matter if you take a game world or a fat fantasy world, the critique remains the same. So there are people way more fitted critiquing these things than us.
But only we can talk about gameplay!

Pierce, how about opening a new thread, wherein you lay down the basic line of thought you´d take for anylizing this stuff.
Feel free to introduce your class-based-approach.

Sett, I was referring to something else you said earlier, but never mind that.

Re. gameplay vs. "assumptions": well yes, but I agree, you know?

Part of literary studies is the analysis of narrative techniques--not of the protagonists of a story and the "values" they "embody" ("What makes Frodo get out of bed?") but the way that story is narrated. Part of the study of visual art is not just the iconography ("Who's that saint?") but the technique. That is where the meat is.

It's ye olde form and content issue, you know? Gameplay is form, slavery in Greyhawk is content. And I, needless to say, am proud to be a formalist above all.

That said, formalist methods from well-established fields can and should be imported into the study of gameplay.

Re. new thread: No way. You saw what happened. It's just not productive. Wrong audience.

Quote from: SettembriniSo 60% of german gamers aren´t actually playing RPGs?

I beg to differ.

Erm, what freakish RPG has usurped the German market? I haven't been reading magazines for quite a while

Quote from: SosthenesErm, what freakish RPG has usurped the German market? I haven't been reading magazines for quite a while

Nazi LARPing?

Sorry! Couldn't resist!

-clash

"Nossing happened betveen 1933 and 1945! Ve ver all... on vacation!"

Quote from: CalithenaI think that 'narrativism' (Forge) and 'adventure game' (Settembrini) both mean something fairly clear and can be properly used in a not-especially-value-laden way, FWIW.

And if wishes were horses I'd own the Kentucky Derby by now . . .

Quote from: Pierce InverarityPart of the study of visual art is not just the iconography ("Who's that saint?") but the technique. That is where the meat is.

Now, I don't know how half of what you're saying pertains to agendas, biases, etc. in RPGs... I might even fervently object to the validity of comparing RPGs and art, but I have to thank you for this little bit.

Technique is where it's at.

Quote from: beejazzNow, I don't know how half of what you're saying pertains to agendas, biases, etc. in RPGs... I might even fervently object to the validity of comparing RPGs and art, but I have to thank you for this little bit.

Technique is where it's at.

Technique is craft, not art.

-clash

Art... craft... who cares what to call it? Not me. The other day one of my sheep said, "But Sir,* THAT is hardly ART!," and I replied, "Yeah well, I'm perfectly happy to call it 'really cool stuff' instead."

*OK, I made up the "Sir" part.

You have sheep?

Yes. Yes, I do. I am the Good Shepherd.

St. Pierce of the Cudgel.

Isn't Inverarity a Scots name? That would explain it...

-clash,  clan Graham of Montrose

No, Balbinus is the Scot. His dryness makes my cudgel wither to dust.

Quote from: Pierce InverarityYes. Yes, I do. I am the Good Shepherd.

St. Pierce of the Cudgel.

Mmmmm.... sheep... *drools*

I might have to swing by and eat a couple of those later... in some kind of mint yogurt sauce... with pita.

Balbinus only likes you for your sheep, you know...

-clash