Quote from: Broken Twin;1042134I have a love affair with Fantasy Craft, but I'll probably never actually get to take it off my shelf and play a proper game of it. The only complex d20 game people around my area are willing to give the time of day to is Pathfinder.

I got to play in a proper campaign of this once, and it was pretty nice. The character classes are very good at excelling at their particular shtick without being entirely useless in other situations. Your social guy will probably be able to contribute to combat(especially if you take feats related to Stress damage); your mage won't be entirely useless once out of spell points; your fighter will likely have a few useful skills away from combat(especially since the smaller curve means you don't need to pump every skill to the max to get some usefulness out of it); etc. etc. etc. It wasn't less crunchy than other d20 variants, but it was differently crunchy, in a way that addressed most of my issues with the system. I also liked the social system, where a good roll or two wasn't an instant "win," and a bad roll wasn't an instant "lose," but rather they could result in a shift in one or the other direction. And they're not afraid to give you a bit of flying ability with a couple feats' investment(usually tied to your race), which is nice. It's good that they trust the GM to be able to challenge flying characters without having to resort to arbitrary(and often absurd) level adjustment costs.

I'm probably the only one who hasn't asked for a refund on the Spellbound supplement preorder at this point. I know I probably should, but I just can't bring myself to give up hope. I want it that much.

@GeekEclectic: Yeah, I picked up Fantasy Craft not for a lighter d20 system, but for a crunchy d20 system that didn't have all of the problems I had with D&D 3.P. It didn't fix all of them, but it looked like it went a long way. The feat chains were one of my favorite parts, as were the racial crafting options.

Kinda happy I got interested after the Spellbound fiasco. Sounds like a mess that's never gonna get resolved.

Quote from: Broken Twin;1042417@GeekEclectic: Yeah, I picked up Fantasy Craft not for a lighter d20 system, but for a crunchy d20 system that didn't have all of the problems I had with D&D 3.P. It didn't fix all of them, but it looked like it went a long way. The feat chains were one of my favorite parts, as were the racial crafting options.

Oh, absolutely! Feat chains don't go more than 3 deep, and the prerequisites for the feats that have them are reasonable. And they did a good job of making every feat attractive, too. And every feat along the chain offers something good, so if all you want(or can afford) is one or two feats, you're getting good stuff! They may function as stepping stones(prereqs) to something else, but they're also good feats in and of themselves.

QuoteKinda happy I got interested after the Spellbound fiasco. Sounds like a mess that's never gonna get resolved.

There wasn't really a fiasco. They eventually realized the project would take a lot longer, largely due to Fantasy Craft just not selling well enough for them to justify devoting much time to it in lieu of other, far more profitable, products they were working on(like Mistborn), so they offered full refunds to any person with a preorder who asked. End of story.

Quote from: ffilz;1042192I don't currently play, but Arcana Unearthed/Evolved still has a place on my bookshelf.

Frank

This. Also, if it counts, "Beyond the Wall".

Quote from: GeekEclectic;1042491There wasn't really a fiasco. They eventually realized the project would take a lot longer, largely due to Fantasy Craft just not selling well enough for them to justify devoting much time to it in lieu of other, far more profitable, products they were working on(like Mistborn), so they offered full refunds to any person with a preorder who asked. End of story.

Good to know. All of my knowledge of Spellbound is from secondhand accounts, which I'm fully willing to believe have exaggerated the issue.

But damn. Out of all of the games sitting on my bookshelf that I'll likely never get to play, Fantasy Craft probably hits me the hardest. I still think it's the pinnacle of crunchy d20 fantasy, shame it never got the support or playerbase it deserved.

Quote from: ffilz;1042192I don't currently play, but Arcana Unearthed/Evolved still has a place on my bookshelf.

Frank

Tell me about Arcana U/E since I know next to nothing about it. What made it stand out?

Quote from: Le Noir Faineant;1042495This. Also, if it counts, "Beyond the Wall".

I would say that for the purpose fir the thread it falls in the same category as DCC as a game sprung from the OSR. So not really. Good game though.

Quote from: Teodrik;1042515Tell me about Arcana U/E since I know next to nothing about it. What made it stand out?

So I'm not sure it really qualifies for this thread since it IS D&D with a new set of classes...

Really in large it was a new set of classes with some changes in the magic system. Instead of the bog standard fire & forget casters, you have memorization slots and casting slots (so some similarity to 3.x Sorcerors). The casting slots can be split into two casting slots of the next lower level (and split again? I forget) or combined to up power spells or use as the next higher level slot. The net was allowing a bit more flexibility in casting. Also, some spells could be cast using different elements (for example fireball) though this one I found troubling (you could easily cast a "fireball" that likely no one had resistance to, note that a LOT of creatures are resistant or immune to fire). Evolved added racial prestige classes that started to change you physically. I really liked a lot of the new classes.

Frank

Does Fantasy Craft have a book/supplement for designing classes?

Quote from: Steven Mitchell;1042161If I ran 3E again, at all, it would be an Arcana Evolved low-level game.  Some of those classes really worked well in the 3E model.  But like all of 3E, it breaks down very rapidly once you get into the upper end of the mid levels.

I agree. I loved those classes. The Akashic was one of my favorite classes I ever played, in any RPG. Elements of some others seem to have influenced 5e, like Ritual Warrior (which in many ways is a Battlemaster fighter).

Quote from: Tod13;1042527Does Fantasy Craft have a book/supplement for designing classes?

Up on their forums they have broken out most of the formulae for designing Base/Expert/Master classes, as well as Archetypes and Races and creatures. It's pretty comprehensive.

I believe most of these were consolidated on their Mastercraft Wiki

http://crafty-games-fans.wikia.com/wiki/Class_Creation_Guidelines_(Mastercraft)


There is a more comprehensive list (their old rules archive were much easier to parse through)

http://www.crafty-games.com/forum/index.php?topic=8398.0

Quote from: tenbones;1042538Up on their forums they have broken out most of the formulae for designing Base/Expert/Master classes, as well as Archetypes and Races and creatures. It's pretty comprehensive.

I believe most of these were consolidated on their Mastercraft Wiki

http://crafty-games-fans.wikia.com/wiki/Class_Creation_Guidelines_(Mastercraft)


There is a more comprehensive list (their old rules archive were much easier to parse through)

http://www.crafty-games.com/forum/index.php?topic=8398.0

Cool. I tried to find it search but missed it. Thanks! Looks interesting.

I don't see anything similar for feats or magic though.

I'm surprised I never found this while I was looking at different systems!