Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:03:48 PM

So your argument is that it's all a hoax? Barker did not write a pro-SS book published by the biggest Nazi publishing house of its age, and serve years on the board of the biggest holocaust-denial Nazi pseudo-academic journal for years? And the Tekumel Foundation didn't cover it up, and the post of them apologizing for covering it up is also a hoax?

I literally never said that. In fact I'll steel-man you: I BELIEVE IT'S TRUE. My question to you is: SO NOW WHAT?

You're acting as if they're all literal Nazi's. YOU don't know the facts - but again, let's pretend they did know. Are they responsible now for the bad-actions of a guy who wrote a book of fiction about being an Anti-Semite and Anti-Semitic material? Are they guilty by association for their shepherding a foundational part of the TTRPG hobby, because the primary author had these beliefs? Are you privy to the inner-thoughts of Barker as to WHY he's an Anti-Semite?  I'm not excusing it - I'm saying that he IS an Anti-Semite, but I'm more likely to believe it's because of his Muslim indoctrination, (if I had to guess - and yes it's ONLY a guess), but surely you can see that the Tekumel Foundation had very real reasons to not speak about it.

The problem is you're doing what SJW's do and presume the ABSOLUTE WORST in people and passing judgement on them before you have all the facts. And worse you're trying to score virtue signal points to make sure everyone knows you're *anti-Nazi*. Gee... really?

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:03:48 PMOr are you arguing that none of those things matter? And if so is it because you think all those things are good things? Or is it just because you think it's more important to "own the libs" even if it means defending and protecting a literal neo-nazi and the people who profiteered off his work?

I'm arguing that YOU, jeopardize your own position by accepting their framing - look at you, you're already doing it. You do the hurr-hurr "Owning the Libs" - who the fuck does that but them? I don't need to "own" anyone. I don't accept other peoples framing of reality that doesn't have consistency. I'm trying to protect you from yourself.

Because as I pointed out - you make this grandiose and magnimous gesture of of being "Anti-Nazi" but don't get riled up at the implications of your own words.

Which is WHY I told you to stop playing their game - they don't care about this "issue" - because they know you *do*. And if you go down this road, like you are, you're going to alienate yourself and others because this is the hill they want you to die on. And yes - they want you to DIE both figuratively, economically, and likely literally.

The correct response is: Who fucking cares, he's dead. Tekumel rocks. GTFO.

It's only because you want to play their game for reasons I can only guess, that you feel inclined to join with them in the bullshit hand-wringing chorus and pearl-clutching "Oh my, Barker was an anti-semite... however can we trust the Tekumel Foundation? And therefore..." what exactly? You know precisely what comes next because you're already doing it - you find every point where someone takes exception and label them a fucking Nazi/sympathizer etc. etc.

Because that's what they do.


You called my posts to outline these mechanics "hysterics" - yet it worked... and you didn't understand a goddamn thing.

Quote from: hedgehobbit on March 21, 2022, 03:17:42 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 02:41:27 PM

Quote from: hedgehobbit on March 21, 2022, 12:14:13 PMWatching Pundit condemn "real Nazis" is hilarious. His lack of self awareness is staggering.

What the fuck are you actually suggesting? Are you trying to imply Barker isn't a Nazi? Or that SJWs are being honest when they say I am one?

Don't pussyfoot around like a fucking coward, say what you think!

The SJWs are not lying, they believe that you are a literal Nazi. Yet you throw around the exact same accusation and then expect everyone to believe you but not believe them.

And I'm not saying that Barker wasn't a Nazi, I'm just saying that you shouldn't be so quick and eager to make that accusation considering how many have done the same thing to you.

I've provided proof that Barker was a Nazi. The proof is beyond incontrovertible at this point. Anyone pretending that "it could all be a hoax" is either a moron or a Nazi.

Which one are you?

Quote from: hedgehobbit on March 21, 2022, 02:17:12 PM

Quote from: pawsplay on March 21, 2022, 02:11:37 PM
I doubt the Tekumel Foundation makes much money. But people like clout. Sometimes they do bad things to hang onto it. Whether you did it for $1 million or just to be the cool Tekumel guys, there is moral weight to the decision.

There is only "moral weight" if you feel that people are under a moral obligation to immediately inform the internet if they ever find out that someone they know has a wrong thought. I'd rather not live in a world where that is the standard.

Who were they supposed to inform anyway? Should they have put a warning on their webpage? Taken an ad in the New York Times? Notified the RPG Committee? Deleted their account on DriveThruRPG? The fact is that nothing they could have done would have ever been enough.

We're not talking about "people." We are talking about people who decided it was their job to preserve Barker's legacy and promote his work. Well, when you do that, you get the whole enchilada. So they should have been forthcoming with the information as soon as they figured out what the hell to say about it.

Quote from: Omega on March 21, 2022, 03:20:22 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 02:50:20 PM

Quote from: Omega on March 21, 2022, 01:00:36 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 20, 2022, 01:55:01 PM
THEY DID DO SOMETHING WRONG. They distorted history while protecting a Nazi so that they could keep on making money!

Except we do not know that is what happened.

The Tekumel foundation LITERALLY ADMITS that this is exactly what they did.  If that's not enough, that the people accused are admitting it, I'm pretty sure you've just decided that no proof ever would be enough. You could see a literal taping of Barker saying "yeah I wrote it, and I'd write it again" and you'd be saying "that might be a deepfake/how do we know that's the REAL barker and not a lookalike?" etc.

Reading their statement. Then glancing at the book in question... This all reads like they took someones word on it rather than looking for themselves.

WHERE? WHERE DOES IT SEEM TO SAY THAT?? They are LITERALLY talking about their own research. The MANUSCRIPT OF THE BOOK WAS FOUND. The style is incontrovertibly his. THE PEN NAME IS ONE OF HIS ANCESTORS. He WAS ON THE FUCKING BOARD OF THE LARGEST NAZI PSEUDO-ACADEMIC JOURNAL OF ITS TIME.

WHAT FUCKING EVIDENCE IS STILL MISSING YOU FUCKING BUFFOON?!

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:08:30 PMThe problem with all of this is that if Barker had turned out to be a supporter of Al Qaeda instead of a Nazi, you'd be calling for blood. You're just another collectivist, and you are willing to give covering fire to the SS if it helps "your side".  Fuck that.

When have I ever called for blood? I was one of the few people that spoke out against the cancellation of Zak S, even though he has previously attacked me for being "part of the problem", and I was against the cancellation of Judges Guild. I'm just generally anti-cancellation and anti-witch hunt.

Besides, Barker was a convert and converts are almost always more radical. So I wouldn't have been surprised if MAR Barker was pro-Al Qaeda just like I'm not surprised that he's anti-Semitic. Neither of those fact would have affected my belief that none of those things have anything to do with Tekumel or the Tekumel Foundation.

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:22:33 PM
Let's start with how if I would drink a toast to every anti-semite being shot in the face. But you saying "he's an anti-semite" is retarded; you're trying to pretend as if Barker didn't want Jews in his country club or thought there were too many Jews in hollywood, when in fact he wrote a book about exterminating the Jewish people. He wasn't JUST an "anti-semite". He was a Nazi.

So are we banning Tekumel? Put your fucking money where your mouth is. Are you banning Chirine too? He played with Barker for years - clearly he's infected with your magical telepathy. Are you going to ban Talislanta - hugely influenced by Tekumel. Clearly the work of Nazis. Yes - keep playing their game see the interesting ways you too can witch-hunt people.

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:22:33 PMAny community that tolerates people who write fanfic novels about how great and mighty and large-dicked the heroic geniuses of the SS were is NOT "my own community". FUCK ANYONE who supports that, or in fact who supports any kind of racial collectivism.

YOU are the one playing any game the left might be making here. They desperately want to be able to say 'see? the OSR is full of nazis and the proof is how they're defending Barker'.  That's not the reason to condemn Barker though, the reason is because HE WAS A FUCKING NAZI.

But you then, are a Nazi too. Because you play fast and loose with the term. I don't even know what it means TO YOU. Anti-Semites are Nazis? What about Anti-Asians? Are they Nazis? Anti-Blacks? Are they Nazi's? Anti-Gays? Or are you only stipulating Jews?

Go on - keep jumping through the hoops until you come full circle and see what you've become: Them. YOU are them. Precisely NO ONE here is supporting Anti-Semitism, you keep conflating that notion with this desire to be seen as "stridently anti-Nazi" and playing fast and loose with what a Nazi is vs. what it isn't. And that's the whole point. Because wherever you fall on what it isn't is where you get called out on being a racist for not including others in your nifty bullshit term.

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 02:20:39 PMFuck all of you who are more scared of "liberal tactics" than about condemning a turner-diary level Nazi writer.

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:22:33 PM

As you know, I ban anyone who is an open Nazi sympathizer here. What made you think I would now start standing up for the memory of a dead nazi, or for a bunch of profiteering fucks who would rather keep being the gatekeepers of the tekumel community (and whatever pittance of profit that represents) to the point of covering up said Nazism?

I did not believe, and still do not believe, that almost anyone in the OSR is a real neo-nazi. But I have to say that the vigorous desperation some people have shown on this thread to try to PROTECT A NAZI is fucking shocking. Anyone who is doing so is either a fellow Nazi using "but there's some leftists who are condemning this so we should be for it" as cover, or a shit-headed moron collectivist who is exactly the type of cunt that the first guy benefits from.

So then you're saying you know for an absolute fact why they kept it hidden? And it had nothing to do with anything remotely possible other than them being Nazis. Wow this sounds remarkably like Tubesock... (only he had the good graces to not actually claim to know the truth).

And if you want to conflate *everyone* that disagrees with your retarded take on the purpose of this thread which has brought us exactly to this moment BECAUSE OF YOUR CHOICE and call them a Neo-Nazi/sympathizer - then 'Hats the fuck off to Tubesock, he and the RPGNet crew have won.

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:22:33 PMSo which one are you: Nazi, or moronic cunt?

YOU DECIDE, MR. Telepathy. Show me what kind of bitch you really are. You take the easy way out and call me a Cunt and leave me on this forum. Or you ban me as a Nazi and show everyone how fucking stupid you actually are.

I await my martyrdom!

BANNZAAAIIIIIII!!!!!!!!!!

Quote from: tenbones on March 21, 2022, 03:24:18 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:03:48 PM

So your argument is that it's all a hoax? Barker did not write a pro-SS book published by the biggest Nazi publishing house of its age, and serve years on the board of the biggest holocaust-denial Nazi pseudo-academic journal for years? And the Tekumel Foundation didn't cover it up, and the post of them apologizing for covering it up is also a hoax?

I literally never said that. In fact I'll steel-man you: I BELIEVE IT'S TRUE. My question to you is: SO NOW WHAT?

You're acting as if they're all literal Nazi's. YOU don't know the facts -

I DO know the facts. None of the facts are in dispute.

FACT: Barker wrote a fan-fiction novel about the SS being incredible heroes who will come back to take over the world because the aryans are the master race, and go on to exterminate the non-aryan vermin especially the evil jews.

FACT: he also served for years on the board of the most important neo-nazi pseudo-academic journal of its time

FACT: the Tekumel Foundation knew about this for a time period of at least two years and possibly as long as ten years, but kept it covered up because their own clout was more important.

Quote
Are you privy to the inner-thoughts of Barker as to WHY he's an Anti-Semite?  I'm not excusing it - I'm saying that he IS an Anti-Semite, but I'm more likely to believe it's because of his Muslim indoctrination, (if I had to guess - and yes it's ONLY a guess),

I'm pretty sure that the main reason someone would be on the board of a major Nazi journal for years and would write a big book about how dreamy the SS are is because HE WAS A FUCKING NAZI.

Quotebut surely you can see that the Tekumel Foundation had very real reasons to not speak about it.

Yes, their own ongoing profit and personal largesse.

Quote
The problem is you're doing what SJW's do and presume the ABSOLUTE WORST in people and passing judgement on them before you have all the facts. And worse you're trying to score virtue signal points to make sure everyone knows you're *anti-Nazi*. Gee... really?

There is ZERO 'best case scenario' of why someone spends decades of his life involved in Nazi causes, serving on the board of a Nazi journal and writes a masturbatory wank-fantasy about how awesome Nazis are. ZERO.

Quote

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:03:48 PMOr are you arguing that none of those things matter? And if so is it because you think all those things are good things? Or is it just because you think it's more important to "own the libs" even if it means defending and protecting a literal neo-nazi and the people who profiteered off his work?

I'm arguing that YOU, jeopardize your own position by accepting their framing - look at you, you're already doing it. You do the hurr-hurr "Owning the Libs" - who the fuck does that but them? I don't need to "own" anyone. I don't accept other peoples framing of reality that doesn't have consistency. I'm trying to protect you from yourself.

You're either a fucking moron or a collectivist cunt. Either way you don't have the ability to protect anyone.  You are pissing your pants in fear about some imaginary thing that you're willing to embrace Neo-nazis.

Tell me, Einstein: WHAT THE FUCK ARE THE SJWs GOING TO DO??

"The RPGPundit has condemned a fucking Nazi therefore the sjws will..." - COMPLETE THAT SENTENCE TO MY SATISFACTION OR DO NOT POST IN THIS THREAD AGAIN

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:43:25 PM

Tell me, Einstein: WHAT THE FUCK ARE THE SJWs GOING TO DO??

"The RPGPundit has condemned a fucking Nazi therefore the sjws will..." - COMPLETE THAT SENTENCE TO MY SATISFACTION OR DO NOT POST IN THIS THREAD AGAIN

... have succeeded in getting RPGPundit to call his own forum regulars Nazis and or sympathizers at the behest of one of their own as planned and start banning people, or discussion around the intended target.

How'd I do?

Quote from: tenbones on March 21, 2022, 03:38:45 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:22:33 PM
Let's start with how if I would drink a toast to every anti-semite being shot in the face. But you saying "he's an anti-semite" is retarded; you're trying to pretend as if Barker didn't want Jews in his country club or thought there were too many Jews in hollywood, when in fact he wrote a book about exterminating the Jewish people. He wasn't JUST an "anti-semite". He was a Nazi.

So are we banning Tekumel? Put your fucking money where your mouth is. Are you banning Chirine too? He played with Barker for years - clearly he's infected with your magical telepathy. Are you going to ban Talislanta - hugely influenced by Tekumel. Clearly the work of Nazis. Yes - keep playing their game see the interesting ways you too can witch-hunt people.

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:22:33 PMAny community that tolerates people who write fanfic novels about how great and mighty and large-dicked the heroic geniuses of the SS were is NOT "my own community". FUCK ANYONE who supports that, or in fact who supports any kind of racial collectivism.

YOU are the one playing any game the left might be making here. They desperately want to be able to say 'see? the OSR is full of nazis and the proof is how they're defending Barker'.  That's not the reason to condemn Barker though, the reason is because HE WAS A FUCKING NAZI.

But you then, are a Nazi too. Because you play fast and loose with the term. I don't even know what it means TO YOU. Anti-Semites are Nazis? What about Anti-Asians? Are they Nazis? Anti-Blacks? Are they Nazi's? Anti-Gays? Or are you only stipulating Jews?

You don't know what a Nazi is? Congratulations, you're an SJW.

Someone who writes SS jerk-off fanfic and sits on the board of nazi publications IS A NAZI.


Last chance:
"The RPGPundit has condemned a fucking Nazi therefore the sjws will..." - COMPLETE THAT SENTENCE TO MY SATISFACTION OR DO NOT POST IN THIS THREAD AGAIN

Quote from: tenbones on March 21, 2022, 03:47:22 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:43:25 PM

Tell me, Einstein: WHAT THE FUCK ARE THE SJWs GOING TO DO??

"The RPGPundit has condemned a fucking Nazi therefore the sjws will..." - COMPLETE THAT SENTENCE TO MY SATISFACTION OR DO NOT POST IN THIS THREAD AGAIN

... have succeeded in getting RPGPundit to call his own forum regulars Nazis and or sympathizers at the behest of one of their own as planned and start banning people, or discussion around the intended target.

How the fuck does me calling Barker, who was a NAZI, a Nazi get me to call people on my own forum Nazis, unless they're being nazis? Or Sympathizers, unless they're being sympathizers?

Who the fuck needs to simp for the dude who spent decades of his life secretly writing for and assisting Nazi publications?

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:26:44 PM

Quote from: hedgehobbit on March 21, 2022, 03:17:42 PMThe SJWs are not lying, they believe that you are a literal Nazi. Yet you throw around the exact same accusation and then expect everyone to believe you but not believe them.

And I'm not saying that Barker wasn't a Nazi, I'm just saying that you shouldn't be so quick and eager to make that accusation considering how many have done the same thing to you.

I've provided proof that Barker was a Nazi. The proof is beyond incontrovertible at this point. Anyone pretending that "it could all be a hoax" is either a moron or a Nazi.

Which one are you?

You think Barker is a Nazi because he fulfills the criteria that you have for what a Nazi is.

The SJWs believe you are a Nazi because you fulfills the criteria that they have for what a Nazi is.

All I've been saying is that calling someone a Nazi is pointless because the term has different meanings for different people. That fact that you are so completely sure that your definition is incontrovertibly the true definition is what I mean when I say you have a lack of self awareness.

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:50:17 PM

Quote from: tenbones on March 21, 2022, 03:47:22 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:43:25 PM

Tell me, Einstein: WHAT THE FUCK ARE THE SJWs GOING TO DO??

"The RPGPundit has condemned a fucking Nazi therefore the sjws will..." - COMPLETE THAT SENTENCE TO MY SATISFACTION OR DO NOT POST IN THIS THREAD AGAIN

... have succeeded in getting RPGPundit to call his own forum regulars Nazis and or sympathizers at the behest of one of their own as planned and start banning people, or discussion around the intended target.

How the fuck does me calling Barker, who was a NAZI, a Nazi get me to call people on my own forum Nazis, unless they're being nazis? Or Sympathizers, unless they're being sympathizers?

Who the fuck needs to simp for the dude who spent decades of his life secretly writing for and assisting Nazi publications?

Your entire argument is pathetic. It's based on the idea that I'll do things because the SJWs want me to do something. It ignores that I've had an anti-Nazi position on this forum SINCE DAY 1.

So try again, dipshit: what do they accomplish by me standing up for my own principles and taking the shocking position of "nazis bad"?
Because I can definitely see what they gain from manipulating half-globed morons to say "no maybe nazis aren't bad!! not if the left likes them".

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:48:12 PM
Or are you only stipulating Jews?

You don't know what a Nazi is? Congratulations, you're an SJW.

Someone who writes SS jerk-off fanfic and sits on the board of nazi publications IS A NAZI.[/quote]

I literally listed a bunch of people the Nazi's didn't like for a reason. And yet... you're the one calling people *literal* Nazis but only applying it for Anti-Semites. You are the one calling people Nazis for some transitive notion of evil. You are the one doing exactly what they do on RPGNet. Again the whole point of this thread is to ignite YOU on this basis.

Now you're calling me an SJW (which is pretty bad in an of itself). Who here is talking in Good faith? If you wanna Ban me, that's on you, Mr. Free Speech. I'm not a Nazi, I'm not Anti-Semitic. I'm *am* Anti-SJW...

SO if you're gonna ban me - you're doing it for YOUR personal issues.

Pundit hasn't called anyone a Nazi.

Some forum posters seem intent on portraying themselves as Nazi sympathizers. Which is a choice, I guess.

Quote from: hedgehobbit on March 21, 2022, 03:51:25 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on March 21, 2022, 03:26:44 PM

Quote from: hedgehobbit on March 21, 2022, 03:17:42 PMThe SJWs are not lying, they believe that you are a literal Nazi. Yet you throw around the exact same accusation and then expect everyone to believe you but not believe them.

And I'm not saying that Barker wasn't a Nazi, I'm just saying that you shouldn't be so quick and eager to make that accusation considering how many have done the same thing to you.

I've provided proof that Barker was a Nazi. The proof is beyond incontrovertible at this point. Anyone pretending that "it could all be a hoax" is either a moron or a Nazi.

Which one are you?

You think Barker is a Nazi because he fulfills the criteria that you have for what a Nazi is.

The SJWs believe you are a Nazi because you fulfills the criteria that they have for what a Nazi is.

Yes, correct. And someone who isn't retarded could look at those criteria in each case, and judge which one REALLY qualifies for the definition of a Nazi, and thus condemn one while ridiculing the people making the other accusation. Shall we look at the evidence, cretin?

RPGPundit evidence for barker: he was a member of the board of a major Nazi pseudo-academic holocaust-denial publication. He wrote an epic novel about how awesome nazis are and how he wishes nazis would take over the world, which he then published with the biggest Nazi publishing house in America at the time.

SJWs evidence for Pundit: he sometimes says mean words on the internet! He routinely stands up for Israel, but right-wing people standing up for israel doesn't mean they aren't nazis! He likes the US Founding fathers and they were all nazis.


Go on, little boy: look at the evidence of each, and determine which one is a good definition and which is a bad definition. Instead of, you know, saying "well we can't possibly know so WELCOME TO THE HOBBY TO OUR NEW NAZI ALLIES"?