For the curious.

What Serpent Walks is about is a Nazi SS cell that goes into hiding and begins a long term plan to recover and rise. Coming to power in 2049.

Published in 1991 by National Vanguard who are apparently not nice people at all.

Which begs the question. If Barker wrote this. Then why? This seems at odds with his professed beliefs unless I am mission something here.

Are there any actual proof of this?

Well, if Barker was an asshole, too bad for him.

Anyway, I don't see what it have to do with Tekumel.
The world is full of assholes that happens to be good artists or writers. You can buy the game and not the sour closet ideology.

Quote from: Murphy78 on March 18, 2022, 06:38:54 AM
Are there any actual proof of this?

Well, if Barker was an asshole, too bad for him.

Anyway, I don't see what it have to do with Tekumel.
The world is full of assholes that happens to be good artists or writers. You can buy the game and not the sour closet ideology.

So far. No there is no proof. And the foundation saying he did write it is not proof.

What we have is some some unusual connections, and claimed connections. But nothing concrete. Just some hoop-jumping to connect the name of the author to Barker. And claimed the style and ideals match. But do they? Also the anti-semetic elements in the book make sense considering who the characters are. If you are writing a story about Nazis or descendants of. Then of course they are going to say alot of unpleasant things most likely.

I can see why the publishers picked it up. Considering who they are. But all that means is that a neo-Nazi group liked the book enough to publish it.

This things a cypher. And since its the SJW cult trumping out the 'proof' the accusations become very suspect. But the connections really are funky enough that it is anyones guess at this point.

Quote from: amacris on March 17, 2022, 10:05:04 PM
Oh, wow. That's...that, then.

I guess I could have saved myself an hour of Google.

At least you provided a detailed break down.

This sounds pretty damning and even the foundation is saying it's so. Good thing I never became a fan of Tekumel, I guess.

Quote from: Omega on March 18, 2022, 04:38:04 AM
This seems at odds with his professed beliefs unless I am mission something here.

This (kind of statement) to me is the weirdest thing - what are those professed beliefs of MAR that are incompatible with Neo-Nazism? The real Nazis always had a very high regard for Islam; Himmler regarded Islam as much superior to Christianity. Islam has often been a vehicle for anti-Semitic (anti-Jewish) beliefs.

Anyway, if Judges Guild is Red because of the founder's son's trailer park racist sh*tposting, I don't see how Tekumel can not be put in Red also. This seems to me more like a Varg Vikernes type situation of an actual Neo-Nazi-authored RPG.

Quote from: Omega on March 18, 2022, 07:14:07 AM

Quote from: Murphy78 on March 18, 2022, 06:38:54 AM
Are there any actual proof of this?

Well, if Barker was an asshole, too bad for him.

Anyway, I don't see what it have to do with Tekumel.
The world is full of assholes that happens to be good artists or writers. You can buy the game and not the sour closet ideology.

So far. No there is no proof. And the foundation saying he did write it is not proof.

What we have is some some unusual connections, and claimed connections. But nothing concrete. Just some hoop-jumping to connect the name of the author to Barker. And claimed the style and ideals match. But do they? Also the anti-semetic elements in the book make sense considering who the characters are. If you are writing a story about Nazis or descendants of. Then of course they are going to say alot of unpleasant things most likely.

I can see why the publishers picked it up. Considering who they are. But all that means is that a neo-Nazi group liked the book enough to publish it.

This things a cypher. And since its the SJW cult trumping out the 'proof' the accusations become very suspect. But the connections really are funky enough that it is anyones guess at this point.

Yeah, most of what we have are claims. The problem is that a lot of those claims sound credible and are coming straight from his foundation, which doesn't benefit from making these claims, and in fact apparently sat on them for at least a decade before bringing it to public light. Supposedly one of his archivists even found the book's manuscript among his things.

Of course the SJW cult is going to be all over this. Problem is they aren't the only ones saying it's true.

Quote from: Omega on March 18, 2022, 04:38:04 AM
For the curious.

What Serpent Walks is about is a Nazi SS cell that goes into hiding and begins a long term plan to recover and rise. Coming to power in 2049.

Published in 1991 by National Vanguard who are apparently not nice people at all.

Which begs the question. If Barker wrote this. Then why? This seems at odds with his professed beliefs unless I am mission something here.

Sounds like Marvel's HYDRA.

Quote from: S'mon on March 18, 2022, 07:28:10 AMAnyway, if Judges Guild is Red because of the founder's son's trailer park racist sh*tposting, I don't see how Tekumel can not be put in Red also.

And putting Judges Guild on the red list was a mistake as well. This list has just turned into a generic wrongthinker list.

If we are going to put every company on the list if any of their employees, contractors, or owners says anything at any point in their lives that can be construed as racist, sexist, homophobic, transphobic, anti-Semitic, and whatever new istaphobia they invent in 2022, then you might as well put every company on the red list and save yourself some time.

Unless there was more than one Holocaust-denying Professor Philip Barker from Minneapolis, our boy also sat on the editorial board of a Holocaust-denying periodical for thirteen years.



Probably just a big coincidence, though, right guys?

Quote from: S'mon on March 18, 2022, 07:28:10 AM

Anyway, if Judges Guild is Red because of the founder's son's trailer park racist sh*tposting, I don't see how Tekumel can not be put in Red also. This seems to me more like a Varg Vikernes type situation of an actual Neo-Nazi-authored RPG.

The planet where the colonists (and the setting) are descended from Central American and Persian stock?  The planet where someone with blue eyes is considered cursed by the gods?  That one?  Color me skeptical. 

The "List" is stupid. I've come full circle on it. Play what you want. Buy what you want.

Quote from: Jaeger on March 17, 2022, 07:35:50 PM
Unless I'm grossly mistaken M.A.R. Baker has been dead for years.

Can't get more cancelled than that.

But it's never too late to beat a dead horse.

I'm sure places like Drive-thru, and the various websites carrying on and profiting from his work will pull it all down just like they did for all material related to H.P. Lovecraft's Mythos...

Yep.  Just like I can never find anything by MZ Bradley (Deceased), or the Eddings (also RIP).  AAMOF, I can't find anything by Rowling or OS Card either.  Rushdie (donno his current body temperature)?   
(The following link is aimed at the Outrage Brigade, not @Jaeger)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=mv09BwHGayM

Quote from: Crawford Tillinghast on March 18, 2022, 11:51:35 AM

Quote from: Jaeger on March 17, 2022, 07:35:50 PM
Unless I'm grossly mistaken M.A.R. Baker has been dead for years.

Can't get more cancelled than that.

But it's never too late to beat a dead horse.

I'm sure places like Drive-thru, and the various websites carrying on and profiting from his work will pull it all down just like they did for all material related to H.P. Lovecraft's Mythos...

Yep.  Just like I can never find anything by MZ Bradley (Deceased), or the Eddings (also RIP).  AAMOF, I can't find anything by Rowling or OS Card either.  Rushdie (donno his current body temperature)?   
(The following link is aimed at the Outrage Brigade, not @Jaeger)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=mv09BwHGayM

Was Eddings non-woke? I hadn't heard anything about his sociopolitical views (and the guy's dead, so it's a little late to complain).

I know the wokeists have been half-assedly trying to beat on HPL for a while, but I suspect it's been somewhat hampered by the very real prospect that the guy was honest-to-God mentally ill, not just 'I hate anyone with a skin tone darker than milk'.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on March 18, 2022, 12:08:55 PM

Quote from: Crawford Tillinghast on March 18, 2022, 11:51:35 AM

Quote from: Jaeger on March 17, 2022, 07:35:50 PM
Unless I'm grossly mistaken M.A.R. Baker has been dead for years.

Can't get more cancelled than that.

But it's never too late to beat a dead horse.

I'm sure places like Drive-thru, and the various websites carrying on and profiting from his work will pull it all down just like they did for all material related to H.P. Lovecraft's Mythos...

Yep.  Just like I can never find anything by MZ Bradley (Deceased), or the Eddings (also RIP).  AAMOF, I can't find anything by Rowling or OS Card either.  Rushdie (donno his current body temperature)?   
(The following link is aimed at the Outrage Brigade, not @Jaeger)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=mv09BwHGayM

Was Eddings non-woke? I hadn't heard anything about his sociopolitical views (and the guy's dead, so it's a little late to complain).

I know the wokeists have been half-assedly trying to beat on HPL for a while, but I suspect it's been somewhat hampered by the very real prospect that the guy was honest-to-God mentally ill, not just 'I hate anyone with a skin tone darker than milk'.

Don't know the truth of the story, but the Eddings were accused of having a foster child or adoptee taken back by Social Services.

Lovecraft is ...complicated.  The man had a horrible childhood, and probably never recovered from the shocks.  From the description by people who knew him, I see him as a slightly more charismatic Sheldon Cooper.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on March 18, 2022, 12:08:55 PM


Was Eddings non-woke? I hadn't heard anything about his sociopolitical views (and the guy's dead, so it's a little late to complain).

I know the wokeists have been half-assedly trying to beat on HPL for a while, but I suspect it's been somewhat hampered by the very real prospect that the guy was honest-to-God mentally ill, not just 'I hate anyone with a skin tone darker than milk'.

Eddings did a stint for child abuse.

As for Barker - I'm not sure what to think. The foundation admitted to the neo-nazi book years after they knew about it. That looks suspicious.