The new �#dnd5e� �#onednd� DMG brings back the Greyhawk setting to �#dnd� but it's clearly not written by fans. But don't worry it definitely does have DEI approval!
At least they haven't shit on Dark Sun, yet...........
Quote from: RPGPundit on November 08, 2024, 06:23:15 PMThe new �#dnd5e� �#onednd� DMG brings back the Greyhawk setting to �#dnd� but it's clearly not written by fans. But don't worry it definitely does have DEI approval!
Everything about new D&D favors DEI over canon. The people making the game surely hate most of the fan base.
Quote from: Man at Arms on November 08, 2024, 06:26:14 PMAt least they haven't shit on Dark Sun, yet...........
Dark Sun and Mystara seem to be the only two settings safe from intervention by WotC
Only because Dark Sun is so 80s metal that WotC is afraid to even remotely touch it without a top to bottom rewrite that would just make fans of the setting not buy it, and they seem to realize that. You can't stick a few token trannies into Dark Sun to "fix" it like they've been trying with the other settings.
Like I said before. Sweet Baby Inc. worked for WotC to do the DEI stuff. Their fingerprints are all over this new version of D&D. And the Gygax hate book. All of it is straight out of their playbook.
I wouldn't recommend the 2024 DMG for the Greyhawk content alone, but if you're already buying the book and don't already know (or are willing to forget) the original Greyhawk, then it provides a fine primer for an alternate take on a classic setting.
Quote from: HappyDaze on November 08, 2024, 11:59:14 PMI wouldn't recommend the 2024 DMG for the Greyhawk content alone, but if you're already buying the book and don't already know (or are willing to forget) the original Greyhawk, then it provides a fine primer for an alternate take on a classic setting.
It may be safer to say, that the book includes a nice setting map. Just as the new Planescape box set, includes a nice setting map. Those new maps, end up being expensive.
Quote from: Valatar on November 08, 2024, 09:34:24 PMOnly because Dark Sun is so 80s metal that WotC is afraid to even remotely touch it without a top to bottom rewrite that would just make fans of the setting not buy it, and they seem to realize that. You can't stick a few token trannies into Dark Sun to "fix" it like they've been trying with the other settings.
Slavery is a part of life, in core Dark Sun. That may keep them, from ever revisiting it. If they ever do, they will crap all over it.
The truth is, I prefer to enjoy Dark Sun without that mess. Dark Sun has more to offer, than that. You can't take resources for granted, in Dark Sun. Many different ways, to bite the dust.
Quote from: RPGPundit on November 08, 2024, 09:08:00 PMQuote from: Man at Arms on November 08, 2024, 06:26:14 PMAt least they haven't shit on Dark Sun, yet...........
Dark Sun and Mystara seem to be the only two settings safe from intervention by WotC
So far.
They could totally wreck it in the name of "social justice". Mystara they could decide to ruin simply because Arneson was partially connected to it and all the original creators of D&D are of course horrible white males according to wotc.
The likely only reason they have not yet is they were too busy prepping fake 5e.
Al Qadim and Oriental Adventures are two more they could go after. And of course Gamma World. Though I can not imagine them fucking it up more than they did with the version using 4e D&D.
Quote from: Valatar on November 08, 2024, 09:34:24 PMOnly because Dark Sun is so 80s metal that WotC is afraid to even remotely touch it without a top to bottom rewrite that would just make fans of the setting not buy it, and they seem to realize that. You can't stick a few token trannies into Dark Sun to "fix" it like they've been trying with the other settings.
You think that would stop them? Its not stopped anyone from completely fucking up every IP they can lay hands on. In fact that would be MORE incentive to fuck it up.
Dark Sun: Water World!
Mystara gets a fairly extensive section in the new Worlds & Realms coffee table book.
There's been noise about doing something with Dark Sun as well, but it seems to be running into the fact that it's very 'problematic.'
The TSR setting I'd say is safest from WotC interference is Birthright, especially since it's the first one they killed, back in 1998. :)
Surprised they go for Mystara and lean into a few non-western regions as the focus.
Probably consider them all cultural appropriation or something.
I have a very progressive family and they happen to like all of the strange races in 5E, so I look at that content through a different lens than many others do. If it was just me I would stick with the original material as presented in my old 1980 Greyhawk Folio, but my family likes the "Mos Eisley" feel of modern D&D and the remaking of Greyhawk into that feel will be a plus as far as my table is concerned. I'm thinking of running a Greyhawk campaign for my group and will probably pattern it from the 2024 DMG rather than 1980 folio.
I do miss the good old days, however.
Quote from: Darrin Kelley on November 08, 2024, 10:36:38 PMLike I said before. Sweet Baby Inc. worked for WotC to do the DEI stuff. Their fingerprints are all over this new version of D&D. And the Gygax hate book. All of it is straight out of their playbook.
Just look at the credits of the new PHB. The section once full of Grub, Pundit, Zak, etc is now 1/2 VTT peeps, and 1/2 DEI consultants.
Quote from: Man at Arms on November 09, 2024, 02:00:18 AMQuote from: Valatar on November 08, 2024, 09:34:24 PMOnly because Dark Sun is so 80s metal that WotC is afraid to even remotely touch it without a top to bottom rewrite that would just make fans of the setting not buy it, and they seem to realize that. You can't stick a few token trannies into Dark Sun to "fix" it like they've been trying with the other settings.
Slavery is a part of life, in core Dark Sun. That may keep them, from ever revisiting it. If they ever do, they will crap all over it.
The truth is, I prefer to enjoy Dark Sun without that mess. Dark Sun has more to offer, than that. You can't take resources for granted, in Dark Sun. Many different ways, to bite the dust.
Slavery used to be part of life in the Pomarj, yet here we are after the Orcs got deported to the mesa lands of; idk the Bright Desert.
Quote from: Omega on November 09, 2024, 08:16:37 AMQuote from: RPGPundit on November 08, 2024, 09:08:00 PMQuote from: Man at Arms on November 08, 2024, 06:26:14 PMAt least they haven't shit on Dark Sun, yet...........
Dark Sun and Mystara seem to be the only two settings safe from intervention by WotC
So far.
They could totally wreck it in the name of "social justice". Mystara they could decide to ruin simply because Arneson was partially connected to it and all the original creators of D&D are of course horrible white males according to wotc.
The likely only reason they have not yet is they were too busy prepping fake 5e.
Al Qadim and Oriental Adventures are two more they could go after. And of course Gamma World. Though I can not imagine them fucking it up more than they did with the version using 4e D&D.
The people running the game are so far removed from pre-WotC D&D that outside of a handful of people like Perkins, I'm sure they are in perpetual ignorance of the fact they even own the Mystara IP.
Quote from: Omega on November 09, 2024, 08:16:37 AMQuote from: RPGPundit on November 08, 2024, 09:08:00 PMQuote from: Man at Arms on November 08, 2024, 06:26:14 PMAt least they haven't shit on Dark Sun, yet...........
Dark Sun and Mystara seem to be the only two settings safe from intervention by WotC
So far.
They could totally wreck it in the name of "social justice". Mystara they could decide to ruin simply because Arneson was partially connected to it and all the original creators of D&D are of course horrible white males according to wotc.
The likely only reason they have not yet is they were too busy prepping fake 5e.
Al Qadim and Oriental Adventures are two more they could go after. And of course Gamma World. Though I can not imagine them fucking it up more than they did with the version using 4e D&D.
Prior to Lancer, Gamma World was the best iteration of the 4E Engine. The primary gripe about it was the collectible card aspect.
In fact, every modified version of 4E (Essentials, & the 3 board games: Ravenloft-Drizzt-Ashardalon) were better than actual 4th Edition D&D.
Quote from: M2A0 on November 09, 2024, 12:06:58 PMJust look at the credits of the new PHB. The section once full of Grub, Pundit, Zak, etc is now 1/2 VTT peeps, and 1/2 DEI consultants.
Do a background check on the DEI people on the internet. See who they work for.
As I didn't have time to watch the video, would anyone be willing to highlight the biggest changes here? (Let it be stipulated that "Do it yourself, lazy ass" is a perfectly justified response and need not be repeated.)
Quote from: Omega on November 09, 2024, 08:16:37 AMAl Qadim and Oriental Adventures are two more they could go after. And of course Gamma World. Though I can not imagine them fucking it up more than they did with the version using 4e D&D.
Under the progressive paradigm, they only way they can publish an Al Qadim setting is if they can have it written exclusively by Arab writers. There might be no demographic less interested in tabletop roleplaying than Arabs, so I don't know if they could even find people to write it.
Was Oriental Adventures ever really a setting? I understood it to just be a collection of Eastern-themed classes/races/monsters as a supplement to add into your games.
Quote from: ForgottenF on November 10, 2024, 08:02:08 PMQuote from: Omega on November 09, 2024, 08:16:37 AMAl Qadim and Oriental Adventures are two more they could go after. And of course Gamma World. Though I can not imagine them fucking it up more than they did with the version using 4e D&D.
Under the progressive paradigm, they only way they can publish an Al Qadim setting is if they can have it written exclusively by Arab writers. There might be no demographic less interested in tabletop roleplaying than Arabs, so I don't know if they could even find people to write it.
Was Oriental Adventures ever really a setting? I understood it to just be a collection of Eastern-themed classes/races/monsters as a supplement to add into your games.
Iirc the setting is Karatur and like Al Qadim iirc it either always was or was retconned to a region in the Forgotten Realms
Quote from: Slambo on November 10, 2024, 08:26:55 PMQuote from: ForgottenF on November 10, 2024, 08:02:08 PMQuote from: Omega on November 09, 2024, 08:16:37 AMAl Qadim and Oriental Adventures are two more they could go after. And of course Gamma World. Though I can not imagine them fucking it up more than they did with the version using 4e D&D.
Under the progressive paradigm, they only way they can publish an Al Qadim setting is if they can have it written exclusively by Arab writers. There might be no demographic less interested in tabletop roleplaying than Arabs, so I don't know if they could even find people to write it.
Was Oriental Adventures ever really a setting? I understood it to just be a collection of Eastern-themed classes/races/monsters as a supplement to add into your games.
Iirc the setting is Karatur and like Al Qadim iirc it either always was or was retconned to a region in the Forgotten Realms
Yep. Kara-tur was the setting in OA. Dont think ot got a map till the box set though.
Quote from: ForgottenF on November 10, 2024, 08:02:08 PMUnder the progressive paradigm, they only way they can publish an Al Qadim setting is if they can have it written exclusively by Arab writers. There might be no demographic less interested in tabletop roleplaying than Arabs, so I don't know if they could even find people to write it.
Nah, its only "cultural appropriation" when soneone else does it. wotc could use an all white female writing team and declare themselves ever so progressive.
Quote from: Omega on November 11, 2024, 03:07:48 AMNah, its only "cultural appropriation" when soneone else does it. wotc could use an all white female writing team and declare themselves ever so progressive.
You just get a Diversity Consultant POC to give it their blessing, while the actual work is done by Anglos and/or east-Asians.
Quote from: RPGPundit on November 08, 2024, 09:08:00 PMQuote from: Man at Arms on November 08, 2024, 06:26:14 PMAt least they haven't shit on Dark Sun, yet...........
Dark Sun and Mystara seem to be the only two settings safe from intervention by WotC
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smyRYVzB_jQ&t=1782s
Kyle Brink: "I'll be frank here, the Dark Sun setting is problematic. In a lot of ways, um, and that's the main reason we haven't come back to it. We know it's got a huge fan following."
This is the same retard that told us that we can't leave soon enough for this hobby (the fact that he
may have been referring to white men in positions of power at WotC [versus white guys in general as players and contributors to TTRPGs] doesn't make it not severely anti-white and anti-male). He's also no longer working at WotC (unlikely to be because of these statements or anything related to his disgusting political positions), so it's possible that WotC
will return to Dark Sun, for the purpose of shitting on it.
Note also that in Spelljammer they created a space where some of the Athasian monsters and such are, and implied (but did not state) that all of Dark Sun had been blown up or otherwise destroyed. Clearly, someone working in there desperately wanted to "officially erase" Dark Sun, you know, to "own the chuds", and were restrained from someone wiser (or at least less fucking retarded) above said destructo-author in the pecking order.
So it's definitely possible that they come back to take a streamy creamy shit all over Dark Sun. But hopefully they just go create more new forgettable shit instead.
If WotC ever come back to Dark Sun it will be to push a green agenda and use it as a lesson in eco awareness.
Quote from: Skullking on November 12, 2024, 07:59:53 AMIf WotC ever come back to Dark Sun it will be to push a green agenda and use it as a lesson in eco awareness.
Dark Sun already was a lesson in eco awareness. The destruction of the world by defilers/defiling magic is a huge part of the setting.
That may be so, but it will be front and centre, the only allowable PC options will be opposed to this and there will be clear allusions to modern day politics. Expect an orange skinned Sorcerer King and an eco halfling whose catch phrase is "how dare you?"
Quote from: Skullking on November 12, 2024, 10:02:02 AMThat may be so, but it will be front and centre, the only allowable PC options will be opposed to this and there will be clear allusions to modern day politics. Expect an orange skinned Sorcerer King and an eco halfling whose catch phrase is "how dare you?"
I doubt that.
Quote from: HappyDaze on November 12, 2024, 01:42:24 PMQuote from: Skullking on November 12, 2024, 10:02:02 AMThat may be so, but it will be front and centre, the only allowable PC options will be opposed to this and there will be clear allusions to modern day politics. Expect an orange skinned Sorcerer King and an eco halfling whose catch phrase is "how dare you?"
I doubt that.
It was a good joke. Especially the halfling Greta "You have stolen my dreams!" Thunberg.
Quote from: S'mon on November 12, 2024, 01:44:03 PMQuote from: HappyDaze on November 12, 2024, 01:42:24 PMQuote from: Skullking on November 12, 2024, 10:02:02 AMThat may be so, but it will be front and centre, the only allowable PC options will be opposed to this and there will be clear allusions to modern day politics. Expect an orange skinned Sorcerer King and an eco halfling whose catch phrase is "how dare you?"
I doubt that.
It was a good joke. Especially the halfling Greta "You have stolen my dreams!" Thunberg.
A better joke might have included Templars marching with tiki torches or "mostly peaceful" slave revolts.
Quote from: HappyDaze on November 12, 2024, 01:47:17 PMA better joke might have included Templars marching with tiki torches or "mostly peaceful" slave revolts.
Those are not Environmentally themed, so no, not really.
Quote from: HappyDaze on November 12, 2024, 01:42:24 PMQuote from: Skullking on November 12, 2024, 10:02:02 AMThat may be so, but it will be front and centre, the only allowable PC options will be opposed to this and there will be clear allusions to modern day politics. Expect an orange skinned Sorcerer King and an eco halfling whose catch phrase is "how dare you?"
I doubt that.
Never underestimate wotc's stupidity.
But yeah. Dark Sun was very 90s eco warning in its background. But in actual play it was barely touched on as the world was at that point past the point of no return.
Least till later editions started to re-green Athas.