Quote from: David Johansen on April 04, 2023, 11:58:37 PM
I honestly don't know who they think their customers are.

Crazy people.

Quote from: GhostNinja on April 05, 2023, 08:44:24 AM
Is WOTC trying to see just how dumb they can get? Or are they trying to tank the new version of D&D?

This is the return, yet again of the corporate belief that the customers are mindless cattle.

D&D has to be dumbed down, made simpler to appeal to the lowest common denominator because they keep listening to people who apparently flunked kindergarten and cannot add 10+2.

Quote from: Omega on April 05, 2023, 12:07:30 PM

Quote from: David Johansen on April 04, 2023, 11:58:37 PM
I honestly don't know who they think their customers are.

Crazy people.

It is a rapidly expanding market.

Q. What do Wizards of the Coast, the Ku Klux Klan, and Nazis have in common?
A. They are all anti-miscegenation.

Greetings!

*Laughing* No more "Half Races"? WOTC says because such a concept is inherently racist?

That "STUPID TRAIN" just keeps on rolling!

I have most of the 5E books. I have various OSR books and game systems.

It feels kind of sad, but also INVIGORATING to severe the consumer relationship with WOTC. I love D&D, and have been a fan and gamer for decades now. I will continue to be a fan and gamer, playing D&D. However, whether I am running 5E games or OSR games, I'm done being a consumer and customer of WOTC.

"Orcs are black! Old game editions are filled with Misogyny and Huwhite supremacy, and racism!"

"We are reviewing the current crop of books and editing them to make them safer for everyone and more compliant and kneeling to rabid BLM and rainbow trans hippo activists, and wild-eyed Feminist harridans, all wrapped up in Marxist new speak, but these changes are all for the greater good!"

And on, and on, and on. It never stops, and everything with WOTC just gets absolutely *stupider*. That *STUPID TRAIN* just keeps on rolling. I have gotten off that train. I'm no longer a passenger. They can drive the stupid train off a cliff and straight down into a cesspool. Good! Burn it all the fuck down!

Sad. Ah, well. I odn't care about WOTC anymore. They, and anything they do--or don't do--just isn't relevant anymore. I'm not on that "Edition Train" anymore. As I said,it is a refreshing, and invigorating kind of feeling. I recommend such a choice to all gamers and fans of D&D. Leave WOTC, leave them in the dust of your rearview mirror, and join the OSR. Even keep old 5E. It's all good. Just leave WOTC. Your sanity and peace of mind will thank you.

The Smoking Lamp is lit!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: Brigman on April 05, 2023, 11:46:07 AM
Unsurprisingly, I don't think they've thought this through.

No more "Half" races?  OK.  So no more Half-Elves, Half-Orcs, Half-Giants...

I guess that means they're getting rid of Tieflings and Aasimar then?  They're "half" human and "half" demonic/angelic, respectively...

That ought to go over well. >_<

They specifically mentioned they're keeping teiflings.

Quote from: Omega on April 05, 2023, 12:12:26 PM
This is the return, yet again of the corporate belief that the customers are mindless cattle.

D&D has to be dumbed down, made simpler to appeal to the lowest common denominator because they keep listening to people who apparently flunked kindergarten and cannot add 10+2.

Hopefully they will catch on before its too late and they don't destroy everything.

But I doubt it.

It's funny. I'd just been pondering and resolved my issues with half-races in my own D&D setting. I have a thread on it still active:

https://www.therpgsite.com/pen-paper-roleplaying-games-rpgs-discussion/half-races-and-tolkien/

The stated reason is "they're racist" -- but I think the real reason is that half-elves and half-orcs open up a bunch of inter-racial relation questions that are tricky to answer. Rather than find answers, it's easier to eliminate them and thus avoid such questions. It's the corporate approach to issues.

I think of it like how adaptations often deal with non-white characters in older works -- by cutting out the character. i.e. cut Esmeralda from Tarzan, or cut Ebony from The Spirit, cut Sunflower from Fantasia, etc. They eliminate racism by eliminating the non-white characters so the question is less visible.


EDITED TO ADD: To clarify, the tricky question raised by half-elf and half-orc is why are those the only two combinations allowed? If such interrelations are possible, why aren't there all sorts of other half races?

Quote from: jhkim on April 05, 2023, 01:38:42 PM
I think of it like how adaptations often deal with non-white characters in older works -- by cutting out the character. i.e. cut Esmeralda from Tarzan, or cut Ebony from The Spirit, cut Sunflower from Fantasia, etc. They eliminate racism by eliminating the non-white characters so the question is less visible.

Good point. I think I've seen at least two Western-themed games written by woke scolds. Guess how they treated the whole Native American awkwardness? By eliminating Native Americas from the setting or regulating them to sanitized background!

Quote from: jhkim on April 05, 2023, 01:38:42 PM
It's funny. I'd just been pondering and resolved my issues with half-races in my own D&D setting. I have a thread on it still active:

https://www.therpgsite.com/pen-paper-roleplaying-games-rpgs-discussion/half-races-and-tolkien/

The stated reason is "they're racist" -- but I think the real reason is that half-elves and half-orcs open up a bunch of inter-racial relation questions that are tricky to answer. Rather than find answers, it's easier to eliminate them and thus avoid such questions. It's the corporate approach to issues.

I think of it like how adaptations often deal with non-white characters in older works -- by cutting out the character. i.e. cut Esmeralda from Tarzan, or cut Ebony from The Spirit, cut Sunflower from Fantasia, etc. They eliminate racism by eliminating the non-white characters so the question is less visible.

There's been lots of articles in the leftist MSM AGAINST interracial relationships, just an example:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/29/style/modern-love-race-i-broke-up-with-her-because-shes-white.html

Inter-racial relation questions aren't hard to answer:

If in your world Orcs, Elves, etc hate each other then half-anything will face racism from both sides.

If in your world everybody gets along and sings cumbaya they wont.

There's a lot of other possibilities in-between.

If your world looks like the first option it DOESN'T make you a racist (Contrary to what leftism teaches you).

Given that we KNOW the woke ARE a bunch of anti-miscegenation racists are we to assume this change isn't inspired by that?

Greetings!

The whoe argument against having "Half Races" in a campaign is just pure BS. It is all ideological nonsense pushed by Libtards.

Two different races have sex, and produce offspring. Depending on the races involved, that can potentially produce some mechanically and culturally interesting individual characters.

If you can't handle that, then guess what? IN YOUR CAMPAIGN, you don't need to include them.

That however, doesn't warrant WOTC not otherwise including them as options in the standardized roster of character options.

WHY? Because far more people LIKE HALF RACES, regardless of what you prefer, or want to believe. That's why.

It would be so nice if people would stand up to these mentally weak social rejects, and put them in their place. All of the anti-white racists need to be stomped on hard, too. People shouldn't show them any mercy whatsoever. Push back against these idiots, and resist them! Don't just let them run their mouths online anywhere without getting called out to the carpet for it.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 05, 2023, 01:53:50 PM
Inter-racial relation questions aren't hard to answer:

If in your world Orcs, Elves, etc hate each other then half-anything will face racism from both sides.

If in your world everybody gets along and sings cumbaya they wont.

There's a lot of other possibilities in-between.

Sorry if this wasn't clear. The big inter-racial relation question posed by half-elf and half-orc is:

Why are human/elf and human/orc the only two combinations allowed?

For example, in AD&D1, the best relations are mostly among demihumans like gnomes, elves, and halflings. Those have the most "G" relations in the Racial Preferences chart. So why aren't gnome/elf or halfling/dwarf possible character types?

Quote from: Slambo on April 05, 2023, 12:56:01 PM

Quote from: Brigman on April 05, 2023, 11:46:07 AM
Unsurprisingly, I don't think they've thought this through.

No more "Half" races?  OK.  So no more Half-Elves, Half-Orcs, Half-Giants...

I guess that means they're getting rid of Tieflings and Aasimar then?  They're "half" human and "half" demonic/angelic, respectively...

That ought to go over well. >_<

They specifically mentioned they're keeping teiflings.

Of course they are.  Gotta get baristas somewhere, I guess... 

Quote from: jhkim on April 05, 2023, 02:15:32 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 05, 2023, 01:53:50 PM
Inter-racial relation questions aren't hard to answer:

If in your world Orcs, Elves, etc hate each other then half-anything will face racism from both sides.

If in your world everybody gets along and sings cumbaya they wont.

There's a lot of other possibilities in-between.

Sorry if this wasn't clear. The big inter-racial relation question posed by half-elf and half-orc is:

Why are human/elf and human/orc the only two combinations allowed?

For example, in AD&D1, the best relations are mostly among demihumans like gnomes, elves, and halflings. Those have the most "G" relations in the Racial Preferences chart. So why aren't gnome/elf or halfling/dwarf possible character types?

Thanks for clarifying.

Is this still the case in 5e?

As to why only those 2? Well, there's the issue of size, I mean an Orc and a Halfling will have some difficulties in bed. There's also the issue of magic, maybe the inherent magic of each race prevents them from having offspring with certain other races?

Which again wasn't hard to answer, those two answers were just off the top of my head without much thought.

You could also say halflings are too distantly related and can't interbreed (they might find a way to fuck tho) with Orcs for example, if you wish to insert scientific explanations into your world.

Take my Mayan inspired game, there's 5 sentient races, none can interbreed with the others. Because the gods made them from different substance.

Quote from: jhkim on April 05, 2023, 02:15:32 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 05, 2023, 01:53:50 PM
Inter-racial relation questions aren't hard to answer:

If in your world Orcs, Elves, etc hate each other then half-anything will face racism from both sides.

If in your world everybody gets along and sings cumbaya they wont.

There's a lot of other possibilities in-between.

Sorry if this wasn't clear. The big inter-racial relation question posed by half-elf and half-orc is:

Why are human/elf and human/orc the only two combinations allowed?

For example, in AD&D1, the best relations are mostly among demihumans like gnomes, elves, and halflings. Those have the most "G" relations in the Racial Preferences chart. So why aren't gnome/elf or halfling/dwarf possible character types?

Greetings!

I forgot in what thread we were discussing races in the campaign, but it came up. There is a certain point where mechanically speaking, such "Half Races" or other combinations can just become ridiculous, and more trouble than they are worth. Then, of course, there is also the idea that because some races can interbreed, doesn't mean  races can. Beyond that, while theoretically some races *could* interbreed, like dwarves and Halflings or Gnomes and Halflings--mechanically speaking, what would be the point? I can see a strong argument that many racial crossbreeds are not mechanically distinctive, and therefore not interesting or meaningful to create or detail. You could say the same thing about many Orc and Goblin/Hobgoblin, etc, in regards to crossbreeding.

Because *some* mixed race types make sense, and are interesting. That doesn't mean *ALL* are, or would be interesting.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK