Quote from: jhkim;1114202Voluntary segregation seems impossible by your definitions. Let's say there are four gay gamers who want to play an all-gay game with each other. But what if a straight gamer wants to join their game? If they exclude him, then it's involuntary segregation. So it's impossible for people who want to have an all-gay game to get it by voluntary association.

I assume that gay people have private houses where they can go to play their gay games voluntarily.

Quote from: VisionStorm;1114199You guys are such raging bigots. What's so difficult about playing the game the way that random people who aren't even gonna be at your table (or for all we know even play the game) want you to? It's called being a decent human being! Why don't you just admit this is about excluding marginalized people from a historically white and heteronormative hobby cuz you don't wanna give up your unearned privilege? I'm literally shaking! I mean, I can't even! :mad:

There there VisionStorm, let us retreat to our safe space together and indulge in a nice soy latte until all this fascism has blown over!

So, are we cool with freezing out the SJWs now? Since we can choose who we discriminate against, we can kick their asses out of forums, mailing lists and gaming groups both online and IRL.

Just trying to make sure I'm not being a hypocitre. It's so hard to keep up on the rules of engagement.

Quote from: Ratman_tf;1114225So, are we cool with freezing out the SJWs now? Since we can choose who we discriminate against, we can kick their asses out of forums, mailing lists and gaming groups both online and IRL.

Just trying to make sure I'm not being a hypocitre. It's so hard to keep up on the rules of engagement.

I'm good with that. As far as I'm concerned, if you don't want to play with SJWs, then you shouldn't have to.

The Glorious Revolution! (un-tm) shall only be complete once we conquer the proper way how to pretend to be an elf! :mad: (Seriously? That's the latest politburo's orderz? :confused: ) Onward komrades!

Eh, it's Clown World, kids. Just remember not to get too caught up in the act, lest you find yourself part of the show. "'I want my money back! I want my money back!' Just enjoy The Show" -- Lenka

Quote from: jhkim;1114028II think having a female-only bachelorette party or an LGBT-only meetup is voluntary and fine. It's not inherently sexist/discriminatory to have such limited-participation events. It's not that the women in the party are opposed to men, but that there are some things that can be experienced in a women-only group that are different than in a mixed group. Likewise, it's fine for there to be male-only groups, like a bachelor party or a men's group.

You're fine with a "straight white men only" RPG convention or Meetup? I bet you're not, and you should not conflate private events like a hen night with a public event like a convention.

Quote from: Ratman_tf;1114225So, are we cool with freezing out the SJWs now? Since we can choose who we discriminate against, we can kick their asses out of forums, mailing lists and gaming groups both online and IRL.

While I'm the one who argued for gatekeeping: Yes but don't do it.
Don't let them control the conversation and keep their hands away from the reigns of power but let them in to whine.

You can only become a smarter person from hearing every perspective. Hearing doesn't mean agree with, mind you.

Quote from: jhkimI think having a female-only bachelorette party or an LGBT-only meetup is voluntary and fine. It's not inherently sexist/discriminatory to have such limited-participation events. It's not that the women in the party are opposed to men, but that there are some things that can be experienced in a women-only group that are different than in a mixed group. Likewise, it's fine for there to be male-only groups, like a bachelor party or a men's group.

Quote from: S'mon;1114255You're fine with a "straight white men only" RPG convention or Meetup? I bet you're not, and you should not conflate private events like a hen night with a public event like a convention.

I'd be very suspicious of the motivations, but I wouldn't dismiss it inherently wrong.

It's similar to claims that African people's genetics are linked to lower IQ. I can't and shouldn't dismiss that it's impossible or inherently racist, but I'm very suspicious - particularly based on who I've seen claiming this and the history of the claims.

In part, this is because in most American conventions, it's pretty trivial to get all straight white men as players - it happens all the time by coincidence. In places where white people are a small minority - like in the Seoul gaming scene, for example - then an expat meetup would be less suspicious.

Quote from: Ratman_tf;1114225So, are we cool with freezing out the SJWs now? Since we can choose who we discriminate against, we can kick their asses out of forums, mailing lists and gaming groups both online and IRL.

Just trying to make sure I'm not being a hypocitre. It's so hard to keep up on the rules of engagement.

If an insane person wanted into your house. Would you just let them walk in and possibly harm you, your family? Are you racist if you dont let an insane black person into your house to kill you? If your answer is "Yes" then you too are insane.

As for SJWs... gosh. What do you think they are doing to people, and worse. Much worse. Do you want crazy people in your forum spouting crazy talk. We just had a few weeks ago a member flip out and proclaim that having x in a game promotes X in real life. And before that we had people, including designers, get a game about exploring and colonizing Africa cancelled because it "promotes Genocide". No. Really.

And at the end of the day... All SJWs are white so if you exclude them from your game session then you are only doing what they told you to do. :rolleyes:

Quote from: Shrieking Banshee;1114275You can only become a smarter person from hearing every perspective. Hearing doesn't mean agree with, mind you.

No you wont. Listening to crazy people only puts you at risk of being converted. Because these sociopaths are very good at that. I've seen it in action and it can spread like some sort of disease from one person to the next. Normally sane intelligent people just up and go totally off the deep end.

Quote from: Omega;1114376No you wont. Listening to crazy people only puts you at risk of being converted.

The weak-willed yes. And that's also the SJW argument for why they can't afford other opinions.

I have really gotten to understand SJWs, and how to determine the morons, from the malicious to the thieves just using it for personal gain. Identifying their own powerplay and using it against them has actually allowed me to deconvert at least some. And instill doubt in others.

But it was keeping an open mind in the first place that DE-converted me from SJW-ism.

Quote from: Shrieking Banshee;1114379The weak-willed yes. And that's also the SJW argument for why they can't afford other opinions.

I have really gotten to understand SJWs, and how to determine the morons, from the malicious to the thieves just using it for personal gain. Identifying their own powerplay and using it against them has actually allowed me to deconvert at least some. And instill doubt in others.

But it was keeping an open mind in the first place that DE-converted me from SJW-ism.

There's gaining information and then there's wasting energy.  It's not an all or nothing proposition with some "ideas".  There are certain types of SWJ blather I have heard so much that I don't need to hear it again to argue against it.  Hell, half the time I could play devil's advocate and make their case better than they can.  You need a mind open enough to see if they've come up with a new tactic or if it is merely someone mindless repeating the cant (and thus not making an argument).  After that, it's noise, not signal.

Quote from: Steven Mitchell;1114413There's gaining information and then there's wasting energy.  It's not an all or nothing proposition with some "ideas".  There are certain types of SWJ blather I have heard so much that I don't need to hear it again to argue against it.  Hell, half the time I could play devil's advocate and make their case better than they can.  You need a mind open enough to see if they've come up with a new tactic or if it is merely someone mindless repeating the cant (and thus not making an argument).  After that, it's noise, not signal.

True. But even then that (on its own) doesn't mean that its necessary or preferable to simply ban them from the forums, since it's not like posting at a forum is truly analogous to allowing a crazy person about to kill you into your physical residence. The only way they can hurt you here is if they convert the staff, and I seriously doubt Pundit can be converted at this point. Once you're savvy to SJWs BS you pretty much become immune to it. The most they can do is disrupt threads with their nonsense, which can be ignored and potentially get them banned.

Quote from: Omega;1114375And at the end of the day... All SJWs are white so if you exclude them from your game session then you are only doing what they told you to do. :rolleyes:

So hilariously true.

Quote from: Shrieking Banshee;1114379The weak-willed yes. And that's also the SJW argument for why they can't afford other opinions.

I have really gotten to understand SJWs, and how to determine the morons, from the malicious to the thieves just using it for personal gain. Identifying their own powerplay and using it against them has actually allowed me to deconvert at least some. And instill doubt in others.

But it was keeping an open mind in the first place that DE-converted me from SJW-ism.

It's one thing to "convert" SJWs if you actually care about them (family or whatever), it's another thing to put up with that bullshit in a GAME. I don't play games to be bombarded by ridiculous nonsense, so excluding those idiots is a good idea. Wasting my precious free time trying dealing with that nonsense instead of spending it on something fun is not acceptable. Being open to "different perspectives" is so antithetical to the SJW charade that it's laughable. Those people should be dismissed out of turn and never taken seriously. All these dumbass problems are purely because someone took their stupidity seriously. I will never make that mistake.