Cyberpunk RPG tells the future? Some strange & interesting stuff in a rpg. Never got into Cyberpunk.
I'll just leave this here.
The text gets too fuzzy to read when I expand the image. What does it say?
Try this.
(https://i.redd.it/k071z66l44431.jpg)
I should add that the Woke Wagon is in full-on pitchforks and torches mode over this. I've seen demands that the author make some kind of public statement of inclusivity from something he wrote 20+ years ago (and happened to be balls-on accurate). If I were him, my response would be, "why should I? You're proving my point".
Quote from: SavageSchemer;1092136Try this.
(https://i.redd.it/k071z66l44431.jpg)
Amazing... can you post the page number and book that is from?
Thank you Savage Schemer!
1) The Woke Wagon needs to be disintegrated with Hellfire missiles.
2) Do we have proof this was actually in the original CP 2020 book? Gotta ask in the Photoshop era.
3) The original Cyberpunk 2020 remains a glorious RPG. Highly recommended, especially if you want "realistic" combat in your games.
It's from the Neo-Tribes book. Not sure where. I took that picture off of reddit :)
EDIT: Just looked it up in the PDF. Page 7.
Quote from: SavageSchemer;1092142It's from the Neo-Tribes book. Not sure where. I took that picture off of reddit :)
EDIT: Just looked it up in the PDF. Page 7.
So my totally original intro was just my subconscious remembering this. Bummer.
On the other hand how many books have predicted/warned of the coming of the SJWs? Rebellion on the Farm, 1984, Fahrenheit 451, Half Past Human (The hipo-gonad nebish and their need to feel safe) any other?
Just sounds eerily familiar.
Me first = # me too.
Everyone is special = demanding the your special flag be flown over the embassies.
If your political beliefs are different than you are racists, sexist, xenophobic, etc, etc.
Maybe Cyberpunk Neo tribes is worth a read.
Quote from: SavageSchemer;1092137I should add that the Woke Wagon is in full-on pitchforks and torches mode over this. I've seen demands that the author make some kind of public statement of inclusivity from something he wrote 20+ years ago (and happened to be balls-on accurate). If I were him, my response would be, "why should I? You're proving my point".
Wait, so there's a bunch of (assumably) white people, ordering a black person to apologize for something written 20-30 years ago? That seems pretty fucking unwoke.
Minorities can only keep their minority status through obedience to the SJW narrative.
Dare to leave the plantation and you're just another punchable Nazi.
Quote from: SavageSchemer;1092142It's from the Neo-Tribes book. Not sure where. I took that picture off of reddit :)
EDIT: Just looked it up in the PDF. Page 7.
Holy Neo-Tokyo...
Just verified it. Page 7.
Written in 1995.
Quote from: SavageSchemer;1092137I should add that the Woke Wagon is in full-on pitchforks and torches mode over this. I've seen demands that the author make some kind of public statement of inclusivity from something he wrote 20+ years ago (and happened to be balls-on accurate). If I were him, my response would be, "why should I? You're proving my point".
They've also gone after him for the Voodoo Boys gang, which are going to be in the 2077 game.
https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2019/06/12/cyberpunk-2077s-e3-demo-has-weak-gunplay-and-unimaginative-stereotypes/
And the "trans" advertisement. (not sure what trans means in a world where there are insect bodysculpts)
https://www.polygon.com/e3/2019/6/12/18662443/cyberpunk-2077-trans-advertisement-cd-projekt-red-e3-2019
Hate to tell the posters who dislike the "politics" on the RPG forum, but this stuff isn't going to go away soon.
Anyway, there's a video on twitter,where Mike Pondsmith replies to the criticism of the Voodoo Boys.
https://twitter.com/GayLesbianCunt/status/1139217998105833472
*Obligatory comment about a black man defending his game from accustation of racism from white people.*
Glad I got my Cyberpunk pdf bundle beforehand -- it's gonna be a collector's item! :p
Quote from: Blood Axe;1092126Cyberpunk RPG tells the future? Some strange & interesting stuff in a rpg. Never got into Cyberpunk.
Alvin Toffler warned us back in 1970.
Thank you Aglondir and Savage Schemer for verifying this.
Kudos to Mike Pondsmith for his foresight.
Quote from: Spinachcat;1092170Thank you Aglondir and Savage Schemer for verifying this.
Kudos to Mike Pondsmith for his foresight.
No prob!
But it wasn't Maximum Mike-- Ross Winn and Eric Oppen have author credits. Mike's credited for Spiritual Guidance.
Interesting! Who are Ross Winn and Eric Oppen? Any other credits?
Quote from: Spinachcat;1092174Interesting! Who are Ross Winn and Eric Oppen? Any other credits?
From a quick glance he looks like he was a contributing author on several Cyberpunk supplements and Godsend Agenda.
https://www.rpggeek.com/rpgdesigner/13810/ross-winn
That Mike Pondsmith is black must send them into a tailspin. Regardless and irrespective of his skin color, that man is a genius who made an absolutely incredible and enduring game, both thematically and mechanically.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D8_1J1DVUAAFuJT.jpg)
Quote from: Blood Axe;1092146Just sounds eerily familiar.
Me first = # me too.
Everyone is special = demanding the your special flag be flown over the embassies.
If your political beliefs are different than you are racists, sexist, xenophobic, etc, etc.
Maybe Cyberpunk Neo tribes is worth a read.
Maybe? Try "definitely". Everything for Cyberpunk 2020 is worth a read. Mike Pondsmith ranks with the greats of RPG design.
This entire situation is made of win as far as I'm concerned. Anyone who gets butthurt by a game supplement written over 20 years ago is a person who doesn't engage in Actual Play of TTRPGs, because the RPG they are interested in is seeing who can be more outraged over trivial crap.
Quote from: jeff37923;1092213This entire situation is made of win as far as I'm concerned. Anyone who gets butthurt by a game supplement written over 20 years ago is a person who doesn't engage in Actual Play of TTRPGs, because the RPG they are interested in is seeing who can be more outraged over trivial crap.
My current theory, which isn't based on any actual knowledge of the situation, is that the recent Cyberpunk 2077 announcement got the hype machine going. Some of the people hyped are the kind of NPC's you find frequenting TBP. So they go to the source material to check out what this Cyberpunk game is all about. Then they run across material that is...problematic for a card-carrying member of the
Woke Wagon. What's a NPC to do? I know! I'll show everyone just how triggered I can be over this 20 year old material! We'll get everyone riled up and demand (demand, I say!) a public statement from the authors of such deeply offensive material.
Anyway. That's how I see it. It'd be entertaining if it weren't so fucking sad.
Quote from: Itachi;1092200(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D8_1J1DVUAAFuJT.jpg)
That is priceless.
This is why the gay mafia infiltrates any media not already in their control.
Quote from: RandyB;1092208Everything for Cyberpunk 2020 is worth a read. Mike Pondsmith ranks with the greats of RPG design.
Agreed. CP 2020 is made of awesome.
That sure is a long way to go dumpster diving.
They were digging for shit on Keanu too, only to discover he's been hoverhanding this whole time (https://www.google.com/search?q=keanu+hoverhand).
Quote from: Ratman_tf;1092163Anyway, there's a video on twitter,where Mike Pondsmith replies to the criticism of the Voodoo Boys.
https://twitter.com/GayLesbianCunt/status/1139217998105833472
*Obligatory comment about a black man defending his game from accustation of racism from white people.*
Oh that smooth easy listening voice...
...ahem, where was I?
That interview is also being conducted by controversial asian Yong Yea (https://youtu.be/d8lnrAqH0mk), and they're talking about the Bozos, which are ironically even more relevant (and problematic) thanks to clown world being a thing.
#HonkHonk
Quote from: Itachi;1092200(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D8_1J1DVUAAFuJT.jpg)
...
bhwAHAHAHAHAHAH!
It's like they looked into the future and combined the most problematic elements they found into one for maximum offense. The only way it could be more offensive is by using dolls instead of Poser art :p
I thought everyone knew this stuff about CP2020. Heh.
Welcome to the world of the real.
Quick - someone pull up where Shadowrun does this better with magic!
Quote from: tenbones;1092580I thought everyone knew this stuff about CP2020.
You think they
would have given how desperate they are for dirt, but for some reason they didn't bother to check the actual RPG it's based on until now.
Wonder why.
I'll be honest...
It kind of cracks me up. I initially thought when CP2077 was announced the SJW's would have rejoiced at the fact that genderbending is a thing in CP2020 and they'd like it. But... DUH... of course not. As you indicated, it's not like these people actually play the game in any form.
Quote from: GeekyBugle;1092143So my totally original intro was just my subconscious remembering this. Bummer.
On the other hand how many books have predicted/warned of the coming of the SJWs? Rebellion on the Farm, 1984, Fahrenheit 451, Half Past Human (The hipo-gonad nebish and their need to feel safe) any other?
Clockwork Orange.
Quote from: jeff37923;1092213This entire situation is made of win as far as I'm concerned. Anyone who gets butthurt by a game supplement written over 20 years ago is a person who doesn't engage in Actual Play of TTRPGs, because the RPG they are interested in is seeing who can be more outraged over trivial crap.
Amen. This is a fascinating level of outrage from folks who probably would never even play the game. It's like being mad at The Communist Manifesto for not being inclusive on LGBT issues.
Quote from: Tanin Wulf;1092760Clockwork Orange.
Harrison Bergeron
Many seem to be upset that gender-mods cause Humanity loss (unless you get paid counseling). Personally, I see any radical shift in physicality a potential upset to one's psyche, so it makes sense that a full-on gender swap via gene-therapy and cybernetics might be traumatic. The term "Humanity" seems to be a stickler as well. The fragility of these people only serves to prove the points many are making about them, as well as their nigh-constant complaining about games they don't likely even play.
Quote from: Alderaan Crumbs;1092765Many seem to be upset that gender-mods cause Humanity loss (unless you get paid counseling).
But that would require actually reading the books instead of just taking offense at the sexy pictures (http://archive.fo/lJVDd).
True. I'm interested to see where all this lands concerning Cyberpunk Red and Cyberpunk 2077. I hope the screeching is ignored and Mike and CDPR just keep to their visions.
Quote from: Ratman_tf;1092763Harrison Bergeron
I haven't gotten around to that one yet. Vonnegut is an author I like, but he's not my favorite so I don't go out of my way to read his stuff. Should I take this as a recommendation?
Quote from: Tanin Wulf;1092801I haven't gotten around to that one yet. Vonnegut is an author I like, but he's not my favorite so I don't go out of my way to read his stuff. Should I take this as a recommendation?
TBH I've only seen the adaptation short film 2081. (https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1282015/)
Quote from: Tanin Wulf;1092760Clockwork Orange.
Of course, how could I forget it.
Quote from: Ratman_tf;1092763Harrison Bergeron
Haven't read that one, do you recommend it?
Edit: Never mind Duh!
Quote from: Ratman_tf;1092802TBH I've only seen the adaptation short film 2081. (https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1282015/)
Everyone should read Harrison Bergeron.
Quote from: Tanin Wulf;1092801I haven't gotten around to that one yet. Vonnegut is an author I like, but he's not my favorite so I don't go out of my way to read his stuff. Should I take this as a recommendation?
Yes.
- Text (https://archive.org/stream/HarrisonBergeron/Harrison%20Bergeron_djvu.txt).
- Audio (https://youtu.be/rOGxftzy6mU).
Quote from: Anon Adderlan;1092915Yes.
- Text (https://archive.org/stream/HarrisonBergeron/Harrison%20Bergeron_djvu.txt).
- Audio (https://youtu.be/rOGxftzy6mU).
Wow. I didn't realize how short of a short story it was.
Quote from: Alderaan Crumbs;1092184That Mike Pondsmith is black must send them into a tailspin. Regardless and irrespective of his skin color, that man is a genius who made an absolutely incredible and enduring game, both thematically and mechanically.
It's funny. Once some of the people found out Mike Pondsmith was black, and that actual Haitians were involved, some of them backed off and actually apologized.
Quote from: tenbones;1092580Quick - someone pull up where Shadowrun does this better with magic!
You still mad, bro? :D
Quote from: CRKrueger;1092932You still mad, bro? :D
hahahah!
I'm going to run SR someday. It'll happen.
Quote from: CRKrueger;1092931It's funny. Once some of the people found out Mike Pondsmith was black, and that actual Haitians were involved, some of them backed off and actually apologized.
Which is kind of an insult. Why should their skin color change whether they're right or wrong about a topic?
(I know, Identity Politics is more important to them.)
Quote from: tenbones;1092936hahahah!
I'm going to run SR someday. It'll happen.
Still collecting enough d6s for the punch bowl? :D You can have my share of future SR playing. ;)
Quote from: CRKrueger;1092931It's funny. Once some of the people found out Mike Pondsmith was black, and that actual Haitians were involved, some of them backed off and actually apologized.
Even funnier is how many are making excuses for Mike claiming he didn't actually
write the offending material in order to continue their crusade.
Quote from: Anon Adderlan;1092773But that would require actually reading the books instead of just taking offense at the sexy pictures (http://archive.fo/lJVDd).
that was supposed to be a review? her entire review of the actual game was this....
"The worldbuilding is great; the mechanics are well explained; and while combat is too mechanically involved for my personal tastes, the system is interesting and supports a variety of fight styles. Along those same lines, netrunning is a cool concept and seems to be executed in a fun and interesting way."
Interesting.
The thread STARTS with a prophesy from an old game ...
And people who think they know better(some of the posters here) are quick to jeer at the ones that is clearly a part of it AND their otherwise well-intended notions, without realizing that they themselves are ALSO caught up in it, but from the other side of the coin.
But then it is pointed out that a different crowd of people who think they know better (SJWs) have gotten upset over it, which makes the People who think They know Better ... or PwtTkB for short .... over here draw parallels to dystopias in fiction everywhere (you forgot Brazil) even though those dystopias have very little or NOTHING to do with SJW in particular ... something that CP 2020 ACTUALLY DOES !
Personally, i'll just say:
Let's show we can handle diversity.
Let's show we can handle both Tolerance AND Intolerance, as well as Selective Tolerance, because that is what creates and maintains diversity.
As for Humanity loss for changing sex ....
Yes, that would be iffy, and considering the situation with gender dysphoria, ... you'll be needing counseling more or less anyway, so one could say it would be worth it...
On the other hand, there should be better ways ... and perhaps 2077 has that?
Perhaps i'll buy it.
Quote from: Catelf;1093450Interesting.
The thread STARTS with a prophesy from an old game ...
And people who think they know better(some of the posters here) are quick to jeer at the ones that is clearly a part of it AND their otherwise well-intended notions, without realizing that they themselves are ALSO caught up in it, but from the other side of the coin.
Well that's silly. SJW's that *are* part of the timeline in CP2020 as one of the root causes (but not the sole one) of the deterioration of America, count *anyone* that doesn't fall into their orbit as expressly on the other side. So by doing nothing, you are "caught up in it" whether you like it or not. Because that's precisely part of the deterioration effect.
Quote from: Catelf;1093450But then it is pointed out that a different crowd of people who think they know better (SJWs) have gotten upset over it, which makes the People who think They know Better ... or PwtTkB for short .... over here draw parallels to dystopias in fiction everywhere (you forgot Brazil) even though those dystopias have very little or NOTHING to do with SJW in particular ... something that CP 2020 ACTUALLY DOES !
Show me a third-world shithole that talks about "SJW" needs. Are people in the middle-east, South America, South-East Asia? parading around for LGBT rights? Or trying to censor people's free-speech? Do they push for Trans-bathrooms? No. Because they're already living the dystopia. This is the point that SJW's miss... the very notion of "Social Justice" is bullshit, because their attempts at perpetrating "Social Justice" on people thrusts the West into third-world dystopian shithole status - as predicted by the game.
Because in order to get what they say they want - they're going to have kill, silence, imprison, by whatever means, everyone that doesn't toe the line. Just like "around the world". This is why cultural relativism is what blinds SJW's. But you know... that's only one part of the poison of pathological post-modernism at play.
Quote from: Catelf;1093450Personally, i'll just say:
Let's show we can handle diversity.
Diversity of thought? Diversity of appearance? Diversity of sexual preference? CP2020 already handles that. You know, because many of us were already doing those things in/out of game for *decades*. Ironic that 30+ years later it only shows that SJW's have literally *regressed* from that position.
Quote from: Catelf;1093450Let's show we can handle both Tolerance AND Intolerance, as well as Selective Tolerance, because that is what creates and maintains diversity.
I, and everyone else, including you, have *nothing* to prove to anyone else. I don't give a fuck about showing others how tolerant I am for any reason. If you're at my table, in my life, clearly I tolerate you. Even this conversation shows I tolerate you. I don't *have* to care one iota about your beliefs/desires/who you want to fornicate with etc. until you start making demands on me (and anyone else) on how I'm *supposed* to be. The reverse is true too. If I start telling you how you're supposed to behave, and how you're supposed to think - you are perfectly free to tell me to fuck right the hell off.
You owe me nothing, I owe you nothing. Want to play a kickass game with me? If not. No problem.
Quote from: Catelf;1093450As for Humanity loss for changing sex ....
Yes, that would be iffy, and considering the situation with gender dysphoria, ... you'll be needing counseling more or less anyway, so one could say it would be worth it...
On the other hand, there should be better ways ... and perhaps 2077 has that?
Perhaps i'll buy it.
Anyone that is so sensitive, to any particular topic matter, shouldn't be consuming those things *to begin with*. It's not incumbent on others, assuming we're all adults, to be policing what is to be consumed, and how it is to be processed. This isn't rocket science.
I feel like the whole situation was based on a poor choice of wording in THAT section by Ross Winn and Eric Oppen. The tone of that paragraph seems to place Diversity and Unity on opposing grounds, but they're not. The point of the section was to establish how despite the cultural differences between the Seven Nations, they were able to establish a common Nomad Code to ensure that the Nations worked together to further their interests. It boils down to "we all have a job to do, let's get it done." The VERY NEXT PARAGRAPH says:
Quote from: NeoTribes Pg 7In contrast, the key to the survival of the nomad culture have (sic) always been unity. The nomads understand that they are nomad first. All the cultural identiy in the world will not save them if they do not help each other. Their common condition ensures few disagreements on cultural issues. Where once members of the Jodes and Aldecaldo clans almost went to war over the reconstruction rights for Los Angeles, there is now a bidding etiquette and compensation for losing parties. Where once the Meta and the Bloods feuded over limited medical resources, they now share resources like The Library and MetaKey (see pg. 28). Their shared ideals and common hardships have made the nomads form a unique culture, one secure enough to allow differences and variety to keep it strong.
Additionally Ross Winn wrote in his introduction:
Quote from: Ross Winn, NeoTribes Pg. 2Nomads are as diverse as America; every bit as terrible, and every bit as great. In this book I have labored to illuminate the good in them, as I believe we should try to see the good in all of us.
Not exactly a scathing condemnation of diversity.
Overall, I think that Division vs Unity would have been a better heading for the paragraph, but I'm 24 years too late to make editorial recommendations. In any case, I do agree that the internet making a fuss about decades old rpg sourcebooks is silly.
Quote from: Panzerkraken;1093655I feel like the whole situation was based on a poor choice of wording in THAT section by Ross Winn and Eric Oppen. The tone of that paragraph seems to place Diversity and Unity on opposing grounds, but they're not. The point of the section was to establish how despite the cultural differences between the Seven Nations, they were able to establish a common Nomad Code to ensure that the Nations worked together to further their interests. It boils down to "we all have a job to do, let's get it done." The VERY NEXT PARAGRAPH says:
Additionally Ross Winn wrote in his introduction:
Not exactly a scathing condemnation of diversity.
Overall, I think that Division vs Unity would have been a better heading for the paragraph, but I'm 24 years too late to make editorial recommendations. In any case, I do agree that the internet making a fuss about decades old rpg sourcebooks is silly.
Remember - we're not just talking about Nomads. We're talking about the comparison of HOW CP2020 presents the decline of America. This bit here that supports all the other material (like Home of the Brave) are just nuggets of exposition.
Diversity of thought with the appropriate assumptions on the rules of engagement on how those different thoughts are going to co-exist and sharpen one another is where Unity hangs. That's the unifying principle.
The moment you lose sight of this, then you close yourself off into your little echo-chamber. That's the moment when Unity dissolves because you're now placing the importance of your own ideas over the conditions that allowed for he "diversification of thought" in the first place.
You don't see leftist trying to engage their ideas on these grounds. These days they've turned identity politics into the new "class war". And Nomads are the pinnacle of that concept in CP2020. Because they've lived through the social ravages that caused them to become Nomads in the first place. The REASSERTION of the Unity principle among other Nomads is where they begin practicing the very principle that allows them to flourish, despite differences with other Nomads, rather than just go to war.
Don't mistake the cause for the cure. Because "diversity" of thought is not the same as how it's being implemented by the modern left, today. Quite the opposite. There is a taxonomy of scale in operation to this thing called Nationhood. Leftists think it's about their pogrom and thought constructs to the exclusion of everything else. Well that "everything else" is a whole lot of people.
Quote from: Catelf;1093450Interesting.
The thread STARTS with a prophesy from an old game ...
And people who think they know better(some of the posters here) are quick to jeer at the ones that is clearly a part of it AND their otherwise well-intended notions, without realizing that they themselves are ALSO caught up in it, but from the other side of the coin.
But then it is pointed out that a different crowd of people who think they know better (SJWs) have gotten upset over it, which makes the People who think They know Better ... or PwtTkB for short .... over here draw parallels to dystopias in fiction everywhere (you forgot Brazil) even though those dystopias have very little or NOTHING to do with SJW in particular ... something that CP 2020 ACTUALLY DOES !
Personally, i'll just say:
Let's show we can handle diversity.
Let's show we can handle both Tolerance AND Intolerance, as well as Selective Tolerance, because that is what creates and maintains diversity.
As for Humanity loss for changing sex ....
Yes, that would be iffy, and considering the situation with gender dysphoria, ... you'll be needing counseling more or less anyway, so one could say it would be worth it...
On the other hand, there should be better ways ... and perhaps 2077 has that?
Perhaps i'll buy it.
(http://www.reactiongifs.com/r/2013/10/bs2.gif)