I downloaded the expanded PDF of PiG's Coyote Trail.  I liked it.  The feel of the product is "nothing fancy, but it'll do the job right".  The rules are clean and simple--I like the way difficulty is defined as margin, rather than modifying the die roll directly--and the various skills/gimmicks/cliches certainly work for the Western genre.  Cute that businessman *have* to take the greedy gimmick.  The vocations aren't particularly limiting as classes go--just a set of core skills and a required gimmick.  You can roll your own vocation with not much trouble.  The advanced rules for chase scenes certainly work well--at least as read--for doing the "Injuns are chasing the stagecoach!" type of scene.  The setting material is servicable, capturing the basics of a Western tale without trying too hard for atmosphere.  Definitely like the subplots!  There were a few typoes but not enough to render the product unprofessional.

      A couple things I'd alter a bit.  I know the firearms table is meant for a very basic damage/range calculation for quick play.  However, I'd have seperated caliber and the weapons itself.  A Winchester chambered in the .44-40 would share damage stats as the Colt SAA chambered in same, while a .45-70 Trapdoor Springfield would do more damage and have greater range.  Yes, I know one can use the Knuckleduster book on firearms for more detail.  But the gunbunny in me always wants to tweak stuff.  I also hesitated at the intoxication rules for Native characters.  True to period and real life...but it does tickle the latent PC instinct.  By the same logic, Irish characters would suffer the same penalty.

    Anyway, nice piece of work.  I have yet to check out the adventures or Indian Trails section, but I like that I could easily run something inspired by "Open Range".

Andrew

Dude, PIG stuff, as a whole, is the bee's knees.  Iron Gauntlets and Hard Nova ][ are damn fine games, too, my man.  Bargains both, considering the quality and usefulness of both against what little you pay for 'em.

Malleable, too.

Quote from: SamarkandI also hesitated at the intoxication rules for Native characters.  True to period and real life...but it does tickle the latent PC instinct.  By the same logic, Irish characters would suffer the same penalty.

Thanks guys! Glad you liked it. There's actually a supposed fact that claims asians (and native americans) have a lower tolerance to alcohol. I haven't seen anything to debunk it, so I'm not sure about its accuracy. But the indian low tolerance, as far as I know, was drawn from historical curiosity rather than this claim.

Quote from: pigames.netThanks guys! Glad you liked it. There's actually a supposed fact that claims asians (and native americans) have a lower tolerance to alcohol. I haven't seen anything to debunk it, so I'm not sure about its accuracy. But the indian low tolerance, as far as I know, was drawn from historical curiosity rather than this claim.

   Well, drink was (and is) a major problem with Natives Americans.  It might have been that, since there wasn't the equivalent of whiskey among the tribes, the social taboos and physical tolerance that controlled its consumption among European-descended populations wasn't there.  Effectively like the crack epidemic among America's underclass during the 80's--since they never had to deal with such a substance, it hit the Indian social fabric harder.  And considering what happened to them over the 19th century, no wonder the natives decided to get drunk as thoroughly as possible.

    One house rule I'd include (unless I use the Firearms shop) is halved reloading times for the cap-and-ball revolvers such as the Colt Dragoon which were still common in the 1860's and 1870's.  The reload rate is half a character's fitness level, rounded up, for such weapons.  Unless you have a Remington 1860's era revolver, whose cylinder could be swapped entire.

    One fun supplement you could do: one focusing on the North West Mounted Police (Mounties) of Canada.  A slightly different flavour of lawdog than the rougher Marshalls and Texas Rangers of that era.

Andrew

Quote from: pigames.netThere's actually a supposed fact that claims asians (and native americans) have a lower tolerance to alcohol. I haven't seen anything to debunk it, so I'm not sure about its accuracy.

From the University of Texas at Austin:

QuoteA minority of individuals of Asian descent have very low tolerance for alcohol, expressed as flushing and sweating after ingestion of even small doses of the drug. Such individuals never become alcoholic. In studies carried out in Japan, these individuals have been shown to have two copies of a malfunctioning allele, or variant, of the gene for aldehyde dehydrogenase, an enzyme required to metabolize alcohol.

Is that what you're looking for?

I thought Open Range was a helluva movie, sort of a throwback to the old quality Western movies of yesteryear.  What I like about Coyote Trail is I can as easily see myself running something based off that movie as I can a knockoff of Deadwood.  What drives me crazy is that PIG continually produces seriously high-quality, A-level stuff, yet there's so many gamers out there who have yet to check out their stuff.  Along with Flying Mice, HinterWelt, and Dark Matter, I wish I had the means to engineer some brilliant giant ad campaign for the lot of them...

Quote from: JongWKFrom the University of Texas at Austin:
Is that what you're looking for?

Not specifically. I read it was more than just the minority. Who knows?? You can't believe anything you read.

Zachary, Open Range was a good movie, but I like Unforgiven and Tombstone the best. I think I'll have to watch Open Range again. It had one of the coolest gunfights in a long time. And I can't wait until the third season of Deadwood comes out on DVD.

The biggest ad campaign publishers like PIG, Hinterwelt, Flying Mice, etc. have is word of mouth.

Open Range is an unapologetic, old fashioned oater.  I like it--a slight film in many ways, but a charming time spent nontheless.  Robert Duvall rocks on toast as the crusty old trail boss.  Although it is essentially "Unforgiven" minus the bleakness and moral ambiguity.

    Coyote Trail definitely seems more skewed in tone towards "Deadwood" or spaghetti Western games, at least in terms of the text.  The writers certainly didn't gloss over the less pleasant aspects--sexual slavery, prostitution, racism, lynch mob justice--of the Old West.  I loved Shady Gulch just for that reason/  "Preacher" is just the Swearegen type of over-the-top character I'd love to meet during play.

     Funny.  I just got my copy of "Dogs in The Vineyard".  I ordered it a month ago just to see what the fuss was about.  Now I ahve a hankering to run the DitV background with Coyote Trail rules.

     BTW--if you mixed Iron Gauntlets with Coyote Trail, would you get "Dark Tower"?


Andrew

Quote from: pigames.netThe biggest ad campaign publishers like PIG, Hinterwelt, Flying Mice, etc. have is word of mouth.

I agree here 100%! People who like our games and talk about them - like you - are worth all the ads in the world.

And Unforgiven and Tombstone were my favorites too, though the Magnificent Seven will always have a place in my heart.

And I love Coyote Trail too!

-clash

Quote from: SamarkandFunny.  I just got my copy of "Dogs in The Vineyard".  I ordered it a month ago just to see what the fuss was about.  Now I ahve a hankering to run the DitV background with Coyote Trail rules.

Uhhh... That might be a brilliant idea!

-clash

Quote from: SamarkandFunny.  I just got my copy of "Dogs in The Vineyard".  I ordered it a month ago just to see what the fuss was about.  Now I ahve a hankering to run the DitV background with Coyote Trail rules.

Wow, somebody actually likes the technicolor dreamcoat mormons?

Quote from: SosthenesWow, somebody actually likes the technicolor dreamcoat mormons?

The Mormon thing was what got me interested in DitV. That is seriously cool. The game... meh! Not my thing.

-clash

I always had problems with this. Then again, I'm a European guy who still thinks those young guys knocking at your door with "Elder" name tags are kinda weird. I can't imagine some kind of Mormon John Wayne or Clint Eastwood riding around, putting things right.

I actually bought DotV, but if I'd ever run it, I'd change the protagonists to Jedis or something else my players could more relate to. Orson Scott Card be damned

I loved Tombstone & Unforgiven, also, Brett.  I'm also a big John Wayne fan (Sons of Katie Elder, The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance, Rio Bravo) so I guess I'm all over the map when it comes to westerns.

Quote from: SosthenesWow, somebody actually likes the technicolor dreamcoat mormons?

    Sure.  The society of the Faithful with its complex rules on gender, sex, and moral stewardship are compelling.  It is certainly not the usual run of themes in RPG's in general, let alone a Western-themed one.  Heck, I even like the DitV rules as written for certain tasks.  The Raise/See/Take the Blow/Give/Escalate sequence would work well for, say, elaborate duel scenes or other major dramatic conflicts.  I just find Coyote Trail easier to get my mind around for game purposes.

     One thing that turns off a lot of people about the Dogs, I think, is their "license to kill" to purge sin from a community.  Certainly as written, the DitV take on morality comes perilously close to a game set in Stalinist Russia where all the characters are commissars rooting out political deviancy.  But the real Mormon faith was very concerned about certain serious sins requiring blood expiation.  In their theology, major moral lapses such at murder required "blood to be spilled on the ground".  It is why Utah had the option of a firing squad for the death penalty; it offered a contrite Mormon execution victim a means of expiating his sin by literally letting his heart's blood fall to the earth.  The ruthlessness of the Dogs has historical roots in the Danites, an actual Mormon secret fellowship who were rumoured to punish serious transgressors through blood expiation.

Andrew