Quote from: DocJones;1127250For a campaign type game, I could see Supernatural, Scooby Doo, X-Files being models to follow.

Try Monster of the Week: https://www.evilhat.com/home/monster-of-the-week/

My group found that all the "moves"

• stuff/fluff is easy to ignore and it plays as a routine RPG with a short list of skills.


• It's PBTA to Fate.

Quote from: Groom of the Stool;1127294I will check it out, although I don't like the sound of dominoes, unless it's Domino from Thunderball.

Oh, believe me. I was skeptical too about the dominos when I first heard about the game. That's why it took me months of dragging for me to eventually get it.

But after seeing the application of the dominos by reading the book? It won me over. As the dominos make absolute thematic sense. For what the game tries to achieve.

The dominos create a sense of continual tension. Yes, you want to keep your best dominos to the end. But you are also limited to a hand of three at a time. So the ability to save is quite limited.

Also. If you play any double number dominos. The GM gets to keep them and use them against you to ratchet up the difficultly in dramatically challenging moments. So you really have to be careful what you play. Because you will be continually feeding the GM's ability make things more difficult for you.

Quote from: Groom of the Stool;1127293... is your planned Heartbreaker rpg a game in the vein of James Bond or am I way off here? ...

Not really. It's more of my "How Trent would do all those generic games in a way the fans have been clamoring for". So, any genre, generic but not "universal" in the sense that my GM/play assumptions will be baked in.

I also do some amateur layout, so I was just curious. I hope you take a stab (see what I did there?!?!) at making your horror game. I think it would be a delicious love letter based on your enthusiasm.

Quote from: Groom of the Stool;1127218We begin with some Chaosium stuff:


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Looks like 5th edition D&D except that the guy in the middle has a pistol and a fedora.

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Horrifying for all the wrong reasons

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This one looks really cool, it'd make a great cover for a fantasy game.

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Extremely non-Call of Cthulhu

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You saved the retch for last. D&D uses literal cartoon artwork on their "Acquisitions Incorporated" supplement, and I find it very off-putting in even that context. This just screams "throw me in the garbage, then set the garbage on fire, then bury the ashes in a landfill, then destroy any record of this ever having existed".

Is the RPG customer base really just growing more infantile and stupid that this dreck appeals to them? This art is about as subtle and evocative as a pie in the face by a circus clown.

I was of the opinion that there competing against CoC was a nonsensical waste of time, BRP is an excellent system, the Cthulhu mythos is great, it has a impressive legacy and reputation, and its (old) products were terrific. But seeing the brain-damaged direction Chaosium has been heading, I'm not so sure. If someone were to use the Legend OGL for maximum compatibility, there may be a place for a more serious, general horror rpg to fill the gap being left by Chaosium's shift to cartoonish pulp and diversity quotas.

Quote from: Mjollnir;1127330You saved the retch for last. D&D uses literal cartoon artwork on their "Acquisitions Incorporated" supplement, and I find it very off-putting in even that context. This just screams "throw me in the garbage, then set the garbage on fire, then bury the ashes in a landfill, then destroy any record of this ever having existed".

Is the RPG customer base really just growing more infantile and stupid that this dreck appeals to them? This art is about as subtle and evocative as a pie in the face by a circus clown.

I was of the opinion that there competing against CoC was a nonsensical waste of time, BRP is an excellent system, the Cthulhu mythos is great, it has a impressive legacy and reputation, and its (old) products were terrific. But seeing the brain-damaged direction Chaosium has been heading, I'm not so sure. If someone were to use the Legend OGL for maximum compatibility, there may be a place for a more serious, general horror rpg to fill the gap being left by Chaosium's shift to cartoonish pulp and diversity quotas.

I'm not a D&D player but I love fantasy, sword & sorcery, etc. You're correct that the last cartoony cover wouldn't even fly in a fantasy setting. Think of old Frazetta Conan art, now THAT'S inspiring stuff. When I saw the covers of old Savage Sword of Conan I couldn't wait to read the comics. You wanted to be that tough, muscular warrior on the cover, hacking through a horde of enemies or saving some halfnaked woman from some monstrous creature. Looking at that last Pulp Cthulhu cover...is it inspiring? Would anyone really want to that generic girl in glasses or the cleft-beard-guy who looks like he would be drinking Latte in Seattle right now?

This is how you do cool pulp covers:
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So, they can't do horror covers right anymore it seems, and that last Pulp campaign cover would hardly even interest an 12-year old I bet. I see what they're aiming for but I just don't understand it. Younger people today play Playstatio and Xbox games with more mature content. They're heading for Scooby-Doo-land. The question is why? When Teletubbies are weirder and scarier than your campaign cover, isn't it time to rethink your art direction?

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Quote from: Groom of the Stool;1127337So, they can't do horror covers right anymore it seems, and that last Pulp campaign cover would hardly even interest an 12-year old I bet. I see what they're aiming for but I just don't understand it. Younger people today play Playstatio and Xbox games with more mature content. They're heading for Scooby-Doo-land. The question is why? When Teletubbies are weirder and scarier than your campaign cover, isn't it time to rethink your art direction?

CoC has always been the "safe" horror game. The main bad guys are so preposterous that nobody could believe they actually exists, aside from denying the existence of God, the game takes no stance on any moral or spiritual issue so it offends no one, and the regular bad guys are irredeemable crazy people that you can kill without guilt (like zombies). The game even has a mechanic which is used to inform the player when he's supposed to pretend that his character is scared.

If you wanted a game based on 70s/80s horror, you'd need to abandon the safe and non-threatening approach which would lose the vast majority of the game's appeal. (and, as previously mentioned, there isn't an effective framing device needed for a long term campaign.)

Quote from: Mjollnir;1127330...
I was of the opinion that there competing against CoC was a nonsensical waste of time, BRP is an excellent system, the Cthulhu mythos is great, it has a impressive legacy and reputation, and its (old) products were terrific. [I]But seeing the brain-damaged direction Chaosium has been heading, I'm not so sure.[/I] If someone were to use the Legend OGL for maximum compatibility, there may be a place for a more serious, general horror rpg to fill the gap being left by Chaosium's shift to cartoonish pulp and diversity quotas.

That's what makes me think a "pathfinder" version of CoC might be viable now.

It must be d100. It must have 'Cthulhu' in the title.

But I also think it would have to have a good art design. And although d100 it would have to be  more clever when it comes to skills etc...

It could be d100 compatible without following the old-school design 100%.

That all being said, one would have to stay around long enough for Chaosium's wokeness to start to take effect. And be good enough that you would be viewed as a viable option for people to not give Chaosium their money to get their "CoC" fix.

Doable, but a tall order none the less.

That new chaosium art is hideous and idiotic.

Silent Legions (By Sine Nomine , who made Stars without Number)
Is a generic Horror RPG. OSR based.
I've used it a lot and it can be used for pretty much whatever style of Horror you want.
Even if you don't use the Rules system itself, the GM tables are really useful

The front cover is terrible though. Looks like they used "Poser" or some such software to make it.

Quote from: danskmacabre;1127486Silent Legions (By Sine Nomine , who made Stars without Number)
Is a generic Horror RPG. OSR based.
.

Black Books: Tomes of the Outer Dark is an OSR alternative. It uses PD artwork from period comics. Yeah some of the CoC covers are dumb.

Simon, on DriveThruRPG, your full size preview is only the generic character sheet. It would be interesting to see more so people can get a better understanding. Also, is it for sale in dead tree on Amazon?

Quote from: hedgehobbit;1127348CoC has always been the "safe" horror game. The main bad guys are so preposterous that nobody could believe they actually exists, aside from denying the existence of God, the game takes no stance on any moral or spiritual issue so it offends no one, and the regular bad guys are irredeemable crazy people that you can kill without guilt (like zombies). The game even has a mechanic which is used to inform the player when he's supposed to pretend that his character is scared.

If you wanted a game based on 70s/80s horror, you'd need to abandon the safe and non-threatening approach which would lose the vast majority of the game's appeal. (and, as previously mentioned, there isn't an effective framing device needed for a long term campaign.)

Well, I think old Chaosium had a darker mood in many of their scenarios (I'm not talking the globetrotting campaigns now). It might have been around the 90s when Pagan Publishing was active as well. The covers were more in the horror vein too. You didn't have to think twice if it was a horror adventure or not.

Down below are some examples of older covers/illustrations that I think convey the idea of a horror game more than their new stuff. Of course, a horror game based on 70s and 80s horror would be even more visceral and pack a harder punch, but that's another matter.

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Quote from: danskmacabre;1127486Silent Legions (By Sine Nomine , who made Stars without Number)
Is a generic Horror RPG. OSR based.
I've used it a lot and it can be used for pretty much whatever style of Horror you want.
Even if you don't use the Rules system itself, the GM tables are really useful

The front cover is terrible though. Looks like they used "Poser" or some such software to make it.

Is there anything that isn't level-based?

Quote from: danskmacabre;1127486Silent Legions (By Sine Nomine , who made Stars without Number)
Is a generic Horror RPG. OSR based.
I've used it a lot and it can be used for pretty much whatever style of Horror you want.
Even if you don't use the Rules system itself, the GM tables are really useful

The front cover is terrible though. Looks like they used "Poser" or some such software to make it.

Quote from: Simon W;1127493Black Books: Tomes of the Outer Dark is an OSR alternative. It uses PD artwork from period comics. Yeah some of the CoC covers are dumb.

Is there anything that isn't level-based?

Quote from: BoxCrayonTales;1127579Is there anything that isn't level-based?

You might like Kult.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kult_(role-playing_game)
But it's not really generic. It's based around Angelic vs Demonic forces.
Skill based type thing. No levelling

I'd definitely give a heads up to Chill. It was a sort of competitor to CoC back in the day. More generic Horror, such as in the style of "Hammer house of horror"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chill_(role-playing_game)

There's also "Trail of Cthulhu"
A very story based, Narrative type RPG
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trail_of_Cthulhu
I've not played it, but it sounded interesting when I first heard of it.

Or if you wanna go wayback, some GURPS horror. All points buy. Not to my taste, but some like it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GURPS_Horror