Unless the GM starts with Double or Triple the recommended Doom Points.

Then the PCs could be f**ked, heh heh

Quote from: HappyDaze;1098161It certainly has the illusion of being deadly, but if your heroes are made on the level of Conan himself (which the Modiphius version certainly provides), then death most often comes from them rather than to them. Modiphius has metacurrency that ensures every scene feels like death is on the table, but it is generally not too likely unless the people at the table (GM and players) want it to happen and spend the pools to make it go that way.

Unless the GM starts an adventure with double or triple the recommended Doom Pts.
Then the PCs could find things much more challenging

Quote from: HappyDaze;1098161It certainly has the illusion of being deadly, but if your heroes are made on the level of Conan himself (which the Modiphius version certainly provides), then death most often comes from them rather than to them. Modiphius has metacurrency that ensures every scene feels like death is on the table, but it is generally not too likely unless the people at the table (GM and players) want it to happen and spend the pools to make it go that way.

That's one of the great things about GURPS Conan: the combat system is deadly and tactical, and if you play Conan or some other high-powered character, you get a huge amount of ability, but you'll still die if you get hacked up or shot or whatever, so you need to supply part of the greatness of your heroes by making decisions and tactical moves that tend to mean those things aren't so likely to happen - i.e. there is an actual game to play about what to do and how to do it, where your success depends on how well you play, and luck/Kromm.

(That's why I don't like abstract combat systems, where combat tends to largely just be a matter of "I fight them" and then the power of your character meaning you probably win.)

Quote from: Skarg;1098400That's one of the great things about GURPS Conan: the combat system is deadly and tactical, and if you play Conan or some other high-powered character, you get a huge amount of ability, but you'll still die if you get hacked up or shot or whatever, so you need to supply part of the greatness of your heroes by making decisions and tactical moves that tend to mean those things aren't so likely to happen - i.e. there is an actual game to play about what to do and how to do it, where your success depends on how well you play, and luck/Kromm.

(That's why I don't like abstract combat systems, where combat tends to largely just be a matter of "I fight them" and then the power of your character meaning you probably win.)

Modiphius Conan is not abstract, and if you want to spend metacurrency to pull an "I win" you might be able to do so... and then the metacurrency bites you back. This means luck is still involved because you may gamble on getting through fights without tugging on the metacurrency because you fear the potential repercussions of loading the GM's Doom pool. OTOH, you can spend early to ensure you'll get to the climax of the adventure only to overdo it and likely go down horribly in the end to the Doom you've crafted.

Quote from: HappyDaze;1098404Modiphius Conan is not abstract, and if you want to spend metacurrency to pull an "I win" you might be able to do so... and then the metacurrency bites you back. This means luck is still involved because you may gamble on getting through fights without tugging on the metacurrency because you fear the potential repercussions of loading the GM's Doom pool. OTOH, you can spend early to ensure you'll get to the climax of the adventure only to overdo it and likely go down horribly in the end to the Doom you've crafted.

Ok.

That doesn't sound like it would appeal to me much, because it sounds like it is about abstract metacurrency and things that are not about the situation supposedly in play, e.g. "the GM's Doom pool". I'm more interested in playing a game with terrain and situations and characters that move around and have specific abilities and equipment, and moving in ways that make sense given that situation, so the game is about that situation, involving people, weapons, terrain, tactics, etc that behave in ways that make sense for the situation.

(Maybe this is an off-topic digression, and if so, sorry, but:
My experience and impression of abstract metacurrency mechanics is that they tend not to really be about the situation and are all (or at least, much more) about the metacurrency. i.e. the same game mechanics might apply to busting Leia out of the Death Star detention level as would apply to Conan fighting Rexor et al at the Battle of the Mounds, or James Bond fighting some assassins (and him fighting on a train, an airplane, underwater, or a car chase might all use identical mechanics, too). No?)

Quote from: Skarg;1098437Ok.

That doesn't sound like it would appeal to me much, because it sounds like it is about abstract metacurrency and things that are not about the situation supposedly in play, e.g. "the GM's Doom pool". I'm more interested in playing a game with terrain and situations and characters that move around and have specific abilities and equipment, and moving in ways that make sense given that situation, so the game is about that situation, involving people, weapons, terrain, tactics, etc that behave in ways that make sense for the situation.

(Maybe this is an off-topic digression, and if so, sorry, but:
My experience and impression of abstract metacurrency mechanics is that they tend not to really be about the situation and are all (or at least, much more) about the metacurrency. i.e. the same game mechanics might apply to busting Leia out of the Death Star detention level as would apply to Conan fighting Rexor et al at the Battle of the Mounds, or James Bond fighting some assassins (and him fighting on a train, an airplane, underwater, or a car chase might all use identical mechanics, too). No?)

Your generalization is not entirely accurate. The Conan version of 2d20 cares a great deal about terrain and other situation effects (without spending metacurrency--this is not FATE). Keep in mind too that while Modiphius has tried to apply their base system across multiple types of play, I find their Conan version plays very nicely. OTOH, I find their Star Trek version terrible, especially in the way metacurrency moves supporting NPCs into/out of focus. Watch or read some sample plays of Modiphius Conan before dismissing it as not making sense for the situation.

Didn't Mongoose do a Rune Quest based Conan a few years back?  d20 Conan as well IRRC (which I might well not).  Rune Quest would work well for Conan.  You just need divine magic for Mithra and Set and sorcery for the Hyperborians and Black Circle.  They also had Lankhmar and The Young Kingdoms from Elric.

You could do it with Rolemaster.  Hillman Rogue, not much more too it really.  I always wanted to play a Dunlending named Conan in MERP  Probably around rank 4 in main skills in RM2 or 8 in RMSS.  Training package really inflate skill ranks at low levels but they also drive you into the diminishing returns past rank 10 faster, so the initial advantage is largely lost at higher levels.

I've tried to run Conan with GURPS a few times but the players really don't grok the setting because they've only seen the movies.

Quote from: Skarg;1098437Ok.

That doesn't sound like it would appeal to me much, because it sounds like it is about abstract metacurrency and things that are not about the situation supposedly in play, e.g. "the GM's Doom pool". I'm more interested in playing a game with terrain and situations and characters that move around and have specific abilities and equipment, and moving in ways that make sense given that situation, so the game is about that situation, involving people, weapons, terrain, tactics, etc that behave in ways that make sense for the situation.

(Maybe this is an off-topic digression, and if so, sorry, but:
My experience and impression of abstract metacurrency mechanics is that they tend not to really be about the situation and are all (or at least, much more) about the metacurrency. i.e. the same game mechanics might apply to busting Leia out of the Death Star detention level as would apply to Conan fighting Rexor et al at the Battle of the Mounds, or James Bond fighting some assassins (and him fighting on a train, an airplane, underwater, or a car chase might all use identical mechanics, too). No?)

Modiphius Conan is a pretty crunchy game, lots of tactical and simulationist working  parts, similar to games like BRP, GURPs, Harn, Rolemaster etc

But it also has a meta-currency as well. This works well in practice, but would not appeal to everyone.

Quote from: David Johansen;1098467Didn't Mongoose do a Rune Quest based Conan a few years back?  d20 Conan as well IRRC (which I might well not).  Rune Quest would work well for Conan.  You just need divine magic for Mithra and Set and sorcery for the Hyperborians and Black Circle.  They also had Lankhmar and The Young Kingdoms from Elric.

You could do it with Rolemaster.  Hillman Rogue, not much more too it really.  I always wanted to play a Dunlending named Conan in MERP  Probably around rank 4 in main skills in RM2 or 8 in RMSS.  Training package really inflate skill ranks at low levels but they also drive you into the diminishing returns past rank 10 faster, so the initial advantage is largely lost at higher levels.

I've tried to run Conan with GURPS a few times but the players really don't grok the setting because they've only seen the movies.

   I remember the folks on the mongoose forums explaining that even though they had the Conan license they were only allowed to publish it with one game system, so they originally intended to publish a runequest version, but were legally not able to.   Their d20 version was not bad at all IMO, but I never played it and only read it.  But it made d20 "feel" like Conan (low massive damage save vs death with escalating DC, sorcery dark, unreliable and dangerous, AC (defense) based on dodge or parry characteristic and armor being DR instead of armor class.

Quote from: David Johansen;1098467Didn't Mongoose do a Rune Quest based Conan a few years back?  d20 Conan as well IRRC (which I might well not).  Rune Quest would work well for Conan.  You just need divine magic for Mithra and Set and sorcery for the Hyperborians and Black Circle.  They also had Lankhmar and The Young Kingdoms from Elric

No there was no official BRP / RQ version of CONAN. Mongoose did do RQ and CONAN at the same time, but they were separate systems.
However there was some cross bleed between them - Mongoose Conan certainly felt very BRP-ish in many ways. Not in core mechanics, but a lot of the fluff was consistent with stuff seen in many BRP products.

There is a link with Jason Durall as well. He was involved with Mongoose Conan, he compiled the BRP core book, he was involved with Modiphius Conan, and he is now line developer for the new RuneQuest - so the properties and settings seem to be intertwined to a degree

Quote from: Brad;1097780The d20 Conan Atlantean Edition is the best of the bunch, in my opinion. GURPS Conan gets an honorable mention due to the quality of the adventures, and the fact they're all solos. Actually, the primary GURPS Conan book is probably the most succinct and useful supplement for the stories (and other games), which comes as no surprise to anyone on here familiar with GURPS, I'd bet.

If I were actually going to play a Conan-style game today, I'd probably just use B/X D&D and only allow fighters and thieves as PCs.

Mongoose Conan technically has three editions:
-1st
-Atlantean Edition.
-2nd

They're all pretty similar but I think that 2nd is clearly the best because it gets rid of the one size fits all and kludgy defensive blast and replaces it with a bunch of flavorful last-ditch defensive magic. It also makes Temptress a core class which is a good idea and does some bits of fixing around the edges.

The 1st and Atlantean editions defensive blast magic really struck in my craw as it was the only annoying thing about an otherwise awesome magic system and 2ed replacement is so much better and very flavorful.

Overall Mongoose Conan is solid if you can stand the standard warts of 3ed D&D (doling out skill points, trying to get your feats to work together properly, etc. etc. etc.). It's my favorite version of 3ed by a long shot because:
-The magic system is freaking amazing and great for S&S (especially the 2ed version) and fixes so many issues with 3ed. Now casters aren't overpowered and having so few magical buffs makes the game run a lot more smoothly.
-Armor/DR/combat system that's a bit fiddly but workable as the magic overhaul makes most other stuff a lot simpler.
-Grittier overall with weapon damage ramped up and massive damage kicking in at 20 HP which makes combat a bit bloodier and dangerous for PCs. Also bit mobs of low level NPCs are a bit more dangerous since if a bunch of people attack you they get bonuses to hit.
-Multiclassing is smoother and you can mix and match stuff without worrying too much about gimping yourself. You can even mutliclass pretty smoothly between casters and non-casters without gimping yourself because, like I said above, the magic system is really really solid.
-Some flavorful combat stunts and are funky but mostly get ignored in play (at least in my game). Some fun combat-focused feats though.
-Game's set up with the assumption that players will regularly blow through all their cash so people are really dependent on their equipment much at all.

Quote from: oggsmash;1098482I remember the folks on the mongoose forums explaining that even though they had the Conan license they were only allowed to publish it with one game system, so they originally intended to publish a runequest version, but were legally not able to.   Their d20 version was not bad at all IMO, but I never played it and only read it.  But it made d20 "feel" like Conan (low massive damage save vs death with escalating DC, sorcery dark, unreliable and dangerous, AC (defense) based on dodge or parry characteristic and armor being DR instead of armor class.

Yeah a lot of good ideas in the first edition but some of the implementation was pretty sloppy, the Atlantean Edition was a good patch and by second edition the game was really quite solid if you can stand standard d20 warts like skill synergy and all that crap.

Quote from: HappyDaze;1098457Your generalization is not entirely accurate. The Conan version of 2d20 cares a great deal about terrain and other situation effects (without spending metacurrency--this is not FATE). Keep in mind too that while Modiphius has tried to apply their base system across multiple types of play, I find their Conan version plays very nicely. OTOH, I find their Star Trek version terrible, especially in the way metacurrency moves supporting NPCs into/out of focus. Watch or read some sample plays of Modiphius Conan before dismissing it as not making sense for the situation.

Quote from: Mankcam;1098481Modiphius Conan is a pretty crunchy game, lots of tactical and simulationist working  parts, similar to games like BRP, GURPs, Harn, Rolemaster etc

But it also has a meta-currency as well. This works well in practice, but would not appeal to everyone.

Oh ok, interesting, thanks!

What would happen if you tried to run it without the meta-currency?

Quote from: Skarg;1098514Oh ok, interesting, thanks!

What would happen if you tried to run it without the meta-currency?

It wouldn't change much, be more deadly.

You have Fate Points, which have various uses.
1. Prevent death - Spend a point and you have been left for dead, but healable if someone tends to you within an hour, at which point you're -9 HPs.  Not really an OOC decision to spend, unless you'd rather die.  Can easily be passed off as favor of the gods, etc.
2. Mighty Blow - You can deal Max Damage with a hit, breaking your weapon in the process.  OOC, but could be passed off as extreme effort.
3. Repentance - You spend Points to reduce Corruption.  Getting into storyland here.
4. Destiny - Here we're in full Narrative Authorship mode (to be fair, they require the GM's ok).  You can have a serving wench slip you a dagger while imprisoned, remember that season you spent in Hyrkania and pick up knowledge or a language, etc.  Definitely OOC telling stories about your character.

The game plays fine without them, no core mechanics affected.

Quote from: Skarg;1098514Oh ok, interesting, thanks!

What would happen if you tried to run it without the meta-currency?

Well you could just run it with the Skill Rolls, but it may lose some of the essence that the authors invested in the game.

Personally if I didn't want to run Modiphius Conan RAW, then I would probably choose to run Hyborian adventures using a familiar system like  BRP/Mythras (or BoL for a lighter game).

I could just use the Modiphius books for setting inspiration (of which they are very good). This was actually the original reason I collected the books for.

However the more I read the rules, the more the Modiphius system has grown on me. I think that the meta-currency may add an interesting dial to the game.

So I might give Modiphius Conan a go with the RAW before I cast any judgements. It seems to be an interesting mix of mild crunch with some game-play dials that will be interesting to see if it enhances the experience or not