TheRPGSite

While reading about D&D's Combat Wheelchair (https://www.geeknative.com/74527/dd-gets-a-combat-wheelchair/), this caught my eye:

"Views on disability in the RPG space are slowly changing. WotC has made edits to the text of Curse of Strahd on D&D Beyond to remove mentions of NPC being ashamed of her disability."

In its tiny way, this is some "cropping out Trotsky from the old politburo photo", Orwell Ministry of Truth level shit.

I now actually find the trigger warning on WotC content on drivethru etc. to be reassuring; it means it's less likely they will go through and retroactively edit historic material to make it compliant. Not that I would consider that very likely anyway, as they are a commercial operation and presumably would not find it profitable to do so.

As for the wheelchair... ok, hope there are no stairs in the dungeon. That said it has magic in the arms (so you can make it go without spinning the wheels), so maybe it can just float up the stairs, like new Daleks.

More generally, I don't know any disabled gamers, but generally the attitude among disabled people I know is they want to get on with their lives with the disability being as small a thing as possible. If any of these folks decided to play D&D, I imagine the last thing they would want is to have the "combat wheelchair" option shoved in their faces. Would this kind of thing not just make people more self-conscious and therefore uncomfortable?

I'm really baffled as to why characters aren't allowed to have feelings "we" disagree with. I mean, I get that they are incapable of viewing fiction without trying to analyze every word for secret political messaging, but I can't comprehend that anyone is so incapable of understanding fiction as a concept.

Today I was with my children at the park, and my daughter's scooter simply did not work once we got off paved paths. The slightly wet dirt road, though graded by a machine, stopped her cold. And the forested area - well, she had to carry it.

This is the reason that wheelchairs, though technically possible since at least the bronze age, did not see much use worldwide until the 19th century. Of course, it's fantasy so you can handwave all that - but in that case, you could also handwave a restoration spell and give them their legs back.

That wheelchair is busted. If it were really in the game literally no character would be without one.

I'm insulted. I am in a wheelchair now, and there's no fucking way cripples go adventuring without somehow having value (and no, your standard D&D PC ain't it, chief) far in excess of the sheer stupidity that (literally, at times) dragging a living boat anchor can be. This bitch is pissing in my face and saying that it's raining. Fuck her "Muh Representayshuns" bullshit.

Quote from: Marchand;1139419While reading about D&D's
"Views on disability in the RPG space are slowly changing. WotC has made edits to the text of Curse of Strahd on D&D Beyond to remove mentions of NPC being ashamed of her disability."

This sort of thing just reminds me of the centuries in which King Lear had a happy ending because the original was too horrible or the 19th century puritan cleaned up version of Shakespeare published by Thomas Bowdler from whom we gain the word "Bowdlerisation".

Should people who are disabled feel ashamed?  No.  Might someone who is disabled feel ashamed?  Yes.  It is within the range of human reaction.  Does portraying the latter mean that you should feel the former.  No.  Only in the mind of a complete fucking idiot!

Maybe they should think about representing people who are fucking flawed, or imperfect or don't view the world through the lens of a 21st century college educated American.  You know, in order to be "diverse".

I don't really give a shit about the combat wheelchair.

The combat wheelchair seems more like something you'd stick some gimmicky NPC with, for a single combat, than anything a player character in a D&D campaign would want to put up with.

In fact, it seems more like something suited to a superhero game with point generated characters rather than D&D. Granted, I've never read 5th edition D&D (or 3rd, other than through video games, or 4th, other than discussions I cringed at participating at). Is 5th edition D&D like Champions or something, can you minmax your character by putting all your points into your wheelchair?

If you have the magic to make a 'combat wheelchair' work, you have the magic to make prosthetic legs work.

The trouble with the latter, of course, is that they're not in-your-face obvious & jarring.

Leaving aside the actual issues (should mainline RPG's from a mega-corp deal with sensitive issues or just skim the surface in order to build the brand in to something we can license for movie deals ...), there are multiple ways a disability could work.

First, it's a world where fireballs shoot elves from their butts, which, I must admit, is a great response to every argument involving realism.

Second, the genre has changed. In a more traditional exploration based game then yes, absolutely, it may be hard to fit in. But in the modern "investigate & arrest"  genre it could totally work. You have your SWAT team party members and your social ones and your smarty ones. When it comes time to hit the warehouse then some members hang back. This would follow the traditional beats of network Tv shows. I could argue that it's actually in the same vein as Detect spells in modern D&D: they are too low level for the game actually being played at the table these days; this is just another ack that some parts of the rules/genre don't fit the modern game.

Anything is possible in an RPG. But not everything is probable...

To me, an NPC in a wheel chair is fine, assuming they are not going out adventuring with the players. Maybe they are being rescued or transported by the players, and that could bring in a whole set of interesting challenges in itself. Or it might be a good way to retire a character.
The logistics... Of adventuring in a contraption like that. 'What do you mean we have to go into a sewer?'

Sure, you could tailor a game for something different and that's one thing. Might be interesting for a break. But for a classical D&D adventure ya' can fek off with it. Magic wheelchair... Where did you get the cash to have that built at first level incidentally? Look, I'm no D&D rules expert but why couldn't you just get some Paladin or Cleric to fix your crippled legs, or do you really want a character to trundle around in a rickety chair, while hoping it has mirrors so you can see the evil orc creeping up behind you.

Maybe we should start a Kickstarter book to have all sorts of medical devices for people with disabilities? I dunno... A magical music box where a little bird sings out your words when you're a mute. Or some Large magical ears that stick to you head if you're deaf? We could introduce some disability parking outside the taverns too, so they can park their steam powered mechanical horses.

A magical wheelchair seems very anachronistic in a DnD game.  How about something like a Flying Carpet or a version of the Luggage (of Disc World fame)

I always loved the magical appendages that Drow made back in the 2e days or maybe a pair of golem powered trousers:

[ATTACH=CONFIG]4651[/ATTACH]

Quote from: The Exploited.;1139446I dunno... A magical music box where a little bird sings out your words when you're a mute.

I really like the sound of that as a weird gimmick for a villain, or an object left behind by an evil wizard in their lair. It's basically indestructible (or unleashes horrendous consequences when destroyed) and offers disturbing premonitions. Cue creepy Bagpuss music (google it) and then, "He's going to rip your fucking head off... head off... head off..."

Or it's a soul box and the trapped soul begs for release.

OSR product idea: D20 weird and creepy things to come out of an old-timey music box.

Anyway, it was the rewriting of the book that really prompted me to start this thread. Seems like some scary shit to me. We've always been at war with Eastasia, right?

The combat wheelchair appears to be 3rd-party content, and D&D has seen things much more anachronistic in its day.

  But I have a copy of Curse of Strahd I've been planning to sell. Now I'm wondering if I should wait for the new printings to come out and drive up the value of the unexpurgated version. :D

Quote from: Marchand;1139450I really like the sound of that as a weird gimmick for a villain, or an object left behind by an evil wizard in their lair. It's basically indestructible (or unleashes horrendous consequences when destroyed) and offers disturbing premonitions. Cue creepy Bagpuss music (google it) and then, "He's going to rip your fucking head off... head off... head off..."

Or it's a soul box and the trapped soul begs for release.

OSR product idea: D20 weird and creepy things to come out of an old-timey music box.

Anyway, it was the rewriting of the book that really prompted me to start this thread. Seems like some scary shit to me. We've always been at war with Eastasia, right?

I had a concept for a magical 'desktop PC' used by necromancers to store spells and research.  Very creepy, as the souls inside would beg for release on the 'screen' (actually a section of parchment) if they realized someone was at the keyboard and wasn't the necromancer in question.

But yeah, this looks silly.

:confused: Combat Wheelchair. :eek: I have suddenly realized my RPG life has been incomplete without... :D Jousting Palanquins! /rushes off to find my 'Complete Handbook: Fighters' for jousting tournament rules

Quote from: Opaopajr;1139459:confused: Combat Wheelchair. :eek: I have suddenly realized my RPG life has been incomplete without... :D Jousting Palanquins! /rushes off to find my 'Complete Handbook: Fighters' for jousting tournament rules

At one time I remember hearing about 'Roman-X' motorized chariot races.

But I just had a brainwave: how many people here have been in a group with some form of disabled player? Any disability? I had one who had serious vision issues. We had to print him up some specialty character sheets and we got him some larger dice to roll with. No biggie.

He didn't want to play as a blind guy, surprise surprise. Now, how many people in wheelchairs are going to want to play a character in a wheelchair?

I am reminded, oddly, of a heartfelt letter to Dragon Magazine back in the 80's. The writer spoke of a friend of his who had suffered severe medical issues, but thanks to D&D, was able to fight, run, cast spells, and live (at least vicariously) through their character. Who'd want to roleplay being so severely ill that just living is an adventure with brutal skill checks to boot?

If you've got the magic for a magic wheel chair why not just levitate around?  I could see a gnome adventurer with a mechanical wheel chair as a gizmo.  I did have a player put his character in a wheel chair for laughs earlier this year, it was pretty annoying.

Quote from: yancy;1139441The combat wheelchair seems more like something you'd stick some gimmicky NPC with, for a single combat, than anything a player character in a D&D campaign would want to put up with.

In fact, it seems more like something suited to a superhero game with point generated characters rather than D&D. Granted, I've never read 5th edition D&D (or 3rd, other than through video games, or 4th, other than discussions I cringed at participating at). Is 5th edition D&D like Champions or something, can you minmax your character by putting all your points into your wheelchair?

LOL, "Bad Medicine For Dr. Drugs" was a supers campaign set in high school.    It had a worse than Clark Kent's glasses absurdness.  The default team of secret heroes were kids in the school.  One kid was wheelchair bound, and when the heroes showed up, one of the superheroes rode a souped up wheelchair.  It was such a subtle and obscure item that I am sure nobody ever figured it out.

Quote from: Crawford Tillinghast;1139476LOL, "Bad Medicine For Dr. Drugs" was a supers campaign set in high school.    It had a worse than Clark Kent's glasses absurdness.  The default team of secret heroes were kids in the school.  One kid was wheelchair bound, and when the heroes showed up, one of the superheroes rode a souped up wheelchair.  It was such a subtle and obscure item that I am sure nobody ever figured it out.

There's an in-universe movie in the Battletech setting where the fictionalized head of the Draconis Combine's Internal Security Force (their secret police) has a wheelchair that turns into a suit of powered armor. The actual head of the ISF even makes fun of it and lampshades it (right before he uses a hidden mini-SRM launcher to cause a blowout on a spaceship that kills the ringleaders of an attempted coup against the Coordinator. Badass).

Quote from: Marchand;1139419While reading about D&D's Combat Wheelchair (https://www.geeknative.com/74527/dd-gets-a-combat-wheelchair/), this caught my eye:

"Views on disability in the RPG space are slowly changing. WotC has made edits to the text of Curse of Strahd on D&D Beyond to remove mentions of NPC being ashamed of her disability."

In its tiny way, this is some "cropping out Trotsky from the old politburo photo", Orwell Ministry of Truth level shit.

I now actually find the trigger warning on WotC content on drivethru etc. to be reassuring; it means it's less likely they will go through and retroactively edit historic material to make it compliant. Not that I would consider that very likely anyway, as they are a commercial operation and presumably would not find it profitable to do so.

As for the wheelchair... ok, hope there are no stairs in the dungeon. That said it has magic in the arms (so you can make it go without spinning the wheels), so maybe it can just float up the stairs, like new Daleks.

More generally, I don't know any disabled gamers, but generally the attitude among disabled people I know is they want to get on with their lives with the disability being as small a thing as possible. If any of these folks decided to play D&D, I imagine the last thing they would want is to have the "combat wheelchair" option shoved in their faces. Would this kind of thing not just make people more self-conscious and therefore uncomfortable?

So a shittier but permanent version of Tenser's Floating Disk?

Okay, lets make a version that doesn't suck, it needs to give the PC advantages over having his legs restored or having magical prosthetics done:

Tenser's Mobility Disk:

The Wizard spells a small metal disk (the size of a coin) that the PC must carry with him for the Disk to manifest itself, the disk has no real time limit but it does grow flimsy if used continuously for more than 24hrs.

It operates like a flying carpet but can't fly, only hoover 3 feet above a surface (Including liquids), it has a base speed of 10 and a run speed of 20. Carry 500 pounds minus the PC's weight.

When finding a stair it can use each step as solid surface, not true with ladders or ropes, but the PC can be pulled up by his team mates with little to no effort since it cuts the weight by half.

Tenser's Mobility Disk, unlike Tenser's Floating Disk, can't be separated from it's owner.

Quote from: GeekyBugle;1139488So a shittier but permanent version of Tenser's Floating Disk?

Okay, lets make a version that doesn't suck, it needs to give the PC advantages over having his legs restored or having magical prosthetics done:

Tenser's Mobility Disk:

The Wizard spells a small metal disk (the size of a coin) that the PC must carry with him for the Disk to manifest itself, the disk has no real time limit but it does grow flimsy if used continuously for more than 24hrs.

It operates like a flying carpet but can't fly, only hoover 3 feet above a surface (Including liquids), it has a base speed of 10 and a run speed of 20. Carry 500 pounds minus the PC's weight.

When finding a stair it can use each step as solid surface, not true with ladders or ropes, but the PC can be pulled up by his team mates with little to no effort since it cuts the weight by half.

Tenser's Mobility Disk, unlike Tenser's Floating Disk, can't be separated from it's owner.

I don't remember specifics, but in the Joel Rosenberg Guardians of the flame series, the players get transferred into their characters bodies and the guy who plays the dwarf happened to have cerebral palsy or something similar. While the rest of the party wanted to get back to the real world he was going to help him but there was no damn way he was going back.

I am not disabled, but I find this shit offencive to logic and misguided at best.

Well don't go staking this in the ground as the low-point. Someone will go yet further... something more ludicrous. But this was pretty low (i.e. stupid).

Quote from: LiferGamer;1139539I don't remember specifics, but in the Joel Rosenberg Guardians of the flame series, the players get transferred into their characters bodies and the guy who plays the dwarf happened to have cerebral palsy or something similar. While the rest of the party wanted to get back to the real world he was going to help him but there was no damn way he was going back.

I am not disabled, but I find this shit offencive to logic and misguided at best.

Ever read 'Call Me Joe' by Poul Anderson? Link here (https://www.baen.com/Chapters/9781625791085/9781625791085___2.htm).

I have deep suspicions as to who's pushing this 'disabled activism' and if they're actually, y'know, disabled or crippled in some way. It used to be 'no, they're not disabled or crippled, just differently abled!', now it's 'BEHOLD MY DISABILITY HEAR IT ROAR' or some such.

Why wouldn't you just go to a cleric for a Restoration spell.

Quote from: bryce0lynch;1139445Leaving aside the actual issues (should mainline RPG's from a mega-corp deal with sensitive issues or just skim the surface in order to build the brand in to something we can license for movie deals ...), there are multiple ways a disability could work.

First, it's a world where fireballs shoot elves from their butts, which, I must admit, is a great response to every argument involving realism.

Second, the genre has changed. In a more traditional exploration based game then yes, absolutely, it may be hard to fit in. But in the modern "investigate & arrest"  genre it could totally work. You have your SWAT team party members and your social ones and your smarty ones. When it comes time to hit the warehouse then some members hang back. This would follow the traditional beats of network Tv shows. I could argue that it's actually in the same vein as Detect spells in modern D&D: they are too low level for the game actually being played at the table these days; this is just another ack that some parts of the rules/genre don't fit the modern game.

Sure yeah, Wheelchair SWAT, kinda like this!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxtzJAbJ_yM

Quote from: thedungeondelver;1139552Why wouldn't you just go to a cleric for a Restoration spell.

Because Restoration spells are ableist and demeaning, you exclusionary bigot! :p

Quote from: VisionStorm;1139558Because Restoration spells are ableist and demeaning, you exclusionary bigot! :p

beat me to the punch.

You know... it's pointing things like this that should, if logic had any meaning among these morons, cause them to deconstruct the very idea of "magic" as the very force of the Ableist Demonlord that exists only in their imaginations.

I just realized Animate Object is in 5E.

Nothing says you can't animate the wheelchair to roll and stop on command, y'know.

Again. This is silly in any setting other than a low-magic one.

Quote from: tenbones;1139540Well don't go staking this in the ground as the low-point. Someone will go yet further... something more ludicrous. But this was pretty low (i.e. stupid).

O/U on how many months until they're asking to include people in comas.

I smell sexual fetish underneath the obvious virtue signalling. Before you scoff, look it up. There's a whole world of sexual fetish for various disabilities and amputations.

Consider the freakfest that 5e draws as fans, I wouldn't be surprised.

Quote from: TJS;1139438or don't view the world through the lens of a 21st century college educated American.

The 21st century college indoctrinated American'ts.

Quote from: Opaopajr;1139459B]Jousting Palanquins![/B]

I worked on a Jousting Palanquin card game a few years ago. It was going to be Car Wars Fantasy, but I never could get the mechanics where I was happy with gameplay. Maybe need to revisit that.

Quote from: Brad;1139567O/U on how many months until they're asking to include people in comas.

Ok you asked for it.....

,people,

(Sorry horrible joke, but I just couldn't resist)

Quote from: Brad;1139567O/U on how many months until they're asking to include people in comas.

I'll go long and give it at least 12. Because think of all the other possibilities that exist between here and there! So many outrages to choose from! So many problematic issues to resolve!

Quote from: tenbones;1139540Well don't go staking this in the ground as the low-point. Someone will go yet further... something more ludicrous. But this was pretty low (i.e. stupid).

It doesn't fill me with confidence that this was written by a paid Consultant/Sensitivity reader who works for R. Talsorian Games either.

Quote from: LiferGamer;1139539I don't remember specifics, but in the Joel Rosenberg Guardians of the flame series, the players get transferred into their characters bodies and the guy who plays the dwarf happened to have cerebral palsy or something similar. While the rest of the party wanted to get back to the real world he was going to help him but there was no damn way he was going back.

I am not disabled, but I find this shit offencive to logic and misguided at best.

Well, I live in constant pain due to 2 herniated lumbar disks.  It's nothing compared to Cerebral Palsy and if you gave me the option to live as one of my Dwarf PCs, I'd be tempted.

Quote from: CRKrueger;1139601It doesn't fill me with confidence that this was written by a paid Consultant/Sensitivity reader who works for R. Talsorian Games either.

Oh fuck! Not R. Talsorian Games too!

As others have pointed out in the thread, this could make an interesting NPC, could be a handy gadget if for example, your Regeneration spell takes a while to finish, or maybe in a points based mystery/urban game if you want to pull a Nero Wolfe (or more appropriately Garret PI and the Dead Man), maybe.

You damn sure aren't going in any Dungeons or fighting any Dragons.

If the art had at least shown a spellcaster, it would be slightly less ridiculous.  I think even the non-HEMA/Martial Artist etc. etc. types can agree that melee is reliant on footwork, leverage and reach.

What The Fuck?
Are They going Nuts?

- Ed C

Quote from: Koltar;1139623What The Fuck?
Are They going Nuts?

- Ed C

Yes.

Quote from: GeekyBugle;1139615Oh fuck! Not R. Talsorian Games too!

Get ready for cyber-wheelchairs and computerized area readers that tell blind people what's going on around them. Cuz replacement parts are ableist exclusionary shit, and have no place in our games, or anywhere else!

Greetings!

*sigh* In a world of magic, such as D&D, why would anyone bother with a wheelchair? Why wouldn't the DM just have a local mage craft a set of magical legs for the disbled character--and whalaa--problem solved, with no drama required.

Mechanically, I can't imagine very many adventuring groups chomping at the bit to bring along a *physically disabled* character as they seek to dive into dungeons and ruins. The suggestion is just fucking stupid.

Marine Infantry squads and Navy Seal squads don't bring disabled people along on their missions.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: Bradford C. Walker;1139431I'm insulted. I am in a wheelchair now, and there's no fucking way cripples go adventuring without somehow having value (and no, your standard D&D PC ain't it, chief) far in excess of the sheer stupidity that (literally, at times) dragging a living boat anchor can be. This bitch is pissing in my face and saying that it's raining. Fuck her "Muh Representayshuns" bullshit.

Theres an older thread where this was discussed at length.

My take on it is that the idea of the character isnt bad. Its the damn wheelchair thats both impractical, and just damn not very imaginative.
There are so many many ways you could do that character right.

What bugs me is that WOTC and others are now relegating us disabled people to yet another check box on their "diversity" checklist. Rather than you know, treating us as human beings. They will reduce us to trophies just like every other "other".

Quote from: Opaopajr;1139459:confused: Combat Wheelchair. :eek: I have suddenly realized my RPG life has been incomplete without... :D Jousting Palanquins! /rushes off to find my 'Complete Handbook: Fighters' for jousting tournament rules

Theres an old martial arts movie where the heroes have to battle the villain whos on a palanquin of death.

Quote from: VisionStorm;1139636Get ready for cyber-wheelchairs and computerized area readers that tell blind people what's going on around them. Cuz replacement parts are ableist exclusionary shit, and have no place in our games, or anywhere else!

ISTR some diversity-type character tried to shake down R Tal (i.e. tried to tell him, hire me or I will trash your reputation), but Mike Pondsmith told them to eff off. Maybe the story didn't end there.

Memory check failed but I thought some cyberpunk game designer (may or may not have been R Tal) copped flak for the whole too-much-cyberwear-makes-you-insane thing, with somebody trying to make out that was anti-disabled.

**

Obviously, there is a lot of fun to be had in pointing at the combat wheelchair and listing the many, many ways it fails as a concept.

Does nobody else think WotC rewriting the book to order was the scary part? Or are we all just taking that kind of thing in our strides (or wheelspins) these days?

Quote from: Omega;1139654What bugs me is that WOTC and others are now relegating us disabled people to yet another check box on their "diversity" checklist. Rather than you know, treating us as human beings. They will reduce us to trophies just like every other "other".

You want to be treated like a human being, and addressed as an individual, not merely a single characteristic?

(https://static.abplive.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/24075711/Capture.jpg)

Quote from: Ghostmaker;1139543Ever read 'Call Me Joe' by Poul Anderson? Link here (https://www.baen.com/Chapters/9781625791085/9781625791085___2.htm).

I have deep suspicions as to who's pushing this 'disabled activism' and if they're actually, y'know, disabled or crippled in some way. It used to be 'no, they're not disabled or crippled, just differently abled!', now it's 'BEHOLD MY DISABILITY HEAR IT ROAR' or some such.

Its the same marxist/sjw infiltrators. Theyve been playing the "this word that describes you is really a slur and you are oppressed!" gag for a while now and converted a few disabled to the glorious cause. Same damn pattern as in the 90s. Just with new buzzwords and better brainwashing techniques.

Once this BLM disaster plays out they will move on to the disabled to rally them to war. Or the hispanics, or whomever else they can sucker into being meat shields for them.

Quote from: Ghostmaker;1139564I just realized Animate Object is in 5E.

Nothing says you can't animate the wheelchair to roll and stop on command, y'know.

Again. This is silly in any setting other than a low-magic one.

Animate object has a limited duration. But its been discussed before as a way to do it.

But one better is essentially an animated table or carved statue for a centaur-like lower body. Now you have something with legs that CAN negotiate stairs and other obstacles. Or even a bipedal conveyance.

This is what I mean when I point out that a basic non-magcal wheelchair is not very imaginative or practical for delving.

Quote from: Brad;1139567O/U on how many months until they're asking to include people in comas.

eeeh, techically Orpheus has that allready way back in 2005. You can play a character whos put in a near death suspended animation coma. Theres certain advantages to it over those who can disembody at will. Like no catastrophic sympathetic damage and can stay ghosty for possibly months.

Quote from: VisionStorm;1139636Get ready for cyber-wheelchairs and computerized area readers that tell blind people what's going on around them. Cuz replacement parts are ableist exclusionary shit, and have no place in our games, or anywhere else!

Unfortunately theres a loony fringe thats been preaching this to us for a long long time. And I'd lay damn good odds that they either arent seriously disabled. Or more likely. Arent disabled at all. Because no one actually disabled (and sane) thinks that staying disabled if there was a cure is a good thing. So again its these damn SJW cultists speaking for us and causing trouble for us.

Quote from: SHARK;1139641Mechanically, I can't imagine very many adventuring groups chomping at the bit to bring along a *physically disabled* character as they seek to dive into dungeons and ruins. The suggestion is just fucking stupid.

Marine Infantry squads and Navy Seal squads don't bring disabled people along on their missions.

Semper Fidelis,

1: It was an option in my own RPG. But only one player ever took it that Im aware of. That player was themselves disabled I believe and their character had various magical workarounds to their problem.

As for why bring a disabled person along on an adventure? Why not? No... really in D&D theres alot more workarounds than in the real world. And like Gamma World theres alot of things that can potentially leave a character crippled for life in one way or another. A mundane wheelchair is not one of those things you use. Thats the problem. See the other thread on this, sparked by the exact same art piece.

But one reason to bring such a person along is simple necessity. The only healer cant walk. Or is blind. Etc. It can be an interesting aspect. But it can also be a total mess if no one has any idea what they are doing in or out of character. But thats true for anything really.

2: Yet. At the rate things are getting stupider. We may well see it. Prosthetics though are gradually catching up.

3: ad nausium on this ongoing virtue signalling stupid.

Quote from: Omega;1139674Animate object has a limited duration. But its been discussed before as a way to do it.

But one better is essentially an animated table or carved statue for a centaur-like lower body. Now you have something with legs that CAN negotiate stairs and other obstacles. Or even a bipedal conveyance.

This is what I mean when I point out that a basic non-magcal wheelchair is not very imaginative or practical for delving.

In 5E, yes. In PF/3E it can be the target of a permanency spell. There was some speculation on forums as to how to houserule in permanency effects. So yeah, it's not without precedent.

You're not wrong about the legs thing. Hell, there's a bad guy from the Ring of Winter series who got his hands chopped off, and they were replaced with magical stone hands that were pretty nifty (+2 to unarmed combat damage, 18/00 Strength if trying to crush anything he can grasp, such as keys, jewelry, or limbs).

This is stupid, and whoever came up with it should feel bad.

Shogun Assassin Baby Cart!!!!

I have actually had folks in wheelchairs play in my games, the last being at GaryCon a couple years back. Interestingly they had zero interest in playing a disabled character and in fact picked perfectly healthy characters in order to play Spycraft, and D&D with. We had a great time with our fantasy adventures. Because RPG games are all about  simple escapism for some, forgetting the sad present reality, and exchanging that for some better fantastic era instead. I suppose D&D, and RPGs could actually be therapeutic in this regard.

Not sure why WOTC would think that including wheelchairs would be in any way, therapeutic?

Quote from: GameDaddy;1139731Not sure why WOTC would think that including wheelchairs would be in any way, therapeutic?

   Again, this isn't WotC--this is from the Patreon of a writer "who specialises in disability and chronic illness representation." Apparently, she's also the person who talked WotC into editing Curse of Strahd, judging from the interview linked in the linked article. (I'm afraid to go too much farther down the rabbit hole. :) )

Quote from: Ghostmaker;1139462At one time I remember hearing about 'Roman-X' motorized chariot races.

Quote from: Spinachcat;1139571I worked on a Jousting Palanquin card game a few years ago. It was going to be Car Wars Fantasy, but I never could get the mechanics where I was happy with gameplay. Maybe need to revisit that.

Quote from: Omega;1139655Theres an old martial arts movie where the heroes have to battle the villain whos on a palanquin of death.

I am obviously very late to a quite awesome party! :eek: Yeeeeessssss! :cool: I can feel the madness, er, inspiration! flow through me.

Quote from: tenbones;1139715Shogun Assassin Baby Cart!!!!

:eek: Yes, exactly, just like that! :D

Quote from: Omega;1139675eeeh, techically Orpheus has that allready way back in 2005. You can play a character whos put in a near death suspended animation coma. Theres certain advantages to it over those who can disembody at will. Like no catastrophic sympathetic damage and can stay ghosty for possibly months.

Learn something new every day I guess...

Quote from: Ghostmaker;1139708This is stupid, and whoever came up with it should feel bad.

If the claims are true then the art piece was by a handicapped artist. I'm going to assume they either just did not think it through. Or the character is actually supposed to be a guard or watch which would make ALOT more sense than an adventurer.

Quote from: Brad;1139773Learn something new every day I guess...

Orpheus is a fun little take on ghostbusting and clandestine operations where the PCs are either able to disembody into ghosts, or in a few rare instances, are ghosts themselves. The literal last hurrah of White Wolf before effectively going tits up. Reverse Wraith?