Quote from: Abyssal MawWe play on Thursdays, and the time is usally 7:30-10:30. I'll send you more details the closer I get to the start date for the new game.

Welllll ... as you might guess from the subject here, I'm not so much looking to join a long-running campaign.  Even if I did live that close to Bal'mre, I don't really sign on for the long-haul any more.  When you've got some single-evening event, gimme a holler, though!  It'd be great to meet and get some gaming in.

Tony,

Take the opportunity.  I'd play with AM and his group in a heartbeat.  That's how desperate I am!

Play for the first level - probably a few weeks worth.  Maybe AM can even work it into the idea, who knows?  But at least then you'll be familiar enough with low level play that you could easily handle a one-shot for your friends...

Just a thought,
Jim

Well, we do arrange for 1 offs for Living Greyhawk, so that's a possibility. And we're all starting anew because of the Ruins arc.

Quote from: Abyssal MawWell, we do arrange for 1 offs for Living Greyhawk, so that's a possibility. And we're all starting anew because of the Ruins arc.

Perfecto!  Please keep me in mind, thanks.

Sett! Calm down, please!

Tony, there's just one thing I want to add to this, seeing as I'm just about as 3.x illiterate as you are. Nevertheless I think I have some insight into dungeons. I've read a report of people "trying out [Basic] D&D" as a one-shot in which they basically ran headlong through the dungeon, fighting everything, dying, and then just rolling up new characters. In other words, playing brainlessly.

If you play the game half-assed, it's going to suck. (That might be less true for 3.x since I gather the combats themselves have a nice crunchy tactical quality at the individual level which the older versions didn't.) Dungeon-crawling is at least as much about exploration and strategizing as it is about hacking. If you don't give a damn about your character and you don't worry about what might be around the next corner, instead just blundering ahead, it's going to be dull and pointless. (Though, again, the crunchiness of 3.x might at least turn the experience into a bunch of FPS-like setpieces.)

Elliot:  I'm right with you.  I played basic and AD&D for years, as have all my fellow players.  It isn't the concept of D&D that I worry about us having trouble with, it's getting back into the swing of the rules.

EDIT:  So ... damn fine advice which, I hope, we've already got well drilled into us by past experience.

Two pieces of advice:

Write out things like how grapples and trips work in a list on an index card. This speeds things up drastically, because it means that instead of having to open the book and look it up, you can just consult the card. Do the same thing with spells if possible. You want to know range, components, effect, etc. Write them out beforehand for most of the spells you think the PCs will know, and then deal them out as needed. That way, PCs end up with a deck of cards that they can throw down effects from. It makes things much faster and easier.

Also, don't sweat Attacks of Opportunity. They're the most difficult mechanic of 3.5 to learn. Coast past them if you can't remember, or photocopy / print off the chart from the PHB/SRD.

Quote from: PseudoephedrineTwo pieces of advice:

Write out things like how grapples and trips work in a list on an index card. This speeds things up drastically, because it means that instead of having to open the book and look it up, you can just consult the card. Do the same thing with spells if possible. You want to know range, components, effect, etc. Write them out beforehand for most of the spells you think the PCs will know, and then deal them out as needed. That way, PCs end up with a deck of cards that they can throw down effects from. It makes things much faster and easier.

Also, don't sweat Attacks of Opportunity. They're the most difficult mechanic of 3.5 to learn. Coast past them if you can't remember, or photocopy / print off the chart from the PHB/SRD.

while there are a few bits on the chart for AoO's that might seem odd, by and large you can pretty well spot rule them with just this common sense rule:  Take an AoO anytime you commit an action that amounts to letting your guard down, or try and move past or near an opponent.

It really isn't sizably different from the zone of control mechanics of most wargames, if you're using a map board.  Basically, if you let your guard down or move into or out of the squares surrounding an opponent, you take an AoO.  

There are some odd specific applications of AoO's as described on the chart, but they're comfortably ignored really, and in some cases I think following this common sense guideline produces results more comfortably in the spirit of the concept.

I am not however comfortable generally with axing them altogether, because they form one of the cornerstones of the game's tactics.

The main mitigating factor in judging AoO's is the collaborative sieve.

That is to say: AoO's aren't actually a "judgement call". There are plain old rules for them. So does that mean you have to be an expert on them?

No, as long as anyone else at the table is an expert. Or the expertise is shared out amongst multiple players, as it nearly always is.

Something like this nearly always happens:

Player A: "I move here (indicates square).. and then I cast.."
Player B: "Is that through the Ogre's threat zone?"
Player C: "Nope, not if he does it this way. (demonstrates alternate route) ..But the casting will provoke"
Player D: "You could use your wand. Wands don't provoke.."
Player A: "Yeah, I'll use the wand. Thanks. Ok, move there, drawing wand and firing scorching rays. Point Blank shot feat applies, right?"
GM: "Yeah. Point Blank gives you a +1. Are you guys done yet?"


See, you can have entire rules adjudications with absolutely no involvement from the GM.

Yeap. But if it's a single session with folks who aren't super familiar with 3.5, no one's going to have that expertise. That's what Tony's planning for, if I understand him.

In that case, photocopy the chart, check it whenever you think you need to, and let people do take-backs if they provoke one without realising it during their action.

You guys are overcautious. He´ll have four fights, with two skeletons a Bugbear Zombie, a Spider and a critter I forgot.
There´ll be not many AoOs.

Stay smooth.

Quote from: SettembriniYou guys are overcautious. He´ll have four fights, with two skeletons a Bugbear Zombie, a Spider and a critter I forgot.
There´ll be not many AoOs.

Stay smooth.

ha!  now you've doomed him to nothing but AoO's in those combats.  the characters are all whirling dervishes, you see, and wish to literally run circles around their opponents!  dance-tactics away, fetch the "AoO? yes/no" chart.

Here's some contrarian advice.

1a. Don't run a pure hack-and-slash game for a one-shot.  That's just dull, because as people pointed out, beginners don't have a good sense of strategy, and low-level characters don't have very many options.  So fights, while exciting, are fairly mindless.  I'd prefer a long investigation/exploration, broken up by skirmishes, with a short but dramatic fight at the end.  
1b.  Let them use their skills.  It's fun and easy.  
2.  Use slightly higher than first-level characters.  2nd level characters are only slightly more complex than first-level, and have more staying power.   In a one-shot, you don't want to be spending all your time resting and recovering spells and hit points.
3.  I'd recommend not allowing bards, monks, or druids. Druids are too complicated, since they have an animal companion and summon. I think monks in a Western fantasy game are stupid, and would usually disallow them out of aesthetics.  But they also disarm and grapple, a bad thing for a beginners game.   Bards are too difficult to make non-wimpy.  Barbarians, fighters, paladins,  rangers, rogues, and sorcerors are pretty straight-forward at low levels.  Wizards are OK, if you don't try to optimize them.  (Give the wizard a small collection of scrolls to start out, to avoid the resting and recovering biz.  This replaces the masterwork weapon that everyone else has.) Clerics are over-complicated, but a cleric is necessary if you want to avoid resting and recovering every fight.  Make a simple, pre-gen cleric.
4a. Pick feats for pre-gen characters that simply add numbers, rather than giving options.
For example, weapon focus, improved initiative, lightning reflexes, spell focus, point blank shot.  These just change precomputed numbers on the character sheet.  They aren't a waste, but don't add another rule to learn.
 4b..  Pick simple spells for pre-gen characters.  Wizards and sorcerors will only need to
cast the spells on their character sheets.  So keep the spells simple.  Shield, mage armor, magic missile, sleep, ray of enfeeblement, color spray, silent image, and expeditious retreat are all pretty effective and simple to use.  OK, charm person and enlarge person are more effective.  But they require you to recompute things or keep track of an NPC.  So these characters don't know those spells.   Clerics choose their spells from the cleric list, but put suggestions for simple spells. Give them simple domains, like Healing and Protection.  Most of their spell slots will be used to Cure Light Wounds in the end, anyway.  
5.  If you follow the guidelines above, and don't have the characters attacked by
bears, wolves or assassin vines, you'll never have anyone trip, sunder or grapple anyone or anything. That's good.  
5.  DO USE ATTACKS OF OPPORTUNITY.  For low-level games, AoO are really what strategy is about, and they aren't hard to learn.  You don't need minis, either.   Whenever a character goes by a monster (or vice versa), runs up to or away from a big monster, or does something within reach of a monster that doesn't involve keeping a defensive posture, the opponent gets an attack of opportunity.  If they aren't surrounded or cornered, they can move or  take a 5' step first to avoid this attack.   Spell-casters  can also choose to cast defensively to avoid their due AoO, with a concentration check of  15+spell level.  At level 2, they might have a +6 in concentration, needing a 16, making it 50/50, usually not worth it.  With combat casting or spell focus (concentration), it becomes a viable strategy.  If they fail, they lose the spell, but still avoid the attack.   (Remember, no one is EVER grappling, disarming, tripping, or sundering...EVER!  This avoids the non-intuitive AoO rules.)

That's my advice, and I've basically followed it successfully in the past.  I've run games with four beginner adults or two beginner children with no problems.  I wasn't a novice, but I'm also not a rules freak either.  In my games with experienced players, I let the most knowledgeable players tell me what the rules are.